Why are wrestlers transitioning superior than Jiujitsu practioners at control on the ground?

[Kforcer]

So BJJ has furthered it since pins are irrelevant. Kosen Judo came much later.

Pins irrelevant in BJJ...? Not for anyone who is worried about losing on points or losing due to technical superiority depending on the rule set.

And Kosen judo came much later in relation to what...? Kimura competed in Kosen judo and was a legend under that format. If you are saying Kosen judo didn't exist during Kimura's time then you are just wrong.

 

[Kforcer]

If you mean that BJJ predated Kosen judo, then that is also incorrect.

 

[Judochopatemi]

Kimura competed in Kosen judo and was a legend under that format. If you are saying Kosen judo didn't exist during Kimura's time then you are just wrong.

I have never denied that Kimura was a great newaza grappler. However, to suggest that the sport hasn't moved on since then and that BJJ did not improve anything is silly. Jacare would sub Kimura every day of the week.

 

[Judochopatemi]

Pins irrelevant in BJJ...? Not for anyone who is worried about losing on points or losing due to technical superiority depending on the rule set..

true but it doesn't END the match

 

[Kforcer]

true but it doesn't END the match

I don't know why you think that being able to win by passing guard and pinning makes guard less important. Being punished for having your guard passed makes guard more important, if anything. Either way, its hugely important in both sports, assuming you want to win.

 

[Kforcer]

I have never denied that Kimura was a great newaza grappler. However, to suggest that the sport hasn't moved on since then and that BJJ did not improve anything is silly. Jacare would sub Kimura every day of the week.

It is unclear what you were claiming, you said that Kosen didn't come along until much later. You mean much later than BJJ...? Much later than Kimura...? Much later than what, exactly...?

 

[KOMRADE]

Judo on the ground? BJJ invented guard play. Get a Judoka on his back and he's toast.

BJJ is old-school judo, thats just a fact.

"Gracie realized, however, that even though he knew the techniques theoretically, the moves were much harder to execute. Consequently, he began adapting Mitsuyo Maeda's brand of judo, already heavily based around newaza ground fighting techniques, for his smaller physique.[citation needed] From these experiments, Gracie Jiu-Jitsu was created"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hélio_Gracie

 

[Judochopatemi]

[

BJJ is old-school judo, thats just a fact.

"Gracie realized, however, that even though he knew the techniques theoretically, the moves were much harder to execute. Consequently, he began adapting Mitsuyo Maeda's brand of judo, already heavily based around newaza ground fighting techniques, for his smaller physique.[citation needed] From these experiments, Gracie Jiu-Jitsu was created"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hélio_Gracie

No it is not, it only started out that way



Modern sport Jiu-Jitsu has all the newer innovation such as 50/50, berimbolo, De la riva guard, reverse de la riva guard, kiss of the dragon, lapel guard, worm guard, inverted guard, tornado guard etc

https://www.bjjee.com/videos/kosen-judo-similarities-differences-with-brazilian-jiu-jitsu/

 

[KOMRADE]

[




No it is not, it only started out that way



Modern sport Jiu-Jitsu has all the newer innovation such as 50/50, berimbolo, De la riva guard, reverse de la riva guard, kiss of the dragon, lapel guard, worm guard, inverted guard, tornado guard etc

https://www.bjjee.com/videos/kosen-judo-similarities-differences-with-brazilian-jiu-jitsu/

Rebranding judo newaza and a slick promotion stragety made them millions but you have to give the Gracie's credit they won most of their fights.

 

[SHAOLINMONK420]

So BJJ has furthered it since pins are irrelevant. Kosen Judo came much later.

if you have someone in side control wouldnt u try to pin the far arm down and post your weight down on it so you can grab that elbow knot.