International Zelensky Rejects Trump's Idiotic "Minerals Deal" - Might Tell The US to go F*ck Itself

[brothir]

They will always be negotiating from a position of weakness, so why prolong the suffering?

Because there will be more suffering under Putin's tyranny.

 

[Patrick Jane]

Trump should just buy Ukraine.

 

[Snubnoze707]

Because there will be more suffering under Putin's tyranny.

The territories Ukraine will be giving up were being continually shelled by Ukraine prior to this war. There will be substantially less suffering when not in a war conflict, that's not even debatable.

 

[Islam Imamate]

It's sort of difficult to deal with the U.S. presently because you know they'll renege all their deals and change their foreign policy direction every 4 years.

Trump needs to somehow convince the world that his direction will stay for the long term, and that we won't see another pendulum swing which causes the next U.S. government to undo everything Trump has accomplished.

I think most of our allies would prefer the opposite.

 

[brothir]

The territories Ukraine will be giving up were being continually shelled by Ukraine prior to this war. There will be substantially less suffering when not in a war conflict, that's not even debatable.

Which assumes Putin would only take those, and not impose more demands, nor just invade again at some point later.

 

[F1980]

Ukrainians are very mad at Americans right now

 

[Badr Hari]

Because there will be more suffering under Putin's tyranny.

Don't offend the useful idiots with such a description of Putin. They pretend to care about the suffering when they have supported the side which has caused the suffering since Feb 24th 2022, the accounts are old enough to be recognized

 

[Hog-train]

I believe thats what the mineral deal was intended to do, along with paying us back for our help. But you think Zelensky should tell us to fuck ourselves.

I hope Europe ramps up enough military capability where Ukraine can afford to not need the US. And not get taken advantage of.

 

[Gamer2k4]

It's disingenuous to imply these are just cash giveaways to Ukraine. One of the largest lines listed there $20B explicitly states it's a loan.

The majority is paid to domestic entities to procure supplies. So really it's money paid to ourselves and then supplies go to Ukraine.

I didn't say they were all cash giveaways. I was responding to you saying that "it wasn't cash" and "it was all older equipment."

 

[AWilder]

The territories Ukraine will be giving up were being continually shelled by Ukraine prior to this war. There will be substantially less suffering when not in a war conflict, that's not even debatable.

Ukraine was fighting Russians in those territories lol. Russia invaded in 2014. Ukraine and Russia (or as russia likes to call them "separatists") have been fighting in those territories ever since. That's not even debatable.

 

[Snubnoze707]

Which assumes Putin would only take those, and not impose more demands, nor just invade again at some point later.

He's already invading, so this whole "we shouldn't stop the war because he'll invade!" argument is retarded. He has zero leverage to make demands for territories his military was unable to attain, and he knows that.

 

[F1980]

Ukraine was fighting Russians in those territories lol. Russia invaded in 2014. Ukraine and Russia (or as russia likes to call them "separatists") have been fighting in those territories ever since. That's not even debatable.

West and East Ukraine was in a war in 2014. West Ukraine committed atrocities against the ethnic Russians living in Eastern Ukraine. In fact, the internet was overwhelmingly supporting Eastern Ukrainians back then. Look up the threads in the forum back in 2014 and see all the carnage Ukraine caused by shelling the Donbass region.

 

[brothir]

He's already invading, so this whole "we shouldn't stop the war because he'll invade!" argument is retarded. He has zero leverage to make demands for territories his military was unable to attain, and he knows that.

Your second sentence works against the first: if he has such little leverage, then it's strategically better to keep pushing against him.

 

[Cajun]

No doubt? Got any receipts?

It was a known thing before the war even started. Its not a secret. It isn't something I would use to justify the Russians but there's plenty of stuff everywhere.

 

[brothir]

West and East Ukraine was in a war in 2014. West Ukraine committed atrocities against the ethnic Russians living in Eastern Ukraine. In fact, the internet was overwhelmingly supporting Eastern Ukrainians back then. Look up the threads in the forum back in 2014 and see all the carnage Ukraine caused by shelling the Donbass region.

Cool fan fiction. Russia's invasion was actually largely condemned, although there are worthless people who supported Putin both then and now.

 

[Rational Poster]

I didn't say they were all cash giveaways. I was responding to you saying that "it wasn't cash" and "it was all older equipment."

The overwhelming majority is old equipment, and what money was spent it was almost all on domestic procurement that actually benefits American businesses.

The overwhelming monetary assistance is from the EU and IMF, plus the housing of refugees.

 

[F1980]

Cool fan fiction. Russia's invasion was actually largely condemned, although there are worthless people who supported Putin both then and now.

Russia didn't invade Ukraine in 2014. They supported Eastern Ukrainians with weapons and training

This is a reupload of a video that went viral in 2014 all over the internet. Back then the internet was overwhelmingly supporting "Novorossiya" Eastern Ukraine that wanted to be a part of Russia instead of Ukraine

 

[Rational Poster]

It was a known thing before the war even started. Its not a secret. It isn't something I would use to justify the Russians but there's plenty of stuff everywhere.

The Russians invaded because Ukraine was trying to reform and improve the corruption situation and makes steps to join the EU.

Ukrainian corruption is essentially Russian influence.

 

[Snubnoze707]

Your second sentence works against the first: if he has such little leverage, then it's strategically better to keep pushing against him.

No it doesn't. He has leverage for the territories that he DID attain militarily. Territories that already wanted to break away from Ukraine before the invasion even began.

 

[brothir]

It was a known thing before the war even started. Its not a secret. It isn't something I would use to justify the Russians but there's plenty of stuff everywhere.

Eastern European countries generally struggle with corruption. It's just not a meaningful point in this context. Ukraine and (especially) Russia are both corrupt, so they should invade each other? It's the flimsiest excuse pro-Putin shills use to deflect from Putin's responsibility in launching the worst invasion since Hitler and Stalin invaded Poland.