Wrestling vs Jiu Jitsu

[EnemyOfTheState]

wheres this at I would like to look at this.

http://www.sherdog.com/stats/stylewinrecords_ratio.htm . jiu-jitsu has more wins
http://www.sherdog.com/stats/gracieeffect.htm more jiujitsu fighters
http://www.sherdog.com/stats/fightstats.asp any other stats you want to know

wrestling is at the top too, I underestimated wrestling more than I should have.

 

[Nitro64876]

You're taking Brazilian jiu-jitsu, right? If so, BJJ is definitely a more complete grappling style than freestyle or greco wrestling. When comparing pure BJJ and pure wrestling, wrestlers generally get better than BJJ'ers at takedowns and throws and develop a good sense of control when on top of an opponent. However, pure wrestlers, without training in other styles, are usually not good on their backs and don't know the proper techniques to defend or apply submissions. Nowadays, every successful wrestler in MMA, such as Matt Hughes, has cross-trained in BJJ so that they develop a good guard and submission techniques.

For examples of wrestlers in MMA who don't seem to have done enough cross-training, check out Hammerhouse fighters such as Mark Coleman and Kevin Randleman. Getting submitted has been their downfalls thus far, and even more so if it weren't so physically big and strong.

Btw, I also want to give you props for serving.

 

[jludley]

You're taking Brazilian jiu-jitsu, right? If so, BJJ is definitely a more complete grappling style than freestyle or greco wrestling. When comparing pure BJJ and pure wrestling, wrestlers generally get better than BJJ'ers at takedowns and throws and develop a good sense of control when on top of an opponent. However, pure wrestlers, without training in other styles, are usually not good on their backs and don't know the proper techniques to defend or apply submissions. Nowadays, every successful wrestler in MMA, such as Matt Hughes, has cross-trained in BJJ so that they develop a good guard and submission techniques.

For examples of wrestlers in MMA who don't seem to have done enough cross-training, check out Hammerhouse fighters such as Mark Coleman and Kevin Randleman. Getting submitted has been their downfalls thus far, and even more so if it weren't so physically big and strong.

Btw, I also want to give you props for serving.

thank you and Im hoping to particpate in wrestling and jiu jitsu events in the near future I think I might hold off on the jiu jitsu for awhile though until I gain some more skill and practice and hopefully one day actually moving up into mma events. Yeah its BJJ.

 

[jludley]

how much is it for judo classes

 

[mikeffd]

A seasoned wrestler with knowledge of jiu jitsu is a very tough opponent (i.e Jeff Monson or Otto Olsen). Never mind takedowns or control, a wrestler will almost always enjoy a decided edge in strength, explosiveness, and conditioning.

If you're talking about true BJJ - not no-gi submission wrestling - there'll be a much greater emphasis on technique.

 

[OpethDrums]

wrestling + 1/2bjj > 1/2wresting + bjj

 

[knoxpk]

MMA setting?



Guys its all relative. if you are a wrestler with GREAT hands too then all the BJJ you may need to learn is defense part of it. After all WHO is going to take you down? Not a BJJ guy!
On the other hand if you are fighting wanderlei silva you damn sure better be able to get him down or get KTFO!
Itas about blending styles that suit YOUR attributes.

 

[b0b]

Both have thier pros and cons. One is not inherently better than the other. They work very well TOGETHER.

 

[tinker_190]

http://www.sherdog.com/stats/stylewinrecords_ratio.htm . jiu-jitsu has more wins
http://www.sherdog.com/stats/gracieeffect.htm more jiujitsu fighters
http://www.sherdog.com/stats/fightstats.asp any other stats you want to know

wrestling is at the top too, I underestimated wrestling more than I should have.

By that logic, why not do freestyle jiu jitsu or straight jiu jitsu? They have the best win to loss ratio? Of course, I am not sure what options are available to you.

Anyways, thanks for serving man.

 

[knoxpk]

Even if you lump all the Jiu Jitsu styles listed on that page as BJJ the percentage is roughly 69% win/loss ratio in MMA.

Wrestling shows as 68% win/loss.
Do you realize the number is SOOOOO negligible that stats wise these 2 styles are a deade heat.
I mean seriously, simply by the stats, it would take 100 fights to get a 1 win/loss difference in the 2 styles.

 

[triso]

If you look at early MMA ... then pure Jiu Jitsu used to beat pure Wrestling.

Now everyone has a mixture of Wrestling and BJJ.

I don't think one is more effective ... they are both incredible grappling systems for different reasons, and they complement each other very well.

I respect both.

 

[bacon]

I think any time you try to compare styles you end up with a flame war.
Both have their applications. Leave it at that.

 

[knoxpk]

If you look at early MMA ... then pure Jiu Jitsu used to beat pure Wrestling.

Not really true either yep Severn got beat by royce But Frye beat Amaury(sp?) Bittei, Kerr v Gurgel and I think Kenny monday beat John lewis.. Not 100% a wrestler but a wrestling base, Lions Den fighter jerry Bohlander also beat fabio gurgel, Dan henderson beat 3 or 4 BJJ guys before 98.
But I DO agree with the rest of your post.

I don't think one is more effective ... they are both incredible grappling systems for different reasons, and they complement each other very well.

I respect both.

 

[Eddie Casselli]

Sakuraba beat 4 Gracies and his base is wrestling, but I feel it has more to do with the man then the art.

 

[colinm]

jesus...people are evaluating martial arts by comparing mma fighters again? thats so '93.

 

[triso]

When I said pure wrestling I meant just that.

Sakuraba is versed in submissions, whether wrestling is his base or not, he is a submission wrestler, not a pure wrestler.

In MMA now you are really not going to find a pure BJJ fighter or pure Wrestler. Each will cross train the others art, which I think proves the effectiveness of both Wrestling and BJJ in MMA. These 2 systems are essential to MMA as even someone who is mostly wrestling based NEEDs to train Jiu Jitsu and subs, and someone based in Jiu Jitsu NEEDs to train standing wrestling, and takedowns.

Severen was the man ... I loved how he brought wrestling to the table in MMA and showed the world how truly effective it was in a fight.

 

[knoxpk]

jesus...people are evaluating martial arts by comparing mma fighters again? thats so '93.

Colin I agree but the thread starter was asking to compare styles based on stats from MMA which are fought by MMA fighters.

But the point I was trying to make on my post that even at its most base level wrestling and BJJ(even in the early days) was pretty much a wash.

As it still is today with both stylists crosstraining.

 

[colinm]

i know what you were saying, i just thought i should insert a smartass remark before this thread spiraled out of control...you could just go on forever comparing who beat who and you still won't come out of it with any sensible conclusion because there are just too many variables outside the styles. What if its a reallllllllllllllly good, massive, strong, explosive wrestler against an average bjj guy? what if its a physically superior world class bjj guy vs an average, underconditioned wrestler? Even if you get two people at the pinnacle of their respective sports, they're unlikely to have the same amount of mma training, their cross training is probably in different aspects of the same styles, and they'll always have physical differences. not only that, but you'd probably get different outcomes or at least different fights in the rematch.

 

[reagan123]

wrestling is going to help you out tremendously... not only will you have a good base, you already know how to move your body and this will help you pick up on bjj very quickly.

most wrestlers that i've seen that start bjj are very very tough to deal with.

 

[triso]

Nice post by colinm and knoxpk.

The points made in colinm