Television The Star Trek Thread V6.0

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

On to the start of season 2 of TNG and actually I would say the first season was rather better than my memory, by the last third of so does get a good deal closer to the classic tone of the show than I remember although granted the "say no to drugs!" speech form Tasha is probably the most dated thing in the entire series.

I spose part of the issue there is that a lot of those episodes almost feel like dry runs, concepts the show went back to more effectively latter on when it was more established and didn't need to spend so much time on selling its concepts/characters. Its actually the earlier stuff where the show is searching for its style and feeling more like TOS that tend to stick in the mind more because there so different to what we saw latter on, but really there are only a handful of pure cheese episodes.

I've recently watched TOS season 3, where the show was dying and the budget slashed.

Some of the scripts are super cheesy, the direction is weird ep by ep, and there are some "so bad it's good" acting moments.

Remember the face Brock made when Reem's shin said hello to his midsection?

That's the look season 3 gives me

 

[moreorless87]

I've recently watched TOS season 3, where the show was dying and the budget slashed.

Some of the scripts are super cheesy, the direction is weird ep by ep, and there are some "so bad it's good" acting moments.

Remember the face Brock made when Reem's shin said hello to his midsection?

That's the look season 3 gives me

I remember growing up watching rather random reruns in the 80's I had the impression the season 3 stuff was actually the earlier material and the show had gotten more serious/better as it progressed rather than the reverse. It is quite surprising just how good TOS was right out of the gate, I spose partly the degree of built up talent/material.

Growing up watching sci fi in the mid 80's in the UK was in my experience quite different from the image people have these days, I mean yes I did see the likes of Starwars and Back to the Future via VHS rentals but the reality was most of what was on offer was much older. Classic Hollywood sci fi like War of the Worlds and 60's TV like TOS and Time Tunnel weren't really viewed as revivalism but rather all there was, TOS especially was still in the "did you see that last night" level at school. The only newer stuff was really Doctor Who which was really not too different in style a lot of the time.

When things changed they actually changed quite quickly, the BBC finally got TNG and Quantum Leap around 89-90 and you started to get a lot more modern films shown on TV as well, it was like shifting forward 2-3 decades in a couple of years.

 

[sverre054]

On to the start of season 2 of TNG and actually I would say the first season was rather better than my memory, by the last third of so does get a good deal closer to the classic tone of the show than I remember although granted the "say no to drugs!" speech form Tasha is probably the most dated thing in the entire series.

I spose part of the issue there is that a lot of those episodes almost feel like dry runs, concepts the show went back to more effectively latter on when it was more established and didn't need to spend so much time on selling its concepts/characters. Its actually the earlier stuff where the show is searching for its style and feeling more like TOS that tend to stick in the mind more because there so different to what we saw latter on, but really there are only a handful of pure cheese episodes.

Remember that season 2 occurred during a Hollywood writers strike. It was mainly written with left over season 1 scripts, spec scripts, and new show runner Maurice Hurley(coming from Miami vice). Hurley was pretty much hated by everyone and only lasted the one season. He does get credit In my book, for helping come up with the Borg

 

[sverre054]

Enjoying all the photoshop of the queen of England. Good thing she wore green screen colored dress

 

[TheRuthlessOne]

I've been continuing to watch Enterprise season 1 and I've come to the conclusion that I like Enterprise.

I think my favorite character is Captain Archer. So far he has shown a lot of layers to his character.

He starts off a little naive and a little trusting but eventually, he learns from his mistakes and becomes a better captain.

The temporal cold war shit definitely feels out of place. The super-tech future shit conflicts with the low tech present that the Enterprise takes place in.

The Temporal stuff is very Voyagerish but definitely not as good as Voyager shit. Daniels is a dork character and I don't know if I like him.

I remember when this show first came out a lot of people were saying T'Pol is just a fanservice character but I don't know if that's true

There is definitely some fan service but I find T'Pol to be an actual character that contributes almost every episode. She definitely isn't just an eye candy that I thought she would be.

 

[TheRuthlessOne]

A good episode in season 1 was "Dear Doctor"

Archer needs to decide if he should help this race who is suffering from this disease

Archer goes through a lot of stuff this episode and eventually I think he makes the right choice

it felt very TNG and it was probably my favorite episode

 

[moreorless87]

Remember that season 2 occurred during a Hollywood writers strike. It was mainly written with left over season 1 scripts, spec scripts, and new show runner Maurice Hurley(coming from Miami vice). Hurley was pretty much hated by everyone and only lasted the one season. He does get credit In my book, for helping come up with the Borg

There does seem to be some influence there, most obviously Ten Forward as an atmospheric bar but generally I think you see the look of the show shift more towards atmospheric lighting.

The big improvement I'd say is that the supporting cast become much better defined in season 2, Crusher to Polanski is a bit of a downgrade but Riker, Le Forge and Worf all improve a lot to the degree its not just Picard and Data keeping things afloat.

Getting the characters and the setting properly worked out makes for episodes with a bit more depth to them as well, a lot of season 1 episodes end up feeling like there missing a middle act to me, going straight from setup to conclusion, missing much conflict in the middle with failed attempts to solve whatever problem is being

 

[sverre054]

I've been continuing to watch Enterprise season 1 and I've come to the conclusion that I like Enterprise.

I think my favorite character is Captain Archer. So far he has shown a lot of layers to his character.

He starts off a little naive and a little trusting but eventually, he learns from his mistakes and becomes a better captain.

The temporal cold war shit definitely feels out of place. The super-tech future shit conflicts with the low tech present that the Enterprise takes place in.

The Temporal stuff is very Voyagerish but definitely not as good as Voyager shit. Daniels is a dork character and I don't know if I like him.

I remember when this show first came out a lot of people were saying T'Pol is just a fanservice character but I don't know if that's true

There is definitely some fan service but I find T'Pol to be an actual character that contributes almost every episode. She definitely isn't just an eye candy that I thought she would be.

Temporal stuff was all Brannon Braga, and he kinda lost interest in the series in general as it progressed, so they just abandoned. Future guy, was actually Archer. Most time jumping temporal stuff in TNG-ENT was Brannon Braga

 

[moreorless87]

Temporal stuff was all Brannon Braga, and he kinda lost interest in the series in general as it progressed, so they just abandoned. Future guy, was actually Archer. Most time jumping temporal stuff in TNG-ENT was Brannon Braga

Generally I think when you start to get into time travel you need a pretty good idea were you going, Braga's world on TNG and Voyager was I'd say more successful because it was confined to 1-2 episode arcs. Babylon 5 managed to pull off a long term plot with Time Travel but only by having a pretty good idea where it was going with the main writer also show runner.

 

[Joe_Armstrong]

Babylon 5 managed to pull off a long term plot with Time Travel but only by having a pretty good idea where it was going with the main writer also show runner.

Yeah,Straczinksy wrote an excellent plot for the man who would become Valen.
Here he is on Babylon 4 back in time.

 

[moreorless87]

Yeah,Straczinksy wrote an excellent plot for the man who would become Valen.
Here he is on Babylon 4 back in time.

I mean to be fair he didn't have a totally set plan, when the Babylon Squared episode was filmed in the first season the plot was going to be very different but he left that episode open ended enough that it could be returned to and used in the way he wanted.

The War Without End two partner though is I'd say the best use of time travel I can think of in this kind of show.

 

[TheRuthlessOne]

I've looked into Babylon 5 and yeah It looks bad

Looks like it takes a lot of effort to get into

Tons of quality issues with the effects

Different cuts of the pilot you need to track down

 

[sverre054]

I've looked into Babylon 5 and yeah It looks bad

Looks like it takes a lot of effort to get into

Tons of quality issues with the effects

Different cuts of the pilot you need to track down

Yeah, I tried to watch it recently, but couldn't get into it. I do remember watching it occasionally as a kid, but it has not aged well.

 

[JDragon]

I think I made a thread on this once. It must have been archived.

1. T'Pol

2. Hoshi

3. Jadzia

Go on...

 

[JDragon]

Das Warbird.

We actually say 'der Warbird'.

 

[JDragon]

So about Picard.


It started off well I think. The pilot episode was good. Yes, I wanted it to be good, but it really also was good.

Then things gradually got more random somehow. The worst thing is that like in Discovery, they never managed to make me care for any of the characters. Just write a proper plot, then I will also care about the characters, maybe. To make one example, somehow the writers seem to think that Jurati's pardoning was logical. In reality, she should have spent the entire episode in the brig. Riker as head of the Armada made zero sense, he has been baking pizza for over a decade. And then of course there is the need to make all characters 'grey'.

I thought the last 25 minutes of the final episode were super good. Relevant character interaction and the send-off that Data never got. I liked it. It just wasn't enough to make up for the entire season, which I rate mediocre in retrospective.

It's sad, because the optics were great, the setup was great, music was stunning, but delivery was bad.

Take production values and pacing of Picard, and combine it with Discovery, and you may get an acceptable series.

Let's see what Lower Decks brings.

 

[Loiosh]

We actually say 'der Warbird'.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

TOS episode "The Enemy Within"
A season 1 classic.
Sulu and landing party are stuck on a freezing planet.
There's a transporter malfunction and a nice, stupid, and confused Kirk beams up. Then a naughty, naughty Kirk shows up. The lighting for Evil Kirk is noteworthy, having rim lighting on his eyes that created a famous image.
Also noteworthy are the closeups used to visually express badness.

Kirk's naughty side likes overacting and rape, and assaults Yeoman Rand. He roughly fingers her beehive.

Gradually everybody figures out that naughty Kirk is running around the Enterprise jerking off onto every console.
Weak, stupid, indecisive Kirk eventually have a confrontation that Spock resolves with a pinch. Spock then blathers about the human condition to McCoy.

The two Kirks are reintegrated, the landing party is saved, and everybody smokes dope on the bridge.

Issues with the story:
Okay, the transporter is malfunctioning and it's a bad idea to beam up people.
Why not beam down shelters and blankets, etc.?
Also, there may be a throwaway line of dialogue that explains it, but why can't they send shuttlecraft?

This is one of the few times McCoy actually says "He's dead, Jim."

 

[JDragon]

TOS episode "The Enemy Within"
A season 1 classic.
Sulu and landing party are stuck on a freezing planet.
There's a transporter malfunction and a nice, stupid, and confused Kirk beams up. Then a naughty, naughty Kirk shows up. The lighting for Evil Kirk is noteworthy, having rim lighting on his eyes that created a famous image.
Also noteworthy are the closeups used to visually express badness.

Kirk's naughty side likes overacting and rape, and assaults Yeoman Rand. He roughly fingers her beehive.

Gradually everybody figures out that naughty Kirk is running around the Enterprise jerking off onto every console.
Weak, stupid, indecisive Kirk eventually have a confrontation that Spock resolves with a pinch. Spock then blathers about the human condition to McCoy.

The two Kirks are reintegrated, the landing party is saved, and everybody smokes dope on the bridge.

Issues with the story:
Okay, the transporter is malfunctioning and it's a bad idea to beam up people.
Why not beam down shelters and blankets, etc.?
Also, there may be a throwaway line of dialogue that explains it, but why can't they send shuttlecraft?

This is one of the few times McCoy actually says "He's dead, Jim."

Memory Alpha:

The transporter was depicted as the only mode of transport between a planet and the ship because this episode was written and filmed before the existence of the hangar deck and shuttlecraft were established, even though both of these locations are clearly built into the studio model of the Enterprise as seen in the episode. As the lack of a shuttlecraft was almost immediately pointed out as a plot error, production and writing staff later stated that perhaps the shuttlebay was simply out of service for repairs during this episode, which would explain why the crew did not use shuttles to rescue their comrades

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Memory Alpha:

The transporter was depicted as the only mode of transport between a planet and the ship because this episode was written and filmed before the existence of the hangar deck and shuttlecraft were established, even though both of these locations are clearly built into the studio model of the Enterprise as seen in the episode. As the lack of a shuttlecraft was almost immediately pointed out as a plot error, production and writing staff later stated that perhaps the shuttlebay was simply out of service for repairs during this episode, which would explain why the crew did not use shuttles to rescue their comrades