Economy The [Wall / Government Shutdown] Megathread

[7437]

I'm actually surprised by the lack of votes for "I am a Trump supporter and I don't support the use of emergency funds." I thought there would be at least some posters who support trump but have some semblance of sense or principle.

Why would you think that

 

[hillelslovak87]

Calm down and have a Soylent, npc#324234523432
Don't be mad your dems lie just like obama promising transparency
He used the NSA and made it more difficult for the freedom of press act to be taken advantage than any other president.
Gg breh. Keep supporting phile NWO elites

What does Obama have to do with Trump, his claims and his failures? Jesus Christ, did your post come from a shit buzzword generator?

 

[Islam Imamate]

They will be without pay again as soon as trump wants something if the dems just give in. Trump has shown to have no idea how to deal with Congress on any level. Of he finds that shutting the government down gets him what he wants, he will shut down the government to get what he wants.

If next time he tries it over something worth fighting for then I would fully support the Dems digging in their heels. But it seems to me they are looking for a symbolic victory and I don't quite like that when so many people are suffering.

 

[7437]

If next time he tries it over something worth fighting for then I would fully support the Dems digging in their heels. But it seems to me they are looking for a symbolic victory and I don't quite like that when so many people are suffering.

Appeasement is never a good strategy.

 

[Islam Imamate]

im going to bed so i wont be able to respond for a while, but i had to post


A President said "give me the thing i want, or i shut down the government". and then he did.

can you really not see the problem with giving in to this?

yeah, this is worth fighting for.

Obama did the same thing for Obamacare. Not going to equate the two because Obamacare was, despite it warts, a worthwhile policy while Trump's wall really isn't in comparison and Obama came to a deal faster and Obama had more tact in addressing the suffering of those affected by the shutdown. But the point is its not entirely unprecedented.

Appeasement is never a good strategy.

This is just intransigence for the sake of intransigence, basically looking for a moral victory. Politicians doing that at the cost of the suffering of hundreds of thousands of Americans isn't a virtue.

 

[Islam Imamate]

That's all true but the US is also much richer and it doesn't need to be as efficient as the Israeli wall. A 50% reduction in the number of migrants would still be pretty big.

If they added more fence line specifically in the Rio Grande Valley which sees more border crossings than the other regions by a significant margin I can't say I'd be too opposed to it so long as the impact on the environment was kept to a minimum but at this point it seems like Trump wants as grand a wall as possible just to score a symbolic victory. And that's really what annoys me about this government shutdown, both sides are digging in their heels and making hundreds of thousands of Americans suffer for what amounts to a symbolic victory either way.

I'm actually surprised by the lack of votes for "I am a Trump supporter and I don't support the use of emergency funds." I thought there would be at least some posters who support trump but have some semblance of sense or principle.

I'm surprised but only a little, Trumptards aren't the most principled bunch.

 

[Barteh]

Damn almost 70% of doggers are against one of the best presidents of the USA of the last decades. Are there many foreigners voting on the poll?

 

[7437]

Damn almost 70% of doggers are against one of the best presidents of the USA of the last decades. Are there many foreigners voting on the poll?

Trump is top 3 in the past 18 years for sure.

 

[7437]

Obama did the same thing for Obamacare. Not going to equate the two because Obamacare was, despite it warts, a worthwhile policy while Trump's wall really isn't in comparison and Obama came to a deal faster and Obama had more tact in addressing the suffering of those affected by the shutdown. But the point is its not entirely unprecedented.

This is just intransigence for the sake of intransigence, basically looking for a moral victory. Politicians doing that at the cost of the suffering of hundreds of thousands of Americans isn't a virtue.

It's not a moral victory. It is important to not allow the president to threaten America when he doesn't get his way.

 

[Islam Imamate]

It's not a moral victory. It is important to not allow the president to threaten America when he doesn't get his way.

Like I said, its not unprecedented. Obama did it as well. Like I said, I wouldn't equate the two entirely but you can't deny he resorted to a similar tactic.

 

[cincymma79]

It's not a moral victory. It is important to not allow the president to threaten America when he doesn't get his way.

 

[Throttlehead]

 

[kahiljabroni]

I guess that's why he's giving congress more time to think about it and run it through the normal process. Because it is such an emergency.

1. It's remarkable to me that when right wingers get offended, everyone is supposed to drop what their doing and listen without interrupting to how starbucks cups and football players kneeling are destroying our nation. But when anyone else says anything it's "stop being triggered snowflake". Am I angry? Fuck yes I'm angry, because we're in the midst of the longest government shutdown in history because the president is throwing a baby tantrum because he didn't get his way for once in his life. I have friends that spent Christmas with their family wondering how they're going to pay the rent. To me, if you don't get triggered by a president hurting nearly a million people as part of a baby tantrum, when the fuck can you get angry?

2. The fact that he tried to pass this in congress and it was voted down mean EVERYTHING!!! It literally throws the emergency powers act out the window because it is based off the assumption that the threat is imminent and theres no time to consult congess. Congress has been consulted and they decided that this wasn't a emergency of any kind. They decided that two years straight while Republicans owned Washington...so the fact that he tried to do this through congressional approval and it failed means it doesn't fall under the criteria of the emergency powers act. Again it's not designed as a backdoor way to ignore the congress.

3. Only alt right media pushes the narrative that Government agencies somehow go against the founders. There's literally no supporting evidence to support that position and tons to the contrary. It's also why appointees to said agencies often must be approved by congress...again, friends don't liet friends skip government day in school.

4. I love when alt righters parrot the exact arguments they heard on Fox, damn near word for word, then when you call them on it they always claim "I don't even watch Fox News". Just admit that you don't understand how the government works so you let Fox do the thinking for you.

The fact that you went on a tirade against me...a totally unknown entity, and voiced all of your frustrations with all "right wingers "as if I'm the embodiment of everything republican is why you're a joke.

Everything not explicitly listed as powers of the federal government are left to the states. There is actually a wealth of knowledge out there outlying how many federal agencies are unconstitutional. However I first heard about the topic in college level law classes.

And you should go reread the national emergencies act because the presidents powers are extremely broad.

 

[kahiljabroni]

No I wouldn’t. He’s had full control for 2 years and done fuck all, but now it’s the dems fault.

Cry baby Trump.

Did u forget about the media darlings flake and McCain..Trump never had the votes with those turn coats in the senate

 

[Hit-N-Run]

Republicans are spineless cowards. Biggest hypocrites on the planet. If Obama did .0005% of what this fucking lunatic president has done the Republicans would have shit themselves.

 

[Hognoxious]

White House thanks Jim Acosta for proving walls do work

CNN's Jim Acosta was mocked across social media for posting a video that was meant to downplay President Trump's claims of a border crisis, but ended up supporting his argument that border barriers improve security. Acosta is in Texas awaiting Trump's border visit. While Acosta often clashes with the president and his aides, pundits suggested he did the president a favor this time.

Is this logic from an unlikely source? Do you think Trump should send him a MAGA hat and a thank you note?

 

[Ripskater]

 

[Cake4Breakfast]

No serious person has ever taken the wall seriously (can anyone even define what "the wall" entails), it was always bullshit, which is why it took General Kelly about 2 seconds to cast the idea aside when he took over homeland security, and why almost nobody in the GOP house or GOP senate took it seriously, let alone advocated for it in the two years that they controlled the entire federal government.

LOL at people who thought Mexico would pay for it....now Trump is dropping the price he wants from Dems from 5 billion to 2 billion, like it's one of his condos where someone was murdered. Sam Nunberg explained where the idea of "building the wall" came from (spoiler alert, it didn't come from national security experts):


"Sam Nunberg told the New York Times getting Trump to talk about building a wall was the easiest way to get him to discuss immigration on the campaign trail.

Nunberg who advised Trump during his 2016 presidential campaign and was later subpoenaed by special counsel Robert Mueller as part of his investigation of the Russia probe, cited a conversation with fellow advisor Roger J. Stone Jr.

"How do we get him to continue to talk about immigration?" Nunberg said. "We're going to get him to talk about [sic] he's going to build a wall."

What was meant to serve initially as a way to encourage Trump to talk about immigration now sits at the center of the current partial government shutdown. All the while, the rhetoric around how or what exactly will be built has continued to change.

Outgoing White House chief of staff John Kelly said the addition to the southern US border wouldn't even actually be a wall.

https://www.businessinsider.com/for...as-the-easiest-way-to-talk-immigration-2019-1

 

[SBJJ]

No serious person has ever taken the wall seriously (can anyone even define what "the wall" entails), it was always bullshit, which is why it took General Kelly about 2 seconds to cast the idea aside when he took over homeland security, and why almost nobody in the GOP house or GOP senate took it seriously, let alone advocated for it in the two years that they controlled the entire federal government.

LOL at people who thought Mexico would pay for it....now Trump is dropping the price he wants from Dems from 5 billion to 2 billion, like it's one of his condos where someone was murdered. Sam Nunberg explained where the idea of "building the wall" came from (spoiler alert, it didn't come from national security experts):


"Sam Nunberg told the New York Times getting Trump to talk about building a wall was the easiest way to get him to discuss immigration on the campaign trail.

Nunberg who advised Trump during his 2016 presidential campaign and was later subpoenaed by special counsel Robert Mueller as part of his investigation of the Russia probe, cited a conversation with fellow advisor Roger J. Stone Jr.

"How do we get him to continue to talk about immigration?" Nunberg said. "We're going to get him to talk about [sic] he's going to build a wall."

What was meant to serve initially as a way to encourage Trump to talk about immigration now sits at the center of the current partial government shutdown. All the while, the rhetoric around how or what exactly will be built has continued to change.

Outgoing White House chief of staff John Kelly said the addition to the southern US border wouldn't even actually be a wall.

https://www.businessinsider.com/for...as-the-easiest-way-to-talk-immigration-2019-1

How many posters actually read all this....

Over 2.5 +210
Under 2.5 -230

 

[Hognoxious]

No serious person has ever taken the wall seriously

Wrong!
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/apr/2/border-patrol-agents-back-trump-wall-survey-finds/