When people say BJ Penn is the best LW of all time...

[LilNicky95]

is that due to pure nostalgia and love they have for the prodigy?

Looking at his LW murderers row wins:

Jens Pulver
Joe Stevenson
Sean Shirk
Kenny Florian
Diego Sanchez

GSP voice 'I am not impressed'.

Tony and Khabib's LW resume shits all over Penn's and they both would fuck Penn up in his prime also. These idiots like Jimmy Smith getting high off nostalgia need a good schooling.

Joe Rogan has said that BJ is the “Greatest Combat Sports Fighter Ever” so you know.....Rogan is on many drugs.

 

[thewhiterooster]

No, I am genuinely serious. I have never called a poster on here dumb in all my time being here until today. You are dumb dude.



Zero take down ability.

Zero .

you're dumb.

 

[Thepaintbucket]

you're dumb.

Zero take down ability

 

[suffersystem]

The 'Quality Wins' ya listed exposed your lack of historical perspective, tho...

Historically, the row of wins before that were 17 years ago, where he beat Gomi and Hughes. The nest 17 years are decent at best. A lenegend in name yes, but I do think he is overrated quite a bit. His prime he was amazing, but I don't think he did enough. Potential was there, but potential doesn't win fights, winning fights at LW should rank you as a GOAT at LW, not maybe and could haves, or fighting at higher weights.

 

[PAPERCLIP30]

I see "boomers" is now a thing.

Boomers have been a thing since the 40s bud

 

[blaseblah]

Quit trying so hard to be thoughtful. It’s not working.

At minimum a Prime BJ beats Cerrone, Al I, Barboza, Pettis, and Hernandez (I think a few more but let’s start low). These are names from the current UFC top 15 Rankings page.

Pettis would be a nightmare matchup for Penn. Barboza probably smashes him as well. Penn never developed anything other than rudimentary boxing.

 

[thewhiterooster]

Zero take down ability

and you got a big nose

 

[accolyte1022]

Boomers have been a thing since the 40s bud

Yeah. I just meant it's now a thing on Shitdawg.



Bud.

 

[Taric]

BJ has an 11-3 LW record and 8 of those fights were against top 5 ranked LWs.

Just to help this thread out.

 

[gono btw]

Historically, the row of wins before that were 17 years ago, where he beat Gomi and Hughes. The nest 17 years are decent at best. A lenegend in name yes, but I do think he is overrated quite a bit. His prime he was amazing, but I don't think he did enough. Potential was there, but potential doesn't win fights, winning fights at LW should rank you as a GOAT at LW, not maybe and could haves, or fighting at higher weights.

oh he beat other dudes... But ya have to know about their relevance accordin´to their skill set.

 

[MarcusAuerelius]

Well, he was probably the best LW from about 02-09. He didn’t prove it in the same way Conor never proves anything, because he went to ROTR and then came back to UFC as a WW. Only after losing to Hughes and GSP did he go back to LW and own it for a few more years before Frankie shut him down for good.

So if you consider all time great rankings half-art-half-science, rating BJ is more on the ‘art’ side of it.

Now, how does he stack up against others? Pettis was inconsistent, Bendo was worse than Pettis and RDA, and RDA’s peak was short lived. So until Khabib and Tony, there wasn’t really a better alternative to LW Goat, except Gomi, who BJ beat.

Today, whoever is champ in May is likely the GOAT over BJ. But until recently, BJ GOAT was a very reasonable conclusion.

But if you already think he’s not and never was, I doubt anything I said just would convince you otherwise. So...agree to disagree is the most likely outcome here.

And no, I’m not quite a Boomer. Closer than most of you, but not quite.

Am a boomer, so what? How does it make me less or more likely to form an opinion | venture a guess about someone being LW GOAT?
BJ is a legend, ironically its not [only] his wins that make him great, its [also] his losses: his 1st GSP fight, his Machida fight, even his loss to Hughes and draw with Uno. And that is something lost in Fight Finder...
Its funny there are two type of snobs on Sherdog:
1. Join date 200x Pride forever, watching UFC from 1993, Royce is 'da sh!t', you TUF noobs die and leave the sport to professionals
2. Join date 201x Conor [Khabib, Masvidal] is the GOAT, the game [USADA, UFC] surpassed long ago... Fedor [Silva, BJ] were never good [can crushers|steroid users]
Both types speak in condescending manner and feel real good about themselves [bit sorry for the rest of noobs]

 

[ezekielthree]

He was the best of his time. Now they are the best of their time. That's why we have a pound for pound greatest discussion so we can speculate about who would beat whom in their prime. Most of these guys on top now would have beaten BJ in his prime. It's the nature of the sport. It changes so fast.

 

[thewhiterooster]

Pettis would be a nightmare matchup for Penn. Barboza probably smashes him as well. Penn never developed anything other than rudimentary boxing.

you're very correct. this is my point. he faired very well 10+ years ago when the talent pool wasn't very deep. Pettis and barboza would kick a "prime bf's" legs to pieces. bj would need to be in boxing range in order to potentially have any shot, because his skill set was (whether you like it or not) very limited and he would not be competitive in today's climate.

 

[chuckleknuckle]

Being the best ever is about being the most dominant of your era, and raising the bar. Being so far ahead of your fellow competition. If you raise the bar then someone surpasses it, they are standing on your shoulders, and you are the giant.

 

[Thepaintbucket]

and you got a big nose

BJ had zero take down ability

 

[YellowBanenoo]

Way to out yourself as a disgusting casual. MODS can ban these openly disease infected incumbents?

Triggered boomer

 

[saminex]

Well, he was probably the best LW from about 02-09. He didn’t prove it in the same way Conor never proves anything, because he went to ROTR and then came back to UFC as a WW. Only after losing to Hughes and GSP did he go back to LW and own it for a few more years before Frankie shut him down for good.

So if you consider all time great rankings half-art-half-science, rating BJ is more on the ‘art’ side of it.

Now, how does he stack up against others? Pettis was inconsistent, Bendo was worse than Pettis and RDA, and RDA’s peak was short lived. So until Khabib and Tony, there wasn’t really a better alternative to LW Goat, except Gomi, who BJ beat.

Today, whoever is champ in May is likely the GOAT over BJ. But until recently, BJ GOAT was a very reasonable conclusion.

But if you already think he’s not and never was, I doubt anything I said just would convince you otherwise. So...agree to disagree is the most likely outcome here.

And no, I’m not quite a Boomer. Closer than most of you, but not quite.

He went to WW after rotr bc there was no LW division in the UFC

 

[PAPERCLIP30]

Yeah. I just meant it's now a thing on Shitdawg.



Bud.

hope your day gets better, pal

 

[SeattleFightFan]

Am a boomer, so what? How does it make me less or more likely to form an opinion

See post #3. I was jokingly responding to a joking post. You’re the only one who took any of that seriously.

You mad, boomer?

But if you have anything to add or discuss about the other 99% of my post (everything except the last few words), I’d be happy to have a back and forth with you about BJ Penn. Cheers.

 

[chuckleknuckle]

Rate BJs skills vs Khabibs out of 10 on the following skillsets:

1 Boxing
2 Kicking
3 clinch
4 Elbows and knees (thai boxing)
5 fighting at range
6 ring control
7 submissions
8 wrestling
9 escapes/sweeps
10 Cardio