Was Tyson as good as people think?

[Seano]

Ali would troll Tyson hard lol.

There's no way those 2 could have been in the same room together if they were hyping a potential fight.

 

[clashnat]

I don't think Frazier had the speed or explosiveness. More heart for sure. But not the same physical gifts.

If Ali is going to get something under control, it's speed and power.
What caused Ali problems was tactical stuff that he couldn't figure out due to his technical deficits. Ali had a monster IQ as long as nobody caused him stylistic issues.

Mike would have to expect a long fight. He would have expect to get behind on the scorecards sooner or later and overcome adversity. He would have to expect an iron chin. I don't see this turning out well for him.

 

[Seano]

I really think you're selling Tyson's technique short.

 

[PUO3]

There's no way those 2 could have been in the same room together if they were hyping a potential fight.

Maybe with a barb wire fence separating them thats about it. Tyson would put hands on him before the fight. No doubt.

 

[PUO3]

If Ali is going to get something under control, it's speed and power.
What caused Ali problems was tactical stuff that he couldn't figure out due to his technical deficits. Ali had a monster IQ as long as nobody caused him stylistic issues.

Mike would have to expect a long fight. He would have expect to get behind on the scorecards sooner or later and overcome adversity. He would have to expect an iron chin. I don't see this turning out well for him.

Except Tyson was faster and moves like no one ever had before or has since, along with his retarded power. He perfected the style because his physical abilities are tailor made for it. You dont just get that under control without taking a beating in the process.

 

[senri]

Except Tyson was faster and moves like no one ever had before or has since, along with his retarded power. He perfected the style because his physical abilities are tailor made for it. You dont just get that under control without taking a beating in the process.

See you understand Mike Tyson's aberrant nature, someone like that possesses aberrant power. Mike was ridiculously primal, you can feel the musk of the hormones through the television screen, as his muscles exploded channeling all of that angst onto the opponents central nervous system. Where Barry White made everyone excited to procreate, he led men into a frenzy of unadulterated ferocious anger and violent emotions.

He was the real life berserker, nobody had a choice in accepting his existance, he forced his way inside everybody in the 80s and the effects still last to this day.

 

[Seano]

Ali got caught with left hooks. Doug Jones, Cooper and Frazier all dropped him hard with left hooks.

 

[burningspear]

See you understand Mike Tyson's aberrant nature, someone like that possesses aberrant power. Mike was ridiculously primal, you can feel the musk of the hormones through the television screen, as his muscles exploded channeling all of that angst onto the opponents central nervous system. Where Barry White made everyone excited to procreate, he led men into a frenzy of unadulterated ferocious anger and violent emotions.

He was the real life berserker, nobody had a choice in accepting his existance, he forced his way inside everybody in the 80s and the effects still last to this day.

Who else induces this sort of eulogy? Guys like sunfish who were too young to have experienced the era as it happened, just don't get it. Nothing since has come close.

 

[clashnat]

Ali got caught with left hooks. Doug Jones, Cooper and Frazier all dropped him hard with left hooks.

Frazier dropped him late, VERY late.

 

[Vintersorg]

Frazier dropped him late, VERY late.

Yeah, and he got up immediately after an exhausting bout. Tyson's fans only see his physical attributes and his style, which was absolutely spectacular. We've seen this happen in many sports, some super athletes with a crazy style which requires utilizing 100% of their physical potential all the fucking time, and most of these guys crack sooner or later. Whether it's partying, women, injuries or they are simply not mentally strong enough to overcome adversity. Tyson's style was out of this world, but that doesn't mean he'd win against real competition. Most of the guys Tyson fought were either B class fighters or decent guys but scared of him. He would not even be in top 5 in Ali's era, because guys back then wanted money also, but most of them were not scared to fight anybody and weren't afraid to give a 100%. Any person who thinks Tyson has more than 1% chance to beat a prime Foreman or prime Liston is seriously delusional. Even past prime Holmes would have won against Tyson if he had just fought a couple of times before facing Tyson, to shake off the ring rust. That's one of the things George Foreman pointed out, he didn't want big fights right away when he came back, he wanted to go slow and it paid off in the end.

Mike Tyson was a great fighter and is a great fucking guy, but his fanboys should be arrested on sight and sent to labour camps, it should be in every single country's constitution .

 

[Seano]

Frazier dropped him late, VERY late.

Jones dropped him early. Cooper pretty early too and had Dundee not cheated, Ali very possibly would have been stopped.

 

[Seano]

Yeah, and he got up immediately after an exhausting bout. Tyson's fans only see his physical attributes and his style, which was absolutely spectacular. We've seen this happen in many sports, some super athletes with a crazy style which requires utilizing 100% of their physical potential all the fucking time, and most of these guys crack sooner or later. Whether it's partying, women, injuries or they are simply not mentally strong enough to overcome adversity. Tyson's style was out of this world, but that doesn't mean he'd win against real competition. Most of the guys Tyson fought were either B class fighters or decent guys but scared of him. He would not even be in top 5 in Ali's era, because guys back then wanted money also, but most of them were not scared to fight anybody and weren't afraid to give a 100%. Any person who thinks Tyson has more than 1% chance to beat a prime Foreman or prime Liston is seriously delusional. Even past prime Holmes would have won against Tyson if he had just fought a couple of times before facing Tyson, to shake off the ring rust. That's one of the things George Foreman pointed out, he didn't want big fights right away when he came back, he wanted to go slow and it paid off in the end.

Mike Tyson was a great fighter and is a great fucking guy, but his fanboys should be arrested on sight and sent to labour camps, it should be in every single country's constitution .

 

[clashnat]

Jones dropped him early. Cooper pretty early too and had Dundee not cheated, Ali very possibly would have been stopped.

Jones never dropped him, that was Sonny Banks you mook. He was 20 at that time. I think we can agree that Tyson would walk through Clay at that age. But he improved drastically. Had he given Doug Jones a rematch in 1966 or 67, the difference would have been significant.

Those knockdowns shouldnt be brought up. Imagine Lennox Lewis being dropped in 1989. Thats nothing that should be meaningful in 1997.

 

[clashnat]

I also don't agree with anything Vintersorg wrote.
Tyson was too much brute force and competitive in any era, against anyone.

 

[Seano]

Jones never dropped him, that was Sonny Banks you mook. He was 20 at that time. I think we can agree that Tyson would walk through Clay at that age. But he improved drastically. Had he given Doug Jones a rematch in 1966 or 67, the difference would have been significant.

Those knockdowns shouldnt be brought up. Imagine Lennox Lewis being dropped in 1989. Thats nothing that should be meaningful in 1997.

I was thinking of Sonny Banks.

lol at that second paragraph. Ali's flaws shouldn't be brought up in a fantasy fight debate? Ali was susceptible to left hooks at all points of his career.

 

[PUO3]

Yeah, and he got up immediately after an exhausting bout. Tyson's fans only see his physical attributes and his style, which was absolutely spectacular. We've seen this happen in many sports, some super athletes with a crazy style which requires utilizing 100% of their physical potential all the fucking time, and most of these guys crack sooner or later. Whether it's partying, women, injuries or they are simply not mentally strong enough to overcome adversity. Tyson's style was out of this world, but that doesn't mean he'd win against real competition. Most of the guys Tyson fought were either B class fighters or decent guys but scared of him. He would not even be in top 5 in Ali's era, because guys back then wanted money also, but most of them were not scared to fight anybody and weren't afraid to give a 100%. Any person who thinks Tyson has more than 1% chance to beat a prime Foreman or prime Liston is seriously delusional. Even past prime Holmes would have won against Tyson if he had just fought a couple of times before facing Tyson, to shake off the ring rust. That's one of the things George Foreman pointed out, he didn't want big fights right away when he came back, he wanted to go slow and it paid off in the end.

Mike Tyson was a great fighter and is a great fucking guy, but his fanboys should be arrested on sight and sent to labour camps, it should be in every single country's constitution .

Tyson would put Foreman's ass in a coma. I say that as a huge, huge Foreman hugger as well. You cant get much worse of a matchup for him than Tyson. Hed literally do whatever he wanted to because his speed would overwhelm the fuck out of Foreman. People like to say well Holyfield survived so George would, except George wasnt as talented or as fast as Holyfield.

Tyson brutally finishes him within 6 rounds. Maybe the ref/so ending it but its over before Foreman can break Tyson down.

 

[Confucamus]

Yeah Tyson would find openings just like Ron Lyle did. I don't think Tyson would completely trash Forman, but I think he'd stop him late in a competitive fight.

 

[AppliedScience]

If anything Tyson's prime abilities are grossly underrated now because he became a completely mainstream figure. Therefore experts, media figures and hardcore fans dismiss him to some extent, because they want to appear knowledgeable and they want to stick it to every casual fan who only knows Tyson. It's natural fans want to be original and unique and bring up older names that are more obscure, so as to appear more knowledgeable. Or at the very least to freshen the debates. I imagine boxing fans from the Tyson era are sick of discussing him whenever it comes about that they enjoy, train, or compete in boxing.

Good point and yet another reason why "objective" analysis is so difficult.

 

[clashnat]

Yeah Tyson would find openings st like Ron Lyle did. I don't think Tyson would completely trash Forman, but I think he'd stop him late in a competitive fight.

Tyson barely stopped anyone late. Some here dont seem to know Tyson well.

Foreman vs. Tyson would end inside of 6 rounds.

 

[Vintersorg]

Tyson would put Foreman's ass in a coma. I say that as a huge, huge Foreman hugger as well. You cant get much worse of a matchup for him than Tyson. Hed literally do whatever he wanted to because his speed would overwhelm the fuck out of Foreman. People like to say well Holyfield survived so George would, except George wasnt as talented or as fast as Holyfield.

Tyson brutally finishes him within 6 rounds. Maybe the ref/so ending it but its over before Foreman can break Tyson down.

Tyson goes to the hospital after the first few body shots. George Foreman is a freak of nature. He is probably much stronger than 90% of the guys who are the same height and weight as him. I don't know if it's muscle fiber or bone density or whatever, but this guy is just different. Big George was not afraid of anyone(and most guys Tyson fought were afraid of him) and while Tyson's opponents were usually trying to survive the fight, George would go out mauling Tyson like a big bear, and Mike was never comfortable when someone was hitting back fearlessly. Also, George has decent chin.