The Simpsons™ Destroyed By PC Goons. #ApuToo

[HereticBD]

This probably went over better in middle school than it does now.

So did taking offense at someone calling a celebrity a pussy, and then standing up for them like they were your dad.

 

[nac386]

A full length documentary was released on the subject.

There are thousands of documentaries. The fact that a documentary exists does not always translate to "immense social pressure from leftist puritans."

I think there's quite a bit of extreme talk going on in this thread.

 

[nac386]

So did taking offense at someone calling a celebrity a pussy, and then standing up for them like they were your dad.

Taking to the internet to call people you disagree with pussies is not offensive, it's just something you should be embarrassed by.

 

[panamaican]

You’re right and i don’t mean to say dismiss the argument simply because of the emotional aspect. What I’m saying is the fact your emotions are being manipulated(practically, not diabolically) should always be considered, and we have to try and weigh the validity of the argument when we react. If we made decisions strictly off of emotions, we’d have no legal system, no one would pay taxes or have to work etc.

Obviously this isn’t of that same magnitude but I think it’s pretty clear that if apu is used as an insult towards an Indian, that isn’t the simpsons or Apu or azaria’s fault, and it’s not the Indians fault(although how he reacts is his responsibility.)

We rational folk have to put our foot down(compassionately but firmly) when dealing with overly emotional and coddled people, even on small things like simpsons characters.

Your analogy doesn’t really match up to the situation, but if someone called him fat tony because he’s italian I’d tell him to have a sense of humor about it. If the kids were more malicious he’d have to learn to navigate those social waters and I’d guide him through it as best as I can. I would not allow him to think that the best solution is the simpsons getting rid of fat tony.

Sure, but nowhere in this story does Azaria state he is making an emotional decision. The fallacy in play is where people dismiss Azaria's actions as the result of emotional manipulation and not the result of his reaching a logical conclusion.

And if you create something that people use in a manner that you don't approve of, you might stop contributing to the misuse. If your neighbor takes your car and drives around shouting insults out the window. It's not your fault, it's not the fault of the person he is insulting. But it wouldn't make you weak to stop lending that person your car.

That doesn't make the people being insulted overly emotional or coddled. I've never understood how someone standing up for themselves makes them the coddled one.

And yes, my analogy does match up to the situation. You simply stopped short of fully exploring it. You say he'd have to learn how to navigate those social waters but you don't say how, More specifically, you don't say that he should just get over it and that you're fine with someone insulting your kid. You recognize that some action on someone's behalf is required, you don't say "I'll just ignore it."

 

[Seano]

what about that weird fat comic book molester looking guy?

Sherdog explodes.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

There are thousands of documentaries. The fact that a documentary exists does not always translate to "immense social pressure from leftist puritans."

I think there's quite a bit of extreme talk going on in this thread.

And very few of those documentaries are widely discussed in newspapers on on cable news.

So it is your position that a noted documentary featuring well known actors and actresses specifically criticizing on an actor's character does not amount to pressure on that actor?

 

[HereticBD]

There are thousands of documentaries. The fact that a documentary exists does not always translate to "immense social pressure from leftist puritans."

We're only talking about it, because the loony left made it a controversy, which was in part sparked by that doc. Do you really think Hank Azaria just decided to speak about this out of the fucking blue?

 

[nac386]

And very few of those documentaries are widely discussed in newspapers on on cable news.

So it is your position that a noted documentary featuring well known actors and actresses specifically criticizing on an actor's character does not amount to pressure on that actor?

Pressure, sure. "Immense social pressure from liberal puritans"? No, like I said, I didn't notice that at all.

Is this your main focus here? Hank Azaria must be a lying pussy, because of that documentary? Nothing that he said sounded anything less than how a normal human being would feel.

 

[panamaican]

I disagree, some people just have either A) thick skin, or B) such high self esteem that other people's opinions are irrelevant, hence they can't be shamed.

My dad was a USMC Sgt Maj for instance, the words 'feelings' or 'offended' are literally not a part of his vocabulary. How many times, given that environment growing up, do you think I have been offended?

the answer is zero, never.

That being said, I might be a minor sociopath so who knows haha

Yet I've seen you offended on Sherdog. Specifically, in the past when I insinuated that you were on a form of government welfare.

 

[nac386]

We're only talking about it, because the loony left made it a controversy, which was in part sparked by that doc. Do you really think Hank Azaria just decided to speak about this out of the fucking blue?

No, there was attention brought to it, and he responded. I assume he responded honestly, because I don't see any reason for him to lie. He's doing just fine and has a ton of support from the other perspective.

Look at this thread, most people disagree with him. Go on youtube or Twitter or whatever, and you'll probably find that a lot of people disagree with him.

He's alienating Simpson's fans, his actual fan base, by changing the character. I don't think he'd lie in order to appease people who don't watch his show, at risk of alienating his actual fans.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

Yet I've seen you offended on Sherdog. Specifically, in the past when I insinuated that you were on a form of government welfare.

That wasn't offense, that was not understanding how you and JVS could postulate those views w/ a straight face

I get your pt, but I was laughing audibly at my desk the entire time

 

[ultramanhyata]

Oh, poor poor white people

You know why it's not ok: recent history of slavery, lynching, and jim crow.

Is the connection here that it's a sort of "pay back" to not make a certain segment of the black population a source of humor because of the oppression suffered by blacks in the past?

Or are you saying that such cartoon stereotypes run the risk of again awakening the hatred and again inciting the crimes formerly committed against the black race?

 

[HereticBD]

Taking to the internet to call people you disagree with pussies is not offensive, it's just something you should be embarrassed by.

...

Is this a new level of pussy-ness from the right?

Shut up.

 

[RubberGuard5]

I never find that a valid response because everybody always says that other people shouldn't get their feelings hurt. Yet I've never found anyone who doesn't get their feelings hurt over something.

What people really mean is "It doesn't hurt my feelings therefore it shouldn't hurt yours."

Our emotions are in large part caused by our cognitions. The reason why different people have different reaction to the same (type of) action or insult is because of their different thought processes and beliefs in these situations. You can train a person to not get offended, litteraly. That's one of the ways a therapist helps people, for example.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Pressure, sure. "Immense social pressure from liberal puritans"? No, like I said, I didn't notice that at all.

Is this your main focus here? Hank Azaria must be a lying pussy, because of that documentary? Nothing that he said sounded anything less than how a normal human being would feel.

1. What one person did and didn't notice is a poor measuring stick, no? It's been pulling teeth just to get you to admit that a full length documentary getting headlines across the media about one character on one show might be pressure on the guy behind that character.

2. For someone who is bothered by others making assumptions, you are making a lot of assumptions. I didn't call anyone a liar. I didn't call anyone a pussy. You may have me confused with another poster, but those aren't points I've made.

3. Normal people often feel bad unnecessarily for things they have said or done when being accused of borderline racism by moralizing busybodies. That's why moralizing is so effective. I'm not questioning Azaria's sincerity at all. I am questioning the sincerity and motives of his critics.

 

[panamaican]

Our emotions are in large part caused by our cognitions. The reason why different people have different reaction to the same (type of) action or insult is because of their different thought processes and beliefs in these situations. You can train a person to not get offended, litteraly. That's one of the ways a therapist helps people, for example.

I don't disagree. My specific point is that people are always telling other people not to get offended or hurt by things while they continue to find other things hurtful/offensive in their personal lives.

The implication that these people are acting in a way contrary to our otherwise emotionless society is unreal.

At the most childish level...why can't these people stop being offended that other people are offended? Why don't they just ignore it to the same extent that they expect others to ignore things?

 

[S-dot]

Sure, but nowhere in this story does Azaria state he is making an emotional decision. The fallacy in play is where people dismiss Azaria's actions as the result of emotional manipulation and not the result of his reaching a logical conclusion.

And if you create something that people use in a manner that you don't approve of, you might stop contributing to the misuse. If your neighbor takes your car and drives around shouting insults out the window. It's not your fault, it's not the fault of the person he is insulting. But it wouldn't make you weak to stop lending that person your car.

That doesn't make the people being insulted overly emotional or coddled. I've never understood how someone standing up for themselves makes them the coddled one.

And yes, my analogy does match up to the situation. You simply stopped short of fully exploring it. You say he'd have to learn how to navigate those social waters but you don't say how, More specifically, you don't say that he should just get over it and that you're fine with someone insulting your kid. You recognize that some action on someone's behalf is required, you don't say "I'll just ignore it."

Well I think the result speaks for itself. Apu is not malicious. He’s not insulting. Hes racial but not racist. If nobody complained, hank clearly wouldn’t have stopped since he’s been doing it for 30 years. It can be argued he needed it pointed out to him, but then we circle back to the beginning where I said jus because someone points out they’re offended by something you’ve done doesn’t mean you’ve done anything wrong. So I suppose it comes down to whether you actually think apu is a character causing harm. If you do, I’ll tell you your wrong and we can agree to disagree.

Standing up for yourself doesn’t make you coddled, but not knowing the difference between something malicious and something innocuous, and believing that you are entitled to dictate the innocuous actions of others because you feel offended, does. I know because this is how I was raised and how I thought up until my teenage years. Beside the fact it’s a terrible way to exist, it’s not productive and ultimately it’s just a way to exercise power over others in a weak and sneaky way.

As for your analogy, that’s why i specified. If they’re calling him fat tony because he’s italian, like these stories about Indians being called apu, i wouldn’t entertain the idea of that being offensive at all in any way. If the words were actually hurtful words, I’d make sure he doesn’t use those as an excuse to feel victimized and get violent. If the words were in some way a precursor to violence then I’d tell him to use his boxing, jits, and wrestling to defend himself if need be but never to initiate any violence unless it’s preventative.

 

[Mondo Freaks]

Go up to an Indian person with that voice and see what happens. Most likely you are going to get stomped back to your trailer park.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Man, I am a German and we probably get it worse in all of pop culture.
But not at one point was I ever offended.

Do you want to make jokes about a superior race? So be it.
Just kidding of course It's just a joke.

I read that in Apu's voice.

 

[Social Distance Warrior]

Taking to the internet to call people you disagree with pussies is not offensive, it's just something you should be embarrassed by.

I’m kind of torn on this to be honest.

On one side, I want to censure the PC-Libs, SJWs, and SLWLs again for their uber political correctness gone amok again.

Apu was a great character, and hilarious imo. (not in a racial caricature kind of way). The several episodes I’ve seen that have circulated around him all have been great. And I think Apu was one of the first prominent Indian Characters on Prime Time US television. Like @HomerThompson mentioned, Apu wasn’t a gross caricature of Indian people. He wasn’t mocked for being Hindu, he didn’t take $hit from the other white characters, he wasn’t the punchline in racially charged jokes…I mean, back when Simpsons was in its prime (like 15 years ago), he was in the greatest episodes. (eg. who needs a Kwikee Mart) . So yea, part of me is like fu*k you libs, like @nac386

And on the other side, I emphasize a great deal with Hank Azaria. And yea, I’ve heard Indian clerks at 7/11 mocked for their accent and jokingly called “Apu” by disgruntled/drunk customers. I can only imagine the shit that Indian children got in schools. And he if feels “guilt” from that, good on him. He’s an empathetic human being.

Speaking from my personal experience, the closest comparison I can think of is Long Duck Dong from Sixteen Candles. Not only is that a shit film, but his character was racist AF. I remember getting into an argument with my Mexican GF at the time who couldn’t grasp why I didn’t find his character funny at all, and offensive. I said, “long duck dong’ is no different than Speedy Gonzales.

Ps. @panamaican , isn't your wife Indian? what are her thoughts?