Why Jon Jones was unbeatable

[krelianx]

Reach was key. But considering how close that first fight with Gustafson was I wonder how Jones would have fared without PEDs. Or against Cormier.

 

[Deleted member 498977]

He was unbeteable because of weekends of cocaine, prostitutes and all the juice he got from @Juice

 

[Vegesus44]

Picto - is that even a word?

That said, he’s also a cheater. We will never know much the juice helped him out. Maybe only a 5% or maybe 60%. It will be always a question.

100%, if it wasn't 100% why did he take them?

"Off the steroids"

 

[HeDidn'tWantTheFight]

Most of his best run was against either:

A. Old/Past prime fighters
B. Fighters that should've been at middleweight, especially in modern era.

"Old/Past prime fighters"

"Should've been at middleweight"

1. Shogun, 29 years old, LHW champ when Jon fought him
2. Rampage, 33 years old, Former LHW champ (3 years removed)
3. Machida, 33 years old, Former LHW champ (1 year removed)
4. Rashad, 32 years old, Former LHW champ (3 years removed)
5. Vitor, 35 years old, Former LHW champ (8 years removed)
7. Glover, 34 years old, Future LHW champ
8. Cormier, 36 years old, Former LHW and HW champ

Notes
-Shogun, Rampage, Machida, and Rashad were far from old, especially at LHW, and weren't far removed from their respective title runs
-You can't say for a second that someone who held a belt in one weight class and was mediocre in another (Machida, Rashad, Vitor) belonged in that other weight class. Makes no sense.
-Vitor was a little older and further removed from his title run, but Jon fought an emerging TRT Vitor, who was arguably the best version of Vitor we've ever seen. The past prime thing doesn't work for him.
-Forget all of Jon's other fights. That list right there is enough.

 

[Dirty Frank]

Being a PED cheat helps a lot, Shermano

 

[IsNormal]

Most of his best run was against either:

A. Old/Past prime fighters

They weren't THAT old or that far from prime.
Perhaps not at their ultimate peak, but at the same time - I think their accomplishments partially weigh up for that - I don't think a win against a prime up-and-comer with less credentials would be worth more.

Wasn't like when Bisping got a #15 ranked Hendo instead of the top contenders.

In hindsight, Jon's opponents around 33 years old were not even that old - given how guys like Jan B, Glover and DC have managed do become at their advanced ages.

Just one example: Rashad. Sure - perhaps in hindsight you can say his ultimate peak was a few years prior but he was by no means ancient. Had just been a pro fighter for 8 years when he fought Jones - and he was on a win streak beating younger guys like Davis.
He was 32, not young but not exactly problematically old.
Usman is 35 now and further into his career than Shad was.

 

[Pechan]

Most fighters stick to their strengths and mix it up on occasion. Jones hole game plan was to constantly mix it up. You never knew if there was an elbow, spinning back fist, kick, knee or takedown. He did this with superior reach and simply took mixed martial arts literally.

We saw that a wrestling based fighter could not beat him, and a striking based would have trouble with his wrestling... So jon Jones was the best of both worlds. If you program someone to fight optimally, you do like Jones.. Do everything..

Or . maybe it was the PEDs.

 

[abject]

He was a very good fighter who used peds to gain an advantage. He would have likely lost to gus and dc and others if he was not a steroid user. He was good but cheaters cant be great. These threads are funny.

 

[Khamzat GOAT]

Being a PED cheat helps a lot, Shermano

PEDs and great fight IQ and long reach

 

[fg1985bg]

Highest fight iq
Lowest life iq.

Best fighter I’ve ever seen at his height. Also the textbook definition of a shitty human being who I unapologetically root against every chance I get.

I could completely understand how fans could consider him the goat and I also completely understand how fans won’t have him on their list due to all the steroid scandals.

 

[rstringer]

Dudes who just started watching MMA are totally clueless about the landscape of PEDs in MMA.

Six of Jones opponents have popped, one would have to be pretty obtuse to not see whats going on.

Exactly what Lance Armstrong said, did we allow him to keep the TDF trophies calling him great?

 

[kflo]

Everyone is beatable. Not everyone gets beat.

 

[Dirty Frank]

PEDs and great fight IQ and long reach

And PEDs

 

[ermac88]

He was a very good fighter who used peds to gain an advantage. He would have likely lost to gus and dc and others if he was not a steroid user. He was good but cheaters cant be great. These threads are funny.

And PEDs

Didnt help his six opponents who popped.

 

[Dirty Frank]

Didnt help his six opponents who popped.

And he popped, not once, but twice. Possibly even thrice

 

[ermac88]

And he popped, not once, but twice. Possibly even thrice

newflash.
if his opponents popped, some of them for Pride.

 

[ermac88]

Exactly what Lance Armstrong said, did we allow him to keep the TDF trophies calling him great?

i dont watch bicyling, I have no idea what fans of Tour de France think.

I do watch MMA, since days of Shamrock and Royce (popped) and Pride, where it was encouraged.

Athletes didnt just stop when USADA came to town (though some left)

 

[arrmike]

"Old/Past prime fighters"

"Should've been at middleweight"

1. Shogun, 29 years old, LHW champ when Jon fought him
2. Rampage, 33 years old, Former LHW champ (3 years removed)
3. Machida, 33 years old, Former LHW champ (1 year removed)
4. Rashad, 32 years old, Former LHW champ (3 years removed)
5. Vitor, 35 years old, Former LHW champ (8 years removed)
7. Glover, 34 years old, Future LHW champ
8. Cormier, 36 years old, Former LHW and HW champ

Notes
-Shogun, Rampage, Machida, and Rashad were far from old, especially at LHW, and weren't far removed from their respective title runs
-You can't say for a second that someone who held a belt in one weight class and was mediocre in another (Machida, Rashad, Vitor) belonged in that other weight class. Makes no sense.
-Vitor was a little older and further removed from his title run, but Jon fought an emerging TRT Vitor, who was arguably the best version of Vitor we've ever seen. The past prime thing doesn't work for him.
-Forget all of Jon's other fights. That list right there is enough.

So all his opponents were older than Jones was when he regressed and should have lost 48-47 to Santos.

 

[Tweak896]

Jones was impossible to beat. He's a little similar to Izzy, but with wrestling instead of counter striking on the inside. Where he'll pick you off from the outside and chip away and destroy you. Or if you come inside he'll throw devastating elbows, take you down, and he can't be taken down. On the ground he has GNP stopping power and subs. So you are basically fucked either direction you take the fight to him.

 

[mister piscadinha]

grappling, height, reach, fight IQ, drive, iron chin.. also steroids, lots of steroids
anyway, he still lost to gus, marreta and reyes.
one of the goats, but far from unbeatable.
actually had trouble with every tall guy he fought