Was Frank Mir right about flyweights?

[Mr Serge]

pretty sure if you were trained in like krav maga or something and trained for eye gouges, fish hooks, nut shots, etc you could take out a silverback

this is ridiculous a silverback is as strong as 25 men no one in the world would beat it unarmed it would rip you apart in 5 seconds

 

[GSon]

The 2 most popular boxers in the world are basically bantamweights fighting a weight class up and they make way more money than any fighter in the UFC.

So yeah your statement is pretty dumb.

The reason why nobody cares about flyweight - no stars. The UFC is trying real hard to make one in Mighty Mouse, and if he continues finishing dudes as the champ he might get there.

I would argue that the bulk of the Boxing fanbase is vastly different than the bulk of the MMA fanbase. The core/hardcore fans may be similar, but these same meat-head yokels that would be biased against him based on his height are the same jackasses booing during fight cards.

Unfortuently, until MMA becomes more established and folks become more educated, you really cannot compare the two.

 

[djdeez33]

Frank is right about both

 

[hendosan]

I would argue that the bulk of the Boxing fanbase is vastly different than the bulk of the MMA fanbase. The core/hardcore fans may be similar, but these same meat-head yokels that would be biased against him based on his height are the same jackasses booing during fight cards.

Unfortuently, until MMA becomes more established and folks become more educated, you really cannot compare the two.

lol if you think boxing fandom isn't full of meatheads.

 

[BGDDYKWL]

Frank Mir is 100% correct. Now granted the 220 pound guy who thinks that is wrong, but many do think that and have less interest because of it.

 

[Italian Brock]

The 2 most popular boxers in the world are basically bantamweights fighting a weight class up and they make way more money than any fighter in the UFC.

So yeah your statement is pretty dumb.

The reason why nobody cares about flyweight - no stars. The UFC is trying real hard to make one in Mighty Mouse, and if he continues finishing dudes as the champ he might get there.

Your statement is dumb.. Still, how many times have you ever heard someone say ," dam I wish I was as small as a bantamweight boxer" ?? Never

 

[screaminleeman]

Yes, Mir packs a punch but so do some BW & FWs Like Mendes, Benevidez, Aldo, Faber etc. and they certainly are superior wrestlers with the ability to take down heavier opponents. Not to mention the speed and accuracy which is crucial to hurting or ko'ing people. You mean to tell me Fabor or Aldo couldnt rock Mir? Aint nothing stupid about my statement brah. not to mention all the pride OW fights, the smaller dudes with more of a skillset always win.

Wand was onyl outweighed by 30 lbs? u sure? so wand was 270+???? LOL

I F'ing so hated the worthless garbage OW freakshow B.S. that Pride used to sponsor. One such fight in particular disgusted me so bad that I actually wound up happy that they folded.

Go rewatch the Bushido where extremely skilled and experienced MMA fighter Minnow-man fights a heavyweight relative newby to MMA (Cro-Cop).

 

[Byron Carter]

There is a difference between "untrained" and "less trained".

Is Mighty Mouse going to obliterate an "untrained" 220 pound idiot in a bar? Yes.

Is Mighty Mouse going to be in serious trouble against a 220 pound blue belt in great physical shape with about 1-2 years of MMA training? (A guy that typically isn't even ready for his pro debut..)

I think so. I'd still give the edge to MM, but he better take it seriously.

 

[fredrick]

Frank Mir's statement is crude at best and cannot possibly be the end all of every 220lb man's opinion.

 

[Ekcol]

The "average" 220 pound male can't run a mile under 7 minutes.

I doubt they could run a mile period.

 

[Lucifer Alpha]

To put the "average man" into perspective, Dustin Poirier was over two hundred pounds before he started training MMA.

 

[Fedorgasm]

flyweights would wreck any untrained man regardless of their size

Untrained man, yes. But big men that trained MMA casually for 2 months or so would be able to wreck any flyweight.

It's depressing to think about, but size makes an incredible difference. And the skill gap has to be gigantic to make up for it.

 

[hendosan]

To put the "average man" into perspective, Dustin Poirier was over two hundred pounds before he started training MMA.

Joe Riggs used to look like this:

And now he's a cut up welterweight

 

[Automatic Man]

I F'ing so hated the worthless garbage OW freakshow B.S. that Pride used to sponsor. One such fight in particular disgusted me so bad that I actually wound up happy that they folded.

Go rewatch the Bushido where extremely skilled and experienced MMA fighter Minnow-man fights a heavyweight relative newby to MMA (Cro-Cop).

Are you serious, Cro Cop at that point was already a kickboxing veteran!!!! how does this relate to the argument

 

[Shael]

I know what you're talking about and that's not what he said.
Press conference for UFC 146 I think.

He didn't say no one cares about flyweights...he was answering a question about why heavyweight fighters are different than other fighters.

He said most people say because theyre bigger they can still beat a bunch of UFC fighters...but if you think that about heavyweight fighters you're stupid

This, I didn't read the whole thread but I'm assuming everyone ignored this post and went on to talk about the OP out of context.

 

[Automatic Man]

Talking about skilled flyweights vs. untrained bigger guys is one thing. Talking them vs.a trained HW is ridiculous. I'm saying this now, there is no way, none, that MM takes down Mir, ever. To much of a wright disparity and not enough disparity in skill set.

I wasnt talking about MM specifically, but yes, I do think that Benevidez, Mendez etc could take Mir down. Absolutely. Not saying they could definitely keep him down for an extended period of time, they are small dudes but the strength they have is not proportionate to size. not to mention, they are not 125-135 at the time of the fight some of them are pretty close to 200lbs. and they absolutely, positively, have the power to crack a HW's chin, or at the very least use thier speed to land enough shots to really wear them down.

 

[theMarshal]

keep in mind, a HUGE difference is made by the common misconceptions of untrained people about fighting.

an untrained person has absolutely a different idea on what fighting is to a trained person. hence the untrained person doesnt value qualities that he THINKS are irrelevant.

two untrained people fight in the following manner usualy:
person A punches person B. person B is FORBIDDEN to block or dodge.("natural born runner", "coward" etc)
person B retaliates. "i punch you, you punch me, lets see who the bigger man is/who wants the most/other such crap". this is why the phrase "trade blows" came to existance.

two trained people fight by using jabs, footwork, cutting angles, etc. an untrained fighter has NEVER seen/felt/valued these things; he realy thinks Mighty Mouse' footwork is irrelevant in a fight because, like, "he cant strike & move, bro! he must just trade blows otherwise he violates some guy code!!!!"

i am an amateur MMA fighter, and i am not a badass, not even in my own gym; but when a friend of mine (not too bigger, but MUCH stronger than me and most everyone i know) insisted i'd have no chance, i realy gave him gloves for a bit and we sparred. NOT a full fight, just sparred for a bit to show him the difference. he couldnt do anything because he'd never understand things such as grappling, positioning, control, footwork, but only what Van Damme movies showcased "you punch me i kick you, but basicaly we just trade blows".

if what an average person thinks is that fighting is oly a fair trade of blows and that using tactics, control and fotwork is "cheating" or "cowardice", then yeah, i see why they think smaller fighters have no chance. they basicaly think technique is either "coward's way" or unimportant/irrelevant alltogether.

 

[The_Renaissance]

Mir is right, some idiots may think that. Just like Chael says there are also people who think that bigfoot exists, that Elvis Presley is alive, that alien abductions happen, etc...

Yep, Chael's one of them actually, said so on the Rogan podcast.

pretty sure if you were trained in like krav maga or something and trained for eye gouges, fish hooks, nut shots, etc you could take out a silverback

Ummm. No.
You wouldn't get past a chimp with krav maga, let alone a gorilla. You think a gorilla's gonna stop fighting coz you gouge out its eye? This isn't a person you're fighting here - a gorilla's gonna rip off half of your face and crush your skull with its bare hands. If you were fighting a gorilla in close enough range to eye gouge or fishhook it, you'd be dead before you could consider doing of those things....I can't believe I'm explaining this, actually.


Anyway, MM would beat any untrained guy.
MM on the other hand wouldn't beat any top HW in the UFC, therefore it's a moot point - that's what the comparison should be. MM doesn't have the power to hurt men who regularly take haymakers from men who weigh almost 3 times as much as MM.

He is also not superman - he isn't taking those guys down.

 

[hendosan]

if what an average person thinks is that fighting is oly a fair trade of blows and that using tactics, control and fotwork is "cheating" or "cowardice", then yeah, i see why they think smaller fighters have no chance. they basicaly think technique is either "coward's way" or unimportant/irrelevant alltogether.

Nick Diaz lol

 

[screaminleeman]

Are you serious, Cro Cop at that point was already a kickboxing veteran!!!! how does this relate to the argument

Weight classes exist for a good reason. Nothing of any value ever came out of that goofy B.S. that PRIDE tried to shove down our throats.

If you enjoyed that circus crap, more power to you. Don't however act as though it either answered any questions or served any real purpose outside of sating a small minority of MMA fans curiosity in David vs Goliath story lines.

Garbage that is 100% more suited for pro Wrasslin' then MMA. As a child it was hysterical watching a massive Wrassler pile drive a midget. STAGED!!! I do not have the child like mentality watching MMA.

I am glad that Mirko met with such wonderful success in the UFC HW division after nearly murdering a man that he outweighed by 60+ pounds!