Yale students call for "decolonization" of literary studies

[CableandThanos]

Sounds good to me. Chaucer sucked. Poetry should be omitted altogether. If you're going to college for literature then maybe that's what needs reevaluated.

Why the fuck would someone go to Yale for a lit degree?

Thats just fuckun stupid.

 

[King of Fists]

I don't see the problem.

Milton, Chaucer, et al. are all boring AF, why exactly should that be some literary standard they study? The reasoning behind not studying them is meh, but the end result is good.

 

[Space]

I don't see the problem.

Milton, Chaucer, et al. are all boring AF, why exactly should that be some literary standard they study? The reasoning behind not studying them is meh, but the end result is good.

Plato and Aristotle are "boring AF" too, but if you study Greek literature you'd have to read them.

That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

 

[HOLA]

I don't see the problem.

Milton, Chaucer, et al. are all boring AF, why exactly should that be some literary standard they study? The reasoning behind not studying them is meh, but the end result is good.

So which 16th century poet should Milton be replaced with? R.L. Stine?

I sometimes question why some works become standards in curriculums, particularly some 20th century pieces- but when your're in a course that is going over the history of English poetry, your options are fairly limited when going back 300, 400 years ago.

Literary influence and impact is of a concern, not necessarily how entertaining one finds it. I liked Milton, but Canterbury Tales bored me to death at times.

 

[Hard To Tell]

"Ok students! We've heard your complaints! Shakespeare is out! Dr. Dre is in! "

Bitches ain't shit but hoes and tricks
Lick on these nuts and suck the dick
Get the fuck out after you're done
I hops in my ride to make a quick run

This is why it makes me laugh when people try to pass off rap and hip hip lyrics as a legit form of poetry on par with the likes of Shakespear, Milton, Eliot etc. It's moronic drivel that appeals to the hard of understanding.

 

[HOLA]

This is why it makes me laugh when people try to pass off rap and hip hip lyrics as a legit form of poetry on par with the likes of Shakespear, Milton, Eliot etc. It's moronic drivel that appeals to the hard of understanding.

It's just dirty Dr. Seuss lyrics.

 

[King of Fists]

So which 16th century poet should Milton be replaced with? R.L. Stine?

I sometimes question why some works become standards in curriculums, particularly some 20th century pieces- but when your're in a course that is going over the history of English poetry, your options are fairly limited when going back 300, 400 years ago.

Literary influence and impact is of a concern, not necessarily how entertaining one finds it. I liked Milton, but Canterbury Tales bored me to death at times.

Feel free to explain how a 16th century poet's inclusion in a curriculum for anything prepares a student to do more than enjoy the words of that 16th century author's work.

There's nothing special about Milton, or Chaucer (or as someone else mentioned, Aristotle) that is going to prepare you to do anything moderately useful with your life. Studying freaking JK Rowling would be far more useful to an aspiring writer's future success than studying Milton.

When I do math and write computer code, I use a modern computer, not an abacus.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Feel free to explain how a 16th century poet's inclusion in a curriculum for anything prepares a student to do more than enjoy the words of that 16th century author's work.

Other than getting into some chick's pants I got nothin'.

 

[lil billy]

Whiteness burning

Students are throwing “colonial” art on the pyre
Feb 20th 2016 | JOHANNESBURG | From the print edition

FIRST they came for the statues. Last year students in Cape Town sparked national protests by calling on the University of Cape Town (UCT) to remove a statue of Cecil Rhodes, a Victorian imperialist who, like most Englishmen of his time, held racist views. The statue was removed but students were still angry. Many marched on South Africa’s parliament to complain about high college fees, among other things. That prompted a cash-strapped government not to raise fees after all.

Protests about statues of dead racists soon spread around the world. Students demanded that Oriel College, Oxford take down its statue of Rhodes. (It refused.) The University of Texas at Austin has moved a bronze of Jefferson Davis, the Confederacy’s president, and will put it in a museum.

In this section

• Why would he stop now?
• Quantifying carnage
• The great candidate cull
• Whiteness burning
• No jam today

Reprints
Meanwhile, back in Cape Town, UCT students starting a new academic year after the long summer break were quick to resume protests, this time over gripes such as not having enough spaces in university dormitories. They stormed through the campus grabbing artworks and burning them. Most of the paintings they heaped on a bonfire were portraits of white historical figures. They were, declared one protester, “symbols of the coloniser”.

Another protester proudly posted pictures of the bonfire on Twitter, showing flames licking at the edges of a plaque commemorating Jan Smuts, a British-educated general who was twice South Africa’s prime minister and helped write the preamble to the UN’s founding charter. The tweet accompanying it proclaimed: “Whiteness is burning”.

Some of the art-burners might usefully have spent more time in the library studying South African history. Among the works they turned to ashes was a 1993 oil painting by a black anti-apartheid artist, Keresemose Richard Baholo. It was called “Extinguished Torch of Academic Freedom”, one of a series of paintings depicting protests at the university.

Students defaced a statue of Smuts and a bust of Maria Fuller, one of the first four women to attend the university. She enrolled in 1886, when most courses were open only to men. She went on to play a role in opening a women’s hall of residence. She was, however, white.

The protests are symptomatic of a resurgence of racial antagonism in South Africa, fanned by frustration over a slowing economy and high unemployment. More than two decades after apartheid ended black South Africans are still worse off than whites. Mostly, this is because they are less well educated, a result of apartheid’s legacy and the government’s failure to fix it. Bad education is a problem that starts long before students reach college.

Among the protesters’ complaints at UCT was the implausible claim that whites were given preferential access to university accommodation. The protesters erected a corrugated tin shack on UCT’s stately grounds as a symbol of how rough life is in black townships. They added a portable loo and overturned milk crates as chairs.

Some started a shisa nyama, grilling sausages and chops over charcoal. The flames spread. The small band of students refused to remove the shack, which university officials said was blocking traffic, and went on a rampage. They burned a car, a bus and the office of Max Price, the university’s vice-chancellor. “It is utterly regrettable that a movement that began with such promise and purport to be fighting for social justice matters has now deteriorated into a group that engages in criminality,” Mr Price said.

Little seems left of the lofty aims that prompted students to take to the streets last October, when they garnered widespread support for their argument that high tuition fees put a university education out of reach for black students from poor families. The shortage of housing at UCT is partly due to the success of those protests: enrolment has increased thanks to lower fees and measures to reduce student debt. Also, some university rooms are still occupied by students whose exams were delayed by last year’s protests.

Students arrested for damaging property at UCT included several who are not obviously poor, such as the son of the chief executive of Eskom, the state power utility. Other universities have seen violent protests, too, largely over fees and overcrowding. A student leader at Walter Sisulu University told the Daily Sun, a tabloid: “We’re going to destroy everything.”

 

[Devout Pessimist]

I don't see the problem.

Milton, Chaucer, et al. are all boring AF, why exactly should that be some literary standard they study? The reasoning behind not studying them is meh, but the end result is good.

Tragically for you, Harry Potter and The Hunger Games are not yet considered college level reading. Though, I am sure that day is coming.

 

[Devout Pessimist]

Whiteness burning

Students are throwing “colonial” art on the pyre
Feb 20th 2016 | JOHANNESBURG | From the print edition

Scum

 

[King of Fists]

Tragically for you, Harry Potter and The Hunger Games are not yet considered college level reading.

Why is that tragic for me? I have a computer science degree and enjoyed my college reading for my English classes .

 

[Devout Pessimist]

Why is that tragic for me? I have a computer science degree and enjoyed my college reading for my English classes .

I was implying that the highest reading level you have achieved is children's books like Harry Potter and Hunger Games. I was attempting to mock you.

 

[King of Fists]

I was implying that the highest reading level you have achieved is children's books like Harry Potter and Hunger Games. I was attempting to mock you.

I know. It was a rhetorical question there chief .

I was gently reminding you of the value of modern thinking by pointing out my computer science degree. I will more bluntly remind you this degree grants typical recipients an annual salary which easily eclipses that of all but the absolute best scholars of archaic writings, all while focusing on modern things.

 

[HOLA]

Feel free to explain how a 16th century poet's inclusion in a curriculum for anything prepares a student to do more than enjoy the words of that 16th century author's work.

There's nothing special about Milton, or Chaucer (or as someone else mentioned, Aristotle) that is going to prepare you to do anything moderately useful with your life. Studying freaking JK Rowling would be far more useful to an aspiring writer's future success than studying Milton.

When I do math and write computer code, I use a modern computer, not an abacus.

Alright, well, they're English majors. Studying the major works of English literature, what's had the most cultural impact in history, seems like an obvious choice when planning requirements. Doesn't it?

Or they can just read Game of Thrones. It's modern! People who are dead are obsolete, like computer code, they couldn't possibly have ideas, or styles to learn from. Superfulous!

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

And this is coming from one of the most venerable universities in the world.

These dumb kids are actually pleading for the destruction of the curriculum, in order to include lesser authors on the basis of colour, gender and sexual orientation.

If Yale gives in, it will really be sad.

 

[HOLA]

I know. It was a rhetorical question there chief .

I was gently reminding you of the value of modern thinking by pointing out my computer science degree. I will more bluntly remind you this degree grants typical recipients an annual salary which easily eclipses that of all but the absolute best scholars of archaic writings, all while focusing on modern things.

Some people do things for their own edification, without thought to monetary rewards.

Although if becoming a modern writer is your goal, like say a top selling current one like Khaled Hosseini who has some merit, I fail to see how a reading the classics won't enrich your mind. He's fond of 13th century Persian poetry, which many people are today. Rumi is still widely popular, even gets turned into songs by Madonna.

 

[King of Fists]

Alright, well, they're English majors. Studying the major works of English literature, what's had the most cultural impact in history, seems like an obvious choice when planning requirements. Doesn't it?

Or they can just read Game of Thrones. It's modern! People who are dead are obsolete, like computer code, they couldn't possibly have ideas, or styles to learn from. Superfulous!

How is the knowing about the cultural impact of a 16th century author more useful to someone than knowing about the cultural impact of more modern writers?

 

[in the]

Whiteness burning

Students are throwing “colonial” art on the pyre
Feb 20th 2016 | JOHANNESBURG | From the print edition

When I saw "decolonize" in the thread title, this is exactly what I thought of.

 

[King of Fists]

Some people do things for their own edification

Like a certain group of students setting out to study a curriculum of their own desire, perhaps?

Although if becoming a modern writer is your goal, like say a top selling current one like Khaled Hosseini who has some merit, I fail to see how a reading the classics won't enrich your mind. He's fond of 13th century Persian poetry, which many people are today. Rumi is still widely popular, even gets turned into songs by Madonna.

Cool, so when is OK for people to study Madonna in a college setting -- 500 years from now?

I'm curious how long, in your opinion, it is until today's cultural influencers can be considered useful for study and inspiration for students.