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War Room Lounge v132: Jack used rhetoric. It’s not very effective...

Which Simpsons character would you like to be for a day?

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BarryDillon said:
Strongly disagree.

There is a huge amount of space between: "The Founding Fathers were infallible geniuses to be deified.", and, "The Founding Fathers were monsters because they owned slaves, etc.".

That space is where this conversation needs to occur.
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There is not a conversation or argument where they were infalliable. If you think that's the case, you don't talk in enough circles or read your history. They weren't infallable, they were humans who did more than anyone before them with the means of their day.

The problem with *that* conversation is that it always leads to one way or the other. And right now, some are leaning towards racist monsters. And I don't like that, regardless of what color that person is.
 
BarryDillon said:
<puh-lease75>
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And even with that response...are you saying there was another country like the United States of America before it was made? I mean there was the Republic of Rome, then they went Empire and all dictatorship. What else was there? Half-bred England with half-bred democracy? Ooooh, good one.
 
The Diplomat said:
Read the rest of the post and reply like a human please, instead of your usual shit.
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I know, you're bothsidesing again like a boring twat.

Also, you were clearly deifying the Founding Fathers with your description and language choice. Do you really not see how you contradicted yourself in that one sentence?
 
The Diplomat said:
And even with that response...are you saying there was another country like the United States of America before it was made? I mean there was the Republic of Rome, then they went Empire and all dictatorship. What else was there? Half-bred England with half-bred democracy? Ooooh, good one.
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You said, and I quote, "they were humans who did more than anyone before them.".

That's not deification? The Founding Fathers did more than anyone before them?

To advance humanity?

Get a grip, bud.
 
BarryDillon said:
I know, you're bothsidesing again like a boring twat.

Also, you were clearly deifying the Founding Fathers with your description and language choice. Do you really not see how you contradicted yourself in that one sentence?
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You aren't responding to anything I say. Just like fucking normal. Can't have an actual discussion, just take one sentence and respond with gifs.

This is why I'd rather you not respond to me. I think you have real discussion, and then you piss your pants like normal. Just don't even bother.
 
The Diplomat said:
Tommy Weisssisue is only relevant because he made possibly the worst unironic movie ever made, and never really understood why it was bad. Us cool kids on the interwebs have used The Room as a meme before memes were born. Then James Franco cashes in at our expense, the dick.
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What about ed wood movies? People were watching them to see a bad movie that was done seriously.
 
BarryDillon said:
You said, and I quote, "they were humans who did more than anyone before them.".

That's not deification? The Founding Fathers did more than anyone before them?

To advance humanity?

Get a grip, bud.
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Yes, they did. You're honestly saying there was another country like the United States before the United States?

Name one.
 
Also, I never compared them to other leaders. I was, and am, talking about the way the constitution and our nation is viewed. There are a lot of myths about American exceptionalism, and infallibility. This country was built on slavery, and genocide, and there's never been a real accounting for it.

Not even close.
 
BarryDillon said:
Also, I never compared them to other leaders. I was, and am, talking about the way the constitution and our nation is viewed. There are a lot of myths about American exceptionalism, and infallibility. This country was built on slavery, and genocide, and there's never been a real accounting for it.

Not even close.
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You're changing the subject. That shit was already acknowledged in school history books, if you cared to read them in school. Unlike Russia or China, we are allowed to acknowledge our faults. The problem is some like you now want to make the founding fathers out to be evil bastards.
 
The Diplomat said:
Yes, they did. You're honestly saying there was another country like the United States before the United States?

Name one.
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I'm saying the idea that the Founding Fathers did more for humanity than any men before them is laughable.

It completely ridiculous.

And yes, there have been plenty of countries "like" the United States. Greece, Rome, and so on.
 
BarryDillon said:
I'm saying the idea that the Founding Fathers did more for humanity than any men before them is laughable.

It completely ridiculous.

And yes, there have been plenty of countries "like" the United States. Greece, Rome, and so on.
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I didn't say they did more humanity, I said they did anyone before, which meant democratically and lawfully. And you know what? Now I'm adding humanity, because we fed the world afterwards.
 
The Diplomat said:
You're changing the subject. That shit was already acknowledged in school history books, if you cared to read them in school. Unlike Russia or China, we are allowed to acknowledge our faults. The problem is some like you now want to make the founding fathers out to be evil bastards.
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Now you're just making up a narrative to feel better. You haven't even asked what I actually think. Just assumed my position.
 
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