Why DId Penn leave Gracie for Andre Pederneiras

[GJJNY]

BJJ politics is so stupid..

Its like a bunch of old ladies sitting around the retirement home gossiping.

Look at this thread, trash talking about stuff that happened 10+ years ago, probably before most of the people talking trash even knew who BJ or Ralph were.

 

[tenniswhiz]

BJJ politics is so stupid..

Not always.... some teachers are cool about it.

A lot of Fabio Gurgel's black belts started out somewhere else, but we don't hear any moaning from their former instructors about them being traitors or any nonsense like that.

 

[KimuraArmLock]

Wow I can't even imagine the early days of Cali BJJ with Cesar and Ralph Gracie. There are a bunch of stories coming out of Cesar's camp that the older guys brutalize the new guys on the first day. They did it to Jake, they did it to Nick, I think even to the joint of spraining a knee or elbow, on their first days.

 

[blazininmanch]

Now was he really hitting them hard when he did that to them?

 

[Deleted member 56619]

Wow I can't even imagine the early days of Cali BJJ with Cesar and Ralph Gracie. There are a bunch of stories coming out of Cesar's camp that the older guys brutalize the new guys on the first day. They did it to Jake, they did it to Nick, I think even to the joint of spraining a knee or elbow, on their first days.

Never heard that about Cesar's camp before. Where did you read about it?

 

[grayson0311]

I've never heard anything like that about Ceasers, man nor cal is a warzone lol
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[KimuraArmLock]

Never heard that about Cesar's camp before. Where did you read about it?

I don't remember the link, it was some interview with Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. They talked about when they first got to Cesars.

If you search for something like Cesar Gracie belt promotion on youtube, they beat the shit out of the guy with their belts when he gets a belt promotion. Cesar Gracie is running a goddamn mad house over there and I love him for it.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

I don't remember the link, it was some interview with Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. They talked about when they first got to Cesars.

If you search for something like Cesar Gracie belt promotion on youtube, they beat the shit out of the guy with their belts when he gets a belt promotion. Cesar Gracie is running a goddamn mad house over there and I love him for it.

Some of the stories are myth. Some are true.

We're more mainstream now. It works better for me.

I started in 96 when Cesar and Ralph were together (took 5 years of 99-04). It was kind of like the Wild West. Those days are mostly gone.

Nick and Jake were tough kids who ran into some tough men when they first started.

I came up through the system and barely survived. I look back on those days fondly, but I would not like to repeat it. Nor do I think it is a good model for student development or business practice.

A lot of pride and ego have kept our sport from achieving its true potential.

We're doing much better now...:icon_chee

 

[Jeff Goldblum]

for Bj In the end it worked out for the best - Andre Pederneiras is one of the best coaches in the world and a great guy.

Ralph gracie is nutjob

 

[Narsil**]

Some of the stories are myth. Some are true.

We're more mainstream now. It works better for me.

I started in 96 when Cesar and Ralph were together (took 5 years of 99-04). It was kind of like the Wild West. Those days are mostly gone.

Nick and Jake were tough kids who ran into some tough men when they first started.

I came up through the system and barely survived. I look back on those days fondly, but I would not like to repeat it. Nor do I think it is a good model for student development or business practice.

A lot of pride and ego have kept our sport from achieving its true potential.

We're doing much better now...:icon_chee

cesar seems like a pretty cool guy.

ralph seems like a nut

as far as there fighters go, they are great, nick gives the best interviews in the world

 

[the heed]

If you search for something like Cesar Gracie belt promotion on youtube, they beat the shit out of the guy with their belts when he gets a belt promotion.

that's actually a pretty common practice with Brazilians.
no malicious intent behind it but just right of passage kind of thing. Its actually kind of funny. I did mine with no Gi top on. Didn't feel too great but I was laughing about it.

 

[Rockomon]

Yeah but theres a difference between "ok today we are going to do some heavy sparring, don't hold back" and "hey, you come here, followed by a judo toss, mount, and some gnp". First would be an awesome training tool, the latter was just someone punking you in front of all the other students.

Also in my example you quoted, the story I heard was...they were just having a roll (no strikes), then all of a sudden he Ralph just opens up and starts pounding on him. Even if Dave could hang, how do you react in that situation? It would feel weird trying to get into an all out brawl with your instructor. Not just because he's your iunstructor, he's a pro mma fighter, but also the "wtf is going on" moment thats going on in your head.

lol

 

[Stoic1]

I fought Danny Camarillo at the finals of the US Open at blue belt around '99 and lost on points. Everyone, including Claudio came to congratulate me. Nobody except Ralph's guys congratulated him.

They were fuckin pissed and said if Danny showed back up after winning it 4 years in a row as blue they wouldn't let him compete.

That should give you a bit of insight into level of sandbaggery happening.

 

[JacJeanFinger]

Marc Laimon leaving Rorion for nova uniao probably involved the same scenario. They were frustrated with slow promotion and lack of freedom to pursue their own career.

Gracie family didn't encourage their American students to get into MMA/NHB. If your goal was to become a PRIDE/UFC fighter like Penn, gracie school wasn't a perfect place to belong to.


Ralph Gracie: BJJ> everything else

Nova uniao:. BJJ= a major component of MMA

 

[Romulas]

Why did BJ Penn leave Ralph Gracie as a purple belt and go to Andre Pederneiras?

was there a fall out?

Early interactions between Americans and many of the early ariving Gracies/Brazilians were tenous.

The first bjj near me was opened by one of Helio's black belts in 2002 and there was a lot of shady/weird stuff that went on especially when it came to money or promotions.

I used to refer to it as "Brazilian Ethics."