Top 10 Heavyweights ever

Brazilian007 said:
Yeah LHW Fedor destroys Jon Jones and Cormier
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Not that sure about that, because both could exploit Fedor's main weakness which is TD defense and game off his back. Of course he could beat them too, but is rather 50\50 imo
 
pankrat said:
Not that sure about that, because both could exploit Fedor's main weakness which is TD defense and game off his back. Of course he could beat them too, but is rather 50\50 imo
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Fedor was only ever takendown by stronger guys largelly. At LHW he would of been as strong roughly. Could Cormier get him down no doubt but to keep the Judo Sambo elite down? No way and Cormier striking is vastly inferior.
 
DayV said:
So what.
Ye, because Cro Cop actually fought during his career, which fighter should do, and gave opportunities to all comers to fight him; while they did not. They fought once per year, calculating, and avoiding taking risk. Modern MMA makes a taboo out of losing (guess UFC drew it's analogy from professional boxing) and taking fights and aditional risk. If you did not fight additional opponents, that does not mean that you are unbeatable. If you fought only a few top opponents, it does not mean that someone lesser known HW can not beat you if he has his day. You have an example of JDS who is basically the only modern fighter HW who fought from his early 20s to late 30s, and as soon as he accumulated a little bit more matches, he came from unbeatable look, and 15-1, to 10 losses. Fighter should fight as many different dangerous opponents of different profile as possible, and not bussiness optimising his career taking as few matches as possible. And they got their shots to get titles and belts when it was their turn, whie due to unforseen circumstances when it was Mirko's turn to fight for no. 1 place against Fedor, he instead fought anonymous Gonzaga in rules that totally changed over night.

The more you fight, the more you will lose; the more different MMA rulesets you change, the more you will lose.

The claim that fighter should fight as less as possible in order to avoid losses, so he would "look unbeatable", which is a modern paradigma, is apsurd and against fighting spirit. Credit goes to fighter who fought more, got more defeats, took more risk, but significantly more good wins, than to fighter who fought less in order to fakely look "allways" good and "unbeatable".
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{<redford}
 
trollkin said:
#1 Fedor unbeaten for 10 years
#2 Nog, champ of Pride and UFC
#3 Stipe best of the UFC
#4 Cain beast in his prime
#5 Werdum/ Igor
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10 years huh?


martin lazarov (0-2)
levon lagilava (1-3)
hiroya takada (1-3)
mihail apostolov (0-1)
ryushi yanagisawa (24-25)
lee hasdell (9-14)
chris haseman (20-17)
gary goodridge (23-22)
yuji nagata (0-2)
naoya ogawa (7-2)
zulu (9-9)
hong man choi (4-5)
jaideep singh (2-3)
 
ermac88 said:
10 years huh?


martin lazarov (0-2)
levon lagilava (1-3)
hiroya takada (1-3)
mihail apostolov (0-1)
ryushi yanagisawa (24-25)
lee hasdell (9-14)
chris haseman (20-17)
gary goodridge (23-22)
yuji nagata (0-2)
naoya ogawa (7-2)
zulu (9-9)
hong man choi (4-5)
jaideep singh (2-3)
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13 cans

Some people dont care and many current fighters did not get that priviledge
 
Brazilian007 said:
13 cans

Some people dont care and many current fighters did not get that priviledge
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That dude posts that garbage in every Fedor thread. He knows how dishonest it is.

Look at his first name—Martin Lazarov. That’s Fedor’s first fight lol. Both Lazarov and Fedor were 0-0 going into that fight. Levon Lagilava was Fedor’s 2nd fight. Hitoya Takada was Fedor’s 3rd fight. And those 3 fights happened in a 5 month period. Fedor gets hate for fighting cans in the first 5 months of his career? He also ignores context. So for example, Chris Haseman isn’t the most elite fighter ever lol, but they were in a tournament together in RINGS, and Haseman won his fights up to that point. He fought Fedor because he won fights to get to that point.

It’s also kind of dishonest to use those fighters’ overall records when they retired, rather that what they were when their fights with Fedor happened. It’d be like if I said GSP fought a “can” named BJ Penn with 16-14-2 record. That’s BJ’s record at the end of his career after sticking around way too long, it wouldn’t give an honest picture.
And some of those are just wrong btw—like “Zulu (9-9).” Zulu has literally never been 9-9 at any point in his career. I have no idea where he pulled that record from. Officially, his record was 7-0-1 when he fought Fedor.
That dude’s post is just a shitpost from a troll.
 
BFoe said:
That dude posts that garbage in every Fedor thread. He knows how dishonest it is.

Look at his first name—Martin Lazarov. That’s Fedor’s first fight lol. Both Lazarov and Fedor were 0-0 going into that fight. Levon Lagilava was Fedor’s 2nd fight. Hitoya Takada was Fedor’s 3rd fight. And those 3 fights happened in a 5 month period. Fedor gets hate for fighting cans in the first 5 months of his career? He also ignores context. So for example, Chris Haseman isn’t the most elite fighter ever lol, but they were in a tournament together in RINGS, and Haseman won his fights up to that point. He fought Fedor because he won fights to get to that point.

It’s also kind of dishonest to use those fighters’ overall records when they retired, rather that what they were when their fights with Fedor happened. It’d be like if I said GSP fought a “can” named BJ Penn with 16-14-2 record. That’s BJ’s record at the end of his career after sticking around way too long, it wouldn’t give an honest picture.
And some of those are just wrong btw—like “Zulu (9-9).” Zulu has literally never been 9-9 at any point in his career. I have no idea where he pulled that record from. Officially, his record was 7-0-1 when he fought Fedor.
That dude’s post is just a shitpost from a troll.
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I am saying Stipe and Ngannou have not had that luxury neither does Pavlovich. I just looked at Pavlovichs wikipedia he fought 9 guys without pages but only 2 of them dont have a winning record and those were his first 2 fights ever.

Ngannou lost to a can so that harms his resume overall

Stipe only beat 3 guys who lacked winning records and all early on
 
Brazilian007 said:
I am saying Stipe and Ngannou have not had that luxury neither does Pavlovich. I just looked at Pavlovichs wikipedia he fought 9 guys without pages but only 2 of them dont have a winning record and those were his first 2 fights ever.

Ngannou lost to a can so that harms his resume overall

Stipe only beat 3 guys who lacked winning records and all early on
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I don’t think it’s much of a luxury when guys fought as often as they did back then. Stipe is on the break of retirement after fighting 24 fights in 11 years. Fedor fought that many in less than 5 years. And it’s not all cans: Fedor has more ranked wins than Stipe, he has more title wins than Stipe, he has more title defenses than Stipe, he’s beaten more former and future champs than Stipe… it’s actually difficult to find a significant metric where Fedor isn’t ahead of Stipe.

It’s also interesting how fans view some of this stuff. That dude who posted that list of “cans” included Naoya Ogawa, for example. Ogawa isn’t a can. Ogawa was an Olympic medalist in judo with a 7-0 MMA record, and Fedor fought him the same night that he rematched Nogueira. Imagine for a moment if the UFC signed Bo Nickal, booked him against Ngannou first thing, and Francis went out and smoked his ass, then kicked his feet up in the locker room for a bit before going out to rematch Ciryl Gane at the same event. Sherdog would lose its collective mind. But somehow Fedor gets shit on for it lol.
 
DanAndroid said:
1. reserved for Jon Jones when he finally fights
2. Fedor
3. Big Nog
4. Werdum
5. Stipe
6. Cro Cop
7. DC
8. Cain
9. Barnett
10. JDS
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Even though I can't stand DC and the fake Mexican for some reason, I could agree with this list.
 
BFoe said:
I don’t think it’s much of a luxury when guys fought as often as they did back then. Stipe is on the break of retirement after fighting 24 fights in 11 years. Fedor fought that many in less than 5 years. And it’s not all cans: Fedor has more ranked wins than Stipe, he has more title wins than Stipe, he has more title defenses than Stipe, he’s beaten more former and future champs than Stipe… it’s actually difficult to find a significant metric where Fedor isn’t ahead of Stipe.

It’s also interesting how fans view some of this stuff. That dude who posted that list of “cans” included Naoya Ogawa, for example. Ogawa isn’t a can. Ogawa was an Olympic medalist in judo with a 7-0 MMA record, and Fedor fought him the same night that he rematched Nogueira. Imagine for a moment if the UFC signed Bo Nickal, booked him against Ngannou first thing, and Francis went out and smoked his ass, then kicked his feet up in the locker room for a bit before going out to rematch Ciryl Gane at the same event. Sherdog would lose its collective mind. But somehow Fedor gets shit on for it lol.
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Fedor has 5x title defenses yes impressive

Stipe also lost to Struve but he never lost to a MW but at the same time Fedor himself is really a LHW or a large MW
 
BFoe said:
I don’t think it’s much of a luxury when guys fought as often as they did back then. Stipe is on the break of retirement after fighting 24 fights in 11 years. Fedor fought that many in less than 5 years. And it’s not all cans: Fedor has more ranked wins than Stipe, he has more title wins than Stipe, he has more title defenses than Stipe, he’s beaten more former and future champs than Stipe… it’s actually difficult to find a significant metric where Fedor isn’t ahead of Stipe.

It’s also interesting how fans view some of this stuff. That dude who posted that list of “cans” included Naoya Ogawa, for example. Ogawa isn’t a can. Ogawa was an Olympic medalist in judo with a 7-0 MMA record, and Fedor fought him the same night that he rematched Nogueira. Imagine for a moment if the UFC signed Bo Nickal, booked him against Ngannou first thing, and Francis went out and smoked his ass, then kicked his feet up in the locker room for a bit before going out to rematch Ciryl Gane at the same event. Sherdog would lose its collective mind. But somehow Fedor gets shit on for it lol.
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Thing is I will put Stipe over Fedor in a head to head but careerwise I wont put Stipe above him. I think Stipe would beat Fedor in more cases than Fedor beats Stipe.

We have to realize Fedor small stature, level of opponents he beat wasent always on par to the modern UFC

If Gane revanges his loss and defends 3x or 4x I have to put him above Fedor

If Ngannou defends 3x more I have to put him above Fedor

My guess is Gane will surpass Fedor or Pavlovich will. My hope is Pavlovich does

What would a HW have to do to surpass Fedor in your opinion?
 
spinup said:
If you mean Zoumana Cisse, it was 3 months after he started training, and not even a MMA fight (weird 2 rounds pancrace rules). Should not even be on his record.
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But it is. And it isnt a good look for any GOAT to have a loss to a can
 
MXZT said:
How do you even say Stipe is the best HW. You actually consider him one of the all-time GOATs?
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I don't have him at no 1 but how the fuck can you not even consider him one of the HW goats?
 
SlomiGa said:
I don't have him at no 1 but how the fuck can you not even consider him one of the HW goats?
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I'm talking about all-time GOATs, No question Stipe is second in the HW GOAT rankings. But he's nowhere near being the all-time GOAT rankings.
 
The top 4 is obvious and they can be whatever order makes you happiest:
Fedor, Nogueira, Werdum, and Stipe.

The next tier down I would give to two guys:
JDS and Cain

The next tier down is a bunch of names and they're all interchangeable imo:
Ngannou, Cormier, Sylvia, Mir, Arlovski, Overeem, Cro Cop, and Barnett
 
Taric said:
The top 4 is obvious and they can be whatever order makes you happiest:
Fedor, Nogueira, Werdum, and Stipe.

The next tier down I would give to two guys:
JDS and Cain

The next tier down is a bunch of names and they're all interchangeable imo:
Ngannou, Cormier, Sylvia, Mir, Arlovski, Overeem, Cro Cop, and Barnett
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Cain is obviously above JDS so you can put him in the top tier
 
Taric said:
The top 4 is obvious and they can be whatever order you want to put them in:
Fedor, Nogueira, Werdum, and Stipe.

The next tier down I would give to two guys:
JDS and Cain

The next tier down is a bunch of names and they're all interchangeable imo:
Ngannou, Cormier, Sylvia, Mir, Arlovski, Overeem, Cro Cop, and Barnett
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Nog does not belong. I dont know how many times I have to keep doing this

Big Nog is not top 4

Let alone not top 3

Fedor
Stipe
Werdum

Then either Cain or JDS
 
Brazilian007 said:
Nog does not belong. I dont know how many times I have to keep doing this

Big Nog is not top 4

Let alone not top 3

Fedor
Stipe
Werdum

Then either Cain or JDS
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No one cares what you have to keep doing.
 
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