International "Trump-class Battleships"

[aerius]

Ukraine has a few versions of sea drones that they've put anti-air missiles on. They even rigged some with air-to-air missiles that launch from the sea drone. But they've built a more professional version with their Magura V7 drone:

AP reveals rare photos of Ukraine’s Magura V7 sea drone armed with anti-aircraft missiles

Efrem Lukatsky, chief of the Associated Press bureau in Ukraine, has released rare images of Ukraine’s Magura V7 naval drone.

english.nv.ua

The USA could easily build these small sea drones who's only job is to carry anti-air missiles and launch them from a drone carrier ship. They extend the range of your anti-air missiles and if you lose them, you still don't take any casualties.

This is where I do my lecture on understanding weapons systems and capabilities. Ukraine uses sea drones because they don't have any warships and it's the only way they have to contest Russian forces over the Black Sea. There's no other way for them to shoot at planes & ships since Russian glide bomb and missile range is longer than any of the land based anti-ship or air defence systems operated by the Ukrainians. That's why they have to use suicide drones against ships and drones with short range SAMs to try and hit Russian planes over the Black Sea before they can drop their glide bombs.

Sea drones with anti-air missiles don't make sense for the US since the main threat to US warships isn't airplanes or other ships; in a conflict against China, Iran, or Russia the main threat is going to be large salvos of supersonic & hypersonic missiles which a drone based AA system doesn't have the kinematic performance to defend against. To even have a chance against newer generation missiles requires an interceptor missile with the performance of an SM6 or preferably the SM3, you're gonna need a pretty big platform to fit those missiles on it. 4 missiles per sea drone is a pretty reasonable load-out, that will get you to something that's between the size of a PBR and Swift Boat, ballpark, around 40-45' long and 15-20 ton displacement. Gonna be hard to fit enough of these on a drone carrier ship to be useful.

Then of course you need to design & build all the new ships & systems, given the complete debacle they had with the Constellation class frigates I doubt the US could do it even if they wanted to.

 

[nostradumbass]

Pretty sure they're just rolling out the worst ideas possible to see how long people like @nostradumbass will defend them.

It's the worst idea possible! So says the worst poster in the WR award winner.

 

[PBAC]

Pretty sure they're just rolling out the worst ideas possible to see how long people like @nostradumbass will defend them.

He should name a card game after himself to appeal to people who think having more makes you correct 100% of the time as opposed to learning how to play a real game like chess or poker.

 

[Rational Poster]

It's the worst idea possible! So says the worst poster in the WR award winner.

Man I was hoping you could do better than this, pretty sad really.

 

[sickc0d3r]

Will they always chicken out?

 

[nostradumbass]

Man I was hoping you could do better than this, pretty sad really.

Were you? You seem pretty bummed every time you make an ass yourself and get wrecked, but now you're really hoping for it and get "sad" when your trolling is disregarded? Nice.

 

[Rational Poster]

Were you? You seem pretty bummed every time you make an ass yourself and get wrecked, but now you're really hoping for it and get "sad" when your trolling is disregarded? Nice.

No I was really looking forward to you trying to tell everyone how building a battleship after they've been obsolete for nearly 100 years is a good things we should spend our tax dollars on.

 

[ermac88]

I wish our President wasn't a retard.

Face reality! He is!

The more I think about it, Gillis was right — I think he actually is autistic

Not sure about autism or retardation

His psychiatrist niece has diagnosed him with a learning disability coupled with several disorder including sociopathy

Psychological Concepts in Mary Trump's Memo​

Psychological Concepts in Mary Trump's Memoir

With an open mind, beyond politics, readers may actually reflect upon their own families, the installers of their buttons, as they dig into the memoir by Mary L. Trump, Ph.D.

www.psychologytoday.com

No mystery why he loves the poorly educated

 

[Alpha_T83]

Ukraine was able to pull it off because they knew where the enemy was (aka the drones were hanging out near a Russian base. You don't get the same luxury at sea, where you have to defend a radius of hundreds of miles.

You're proposing a solution that is worse than just having fighter cover or literally any naval SAMs.

Did you not notice how close the Su-30 was in the shoot down video?

You're running into basic physics problems. There's only so much you can do to make a small vessel a capable warship in open waters. The reason the Sidewinder was used was because it's extremely light, hence the useless range for naval warfare. Why put less capable missiles on drone platforms for air defense when you have destroyers that are more capable of detecting and destroying targets and carry far more missiles?

Drones will have a role, but it's more in littoral environments. The reason drones are so effective is because countermeasures haven't caught up. They will eventually, and then you'll see a new balance.

IDK I think you could easily make a massive drone carrier that could hold hundreds of these types of drones after the US improves them. Their range could easily be boosted to 800+km. Is the Aim 9X range short? Sure. But that's why you send them 200-300km out to form a massive circumference. Even at 300km radius, you still need less than 100 drones every 20km to form full 360 degree coverage. These drones could also be equipped with a small number of Ukraine-style interceptor drones, the tiny ones they use to intercept Shahed drones.

Probably the biggest risk of approaching fighter jets would be those that are low to the water's surface and more difficult for radar to detect. These drones would shine at deflecting those. Fighter jets high in the sky can and should be dealt with by AIM-120D AMRAAMs anyway. And if these sea drones get destroyed, great. They are expendable, and now you've identified where you are getting attacked from.

I'm not convinced destroyers will be able to adequately deflect drone swarms in the future. I think having a layered circle of loitering air defense drone platforms like this will be necessary. But we shall see.

 

[Alpha_T83]

This is where I do my lecture on understanding weapons systems and capabilities. Ukraine uses sea drones because they don't have any warships and it's the only way they have to contest Russian forces over the Black Sea. There's no other way for them to shoot at planes & ships since Russian glide bomb and missile range is longer than any of the land based anti-ship or air defence systems operated by the Ukrainians. That's why they have to use suicide drones against ships and drones with short range SAMs to try and hit Russian planes over the Black Sea before they can drop their glide bombs.

Sea drones with anti-air missiles don't make sense for the US since the main threat to US warships isn't airplanes or other ships; in a conflict against China, Iran, or Russia the main threat is going to be large salvos of supersonic & hypersonic missiles which a drone based AA system doesn't have the kinematic performance to defend against. To even have a chance against newer generation missiles requires an interceptor missile with the performance of an SM6 or preferably the SM3, you're gonna need a pretty big platform to fit those missiles on it. 4 missiles per sea drone is a pretty reasonable load-out, that will get you to something that's between the size of a PBR and Swift Boat, ballpark, around 40-45' long and 15-20 ton displacement. Gonna be hard to fit enough of these on a drone carrier ship to be useful.

Then of course you need to design & build all the new ships & systems, given the complete debacle they had with the Constellation class frigates I doubt the US could do it even if they wanted to.

Yea you would need to completely re-design a new ship specifically to carry a large amount of these drones, and other drones.

You're right that today's war is large salvos of ballistic/cruise missiles at supersonic & hypersonic speeds. However, the Ukraine war has already shown that might not be the long-term problem. If both sides survive the initial salvos, you can get into this longer attrition warfare with longer-range drone swarms, like Shahed drones or other small drones. You can't use expensive surface-to-air missiles on these, the same way you can ballistic or cruise missiles. They are too numerous and cheap.

I'm assuming these drone boats will be able to carry Ukraine-style interceptor drones that are being developed (and used) right now to shoot down Shahed drones. They don't have much range, but they can shoot down even the jet versions of Shahed.

IDK how well the US destroyers will handle Shahed or other drone swarms if they are ever attacked by them. I know US naval CRAM style defense guns are impressive [edit: I forgot the Phalanx CIWS was the naval version], but how many drones can they handle?

 

[oldshadow]

Ill wait to see more details on the design to say if its a good idea or not.

 

[Natural Order]

I'm sure this fuckhead sat down with the engineers to redraw the stealth components.

What a fucking joke.

 

[johnsmithjohnson]

I wish our President wasn't a retard.

I wish he didn't rape kids with Epstein for 15 years.

 

[johnsmithjohnson]

Don't forget about him and Bubba.

And he is wearing Orange Women's make up. It's a foundation not a spray tan. You can tell when I rains.

Who knew a man who wears bright orange women's make up everyday was a Kidophile
No warning signs.

 

[oldshadow]

No I was really looking forward to you trying to tell everyone how building a battleship after they've been obsolete for nearly 100 years is a good things we should spend our tax dollars on.

It depends on its design and capabilities. Share what you know about this and why this class of ship will be obsolete when its launched. Are you saying it will just have the same as WW2 class.

 

[44nutman]

Any President after FDR using tax dollars to buy a Battleship should rightly be called a fucking idiot.

 

[Rational Poster]

It depends on its design and capabilities. Share what you know about this and why this class of ship will be obsolete when its launched. Are you saying it will just have the same as WW2 class.

The explicit claim is that it will be the "biggest battleship" ever built which guarantees it will be obsolete. The issue isn't the capability, but the size. There's already concern over the viability of aircraft carriers in an actual war because of how big they are.

 

[ShadowRun]

Love the outrage, it is stupid his name is attached to a ship though. Don't worry the next dem president will remove that and get to put USS George Floyd

Here are the major warships (combatants like destroyers, submarines, littoral combat ships, etc.) that were commissioned into the US Navy during Joe Biden's presidency (2021–2025). Approximately 27 in total, primarily Arleigh Burke-class destroyers, Virginia-class submarines, and the remaining Littoral Combat Ships

 

[Mr Holmes]

Idiocracy wasn't supposed to be a blueprint.

 

[Nizam al-Mulk]

Love the outrage, it is stupid his name is attached to a ship though. Don't worry the next dem president will remove that and get to put USS George Floyd

Why do you think the people against this would want that other kind of idiocy?