The Myth of the "change" in GSP's style

[Saskatoonmike**]

What does that mean? I'm sure he could finish just about any Cage Rage fighter you put in front of him, just as I'm sure he could finish most B level fighters in the UFC who don't pose a threat to him. The point is, fighters who do pose a threat (and some that don't, IE Dan Hardy) are not being approached with the primary objective of finishing the fight.

Again, this is fine and it's clearly highly efective. I just don't understand the purpose of arguing that he is indeed a finisher. I could argue that BJ Penn actually has a fantastic gas tank at WW...but I would be completely full of shit.

If you do not think he approached Dan Hardy with the idea of finishing the fight then you simply do not understand MMA.

GSP set a fight record for submission attempts. He was passing and setting up subs non stop. Yes he failed but if you could not recognize him going for it, then you simply do not understand what you are watching.

didn't he unsuccessfully try to finish Hardy?

some people do not understand what they see. Others think if you did not achieve it, you did not try.

 

[facedancer]

If you do not think he approached Dan Hardy with the idea of finishing the fight then you simply do not understand MMA.

GSP set a fight record for submission attempts. He was passing and setting up subs non stop. Yes he failed but if you could not recognize him going for it, then you simply do not understand what you are watching.



some people do not understand what they see. Others think if you did not achieve it, you did not try.

You're not enlightening. Does my post history lead you to believe I have no clue what sport I'm watching?

Clearly he attempte to finished Hardy. This appears to be the only portion of my post you were able to read.

 

[Saskatoonmike**]

Is Carlos Condit a finisher when he fights the top UFC level comp?

The myth of strength of opponents not mattering exposed!

The natural Born killer only was able to win by finishing 4 of 9 or 44%. GSP, despite fighting way better comp overall has finished 56.5% of his opponents.

If Condit fought GSP's schedule would the Natural Born Killer be a decision master? If GSP fought Carlos schedule would he be celebrated as a Killer similar to Anderson?


Condits top UFC level opponents

Georges St. Pierre - Decision loss
Nick Diaz - Decision win
Dong Hyun Kim - Finish win
Dan Hardy- finish win
Rory MacDonald - finish win
Jake Ellenberger- decision win
Martin Kampmann - decision loss
Jake Shields - decision loss
Frank Trigg - finish win

Nick Diaz is 2 decisions in 2 fights since coming back to the UFC. Does anyone think he will finish at a high level the top UFC WW's if he stays in the division?

 

[Saskatoonmike**]

You're not enlightening. Does my post history lead you to believe I have no clue what sport I'm watching?

Clearly he attempte to finished Hardy. This appears to be the only portion of my post you were able to read.

your posts in this thread would lead anyone to believe you do not understand or perhaps it is a dislike for GSP that makes you try and paint his fights as other then they are.

 

[whoknew]

Is Carlos Condit a finisher when he fights the top UFC level comp?

The myth of strength of opponents not mattering exposed!

The natural Born killer only was able to win by finishing 4 of 9 or 44%. GSP, despite fighting way better comp overall has finished 56.5% of his opponents.

If Condit fought GSP's schedule would the Natural Born Killer be a decision master? If GSP fought Carlos schedule would he be celebrated as a Killer similar to Anderson?


Condits top UFC level opponents

Georges St. Pierre - Decision loss
Nick Diaz - Decision win
Dong Hyun Kim - Finish win
Dan Hardy- finish win
Rory MacDonald - finish win
Jake Ellenberger- decision win
Martin Kampmann - decision loss
Jake Shields - decision loss
Frank Trigg - finish win

Nick Diaz is 2 decisions in 2 fights since coming back to the UFC. Does anyone think he will finish at a high level the top UFC WW's if he stays in the division?

:redface:

 

[CRuck1980]

What does that mean? I'm sure he could finish just about any Cage Rage fighter you put in front of him, just as I'm sure he could finish most B level fighters in the UFC who don't pose a threat to him. The point is, fighters who do pose a threat (and some that don't, IE Dan Hardy) are not being approached with the primary objective of finishing the fight.

Again, this is fine and it's clearly highly efective. I just don't understand the purpose of arguing that he is indeed a finisher. I could argue that BJ Penn actually has a fantastic gas tank at WW...but I would be completely full of shit.

I'm not arguing about him being a finisher, i'm arguing against the idea that he's changed so drastically, it's indeed a myth

As for the Hardy fight, he attempted to finish him multiple times

 

[Saskatoonmike**]

:redface:

I know eh.

facts can be pretty embarrassing. Guys like Lombard and Diaz can be finishing machines in Belator and SF respectively and get praised as finishers, then when they fight top comp in the UFC their finish rate plummets and we have shertards claiming they are not going for it, they changed their style and are fighting tentative, while ignoring that they are fighting better comp and that MATTERS.

When you fight guys several levels below your skill level fancy finishes will happen more often because those guys do not pose the same threat level. Not sure why that is the hardest concept for most to understand on this forum,but it clearly is.

 

[redbrownhaze]

GSP has been deeply affected by the Serra lose lets not kid our selves.

He is more than happy to go 5 rounds than risk getting Ko'd.

GSP knows he a better athlete that 99.9 of the guys out there at 170 and can beat them in a point war with his take downs.

He doesn't not show the aggression needed to finish a opponent anymore.
His GNP is midgrade at best because he more so worrying able controlling and not loosing position. He did fight better this last fight but the only thing that made the fight exciting is him surviving the head kick. He didn't do anything spectacular, we all knew he could take Carlos down.

 

[IIIIIIII]

What's wrong with changing styles? Why is that a bad thing?

I think stiffer competition makes any fighter look like they've changed styles, intentional or not. GSP is still winning, that's all that matters.

his change of style caused him to no longer finish fights.

the competition has nothing to do with it. the same fighters that gsp went to a decision with, are the same fighters that others have finished.

winning is not all that matters. you tell that to dana white and the fertittas, and i guarantee that they would disagree with you. if all fighters fought like gsp, the ufc would be in serious trouble.

 

[bjpenngoat]

gsp has been deeply affected by the serra lose lets not kid our selves.

He is more than happy to go 5 rounds than risk getting ko'd.

Gsp knows he a better athlete that 99.9 of the guys out there at 170 and can beat them in a point war with his take downs.

He doesn't not show the aggression needed to finish a opponent anymore.
His gnp is midgrade at best because he more so worrying able controlling and not loosing position. He did fight better this last fight but the only thing that made the fight exciting is him surviving the head kick. He didn't do anything spectacular, we all knew he could take carlos down.

bingo

 

[ACT]

All you have to do is look a the number of sub attempts and power strikes thrown. Between kos and shields, and this latest fight with condit there is a large difference. If these ppl actually watched those fights it would be obvious.

 

[wisdom blows]

stop. seriously, just stop.

 

[Saskatoonmike**]

his change of style caused him to no longer finish fights.

the competition has nothing to do with it. the same fighters that gsp went to a decision with, are the same fighters that others have finished.

winning is not all that matters. you tell that to dana white and the fertittas, and i guarantee that they would disagree with you. if all fighters fought like gsp, the ufc would be in serious trouble.

sigh. the same trollish statement repeated by one of GSPs biggest trolls on this forum.

Of course the level of competition matters. better guys get finished LESS. Notice I never said they don't get finished at all. The operative word is LESS. If you are fighting guys consistently who get finished LESS then it will be harder to finish them.

And the point about others finishing is the most blatant troll line. every single, EVERY SINGLE fighter not finished by Anderson, GSP, JDS, Aldo or any other champ will almost certainly be finished by others unless they go undefeated for the rest of their careers. it is a stupid trollish point to try and make when everyone not finished by a champ will almost certainly, at some point get finished by someone esle.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

His style did not change after the Serra fight. Anyone who says that is clueless moron, talking out of their ass, who either didn't see his fights post-serra or chooses to ignore them.
It was after the 2nd Penn fight. He looked different, slow even, against Alves. Same with his Hardy fight etc.

He was fast as fuck and a monster against Fitch, Penn, Serra 2, Hughes 3,
Those were some of his most impressive, dominant victories and 3 out of 4 of those were finishes. And against Fitch, he fucked him up bad and looked like he was going to finish on multiple occasions.

The Serra fight didn't change GSP - money changed GSP. The Serra fight might have led him to pursue a wrestling style against Koscheck...so what? He finished his very next fight, morons.
When he started earning the big dollars, like he did in Penn 2, Serra 2 and Hughes 3, after that string...he slowed right down.

 

[Akira Yuki]

I know eh.

facts can be pretty embarrassing. Guys like Lombard and Diaz can be finishing machines in Belator and SF respectively and get praised as finishers, then when they fight top comp in the UFC their finish rate plummets and we have shertards claiming they are not going for it, they changed their style and are fighting tentative, while ignoring that they are fighting better comp and that MATTERS.

When you fight guys several levels below your skill level fancy finishes will happen more often because those guys do not pose the same threat level. Not sure why that is the hardest concept for most to understand on this forum,but it clearly is.

The funny thing cuepee is that I can find one of your banned accounts arguing that Georges is in a slump, basically implying that Georges can do better and that his decision streak is just an anomaly.

I guess now that Georges made it clear that he's not a finisher that argument doesn't sound as good, so you're reusing the 'he's fighting top comp' argument.

 

[Tamburlaine]

lmao at nobody in this thread actually watching the karo fight.

Exactly.

Not sure this thread proves anything about GSP, but is sure does confirm some things about Shertards. What a pack of nitwits.

 

[ticho123]

Well, he has always been a fighter who exploits his opponent's weakness, but there's not denying he's safer now than before he was p4p top 3. No more spinning back kicks and high risk techniques. GSP sure is a mixed martial arts master, but he's not as flashy as Anderson or Jones.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

his change of style caused him to no longer finish fights.

the competition has nothing to do with it. the same fighters that gsp went to a decision with, are the same fighters that others have finished.

winning is not all that matters. you tell that to dana white and the fertittas, and i guarantee that they would disagree with you. if all fighters fought like gsp, the ufc would be in serious trouble.

That is one of the stupidest things I've ever read in my life.
"If everyone fought like the ppv king, the biggest draw in MMA history, the UFC would be in serious trouble."

Right. And smoking crack is good for your teeth.

 

[IIIIIIII]

sigh. the same trollish statement repeated by one of GSPs biggest trolls on this forum.

Of course the level of competition matters. better guys get finished LESS. Notice I never said they don't get finished at all. The operative word is LESS. If you are fighting guys consistently who get finished LESS then it will be harder to finish them.

And the point about others finishing is the most blatant troll line. every single, EVERY SINGLE fighter not finished by Anderson, GSP, JDS, Aldo or any other champ will almost certainly be finished by others unless they go undefeated for the rest of their careers. it is a stupid trollish point to try and make when everyone not finished by a champ will almost certainly, at some point get finished by someone esle.

i have never received yellow cards or a warning from a moderator on the things i say about georges st. pierre.

your issue with me, is that you don't agree with me.

there is nothing wrong with that. where the problem lies, is with people such as yourself who stoop to calling others, "trolls", when someone does not agree with you.

you need to grow up.

 

[IIIIIIII]

That is one of the stupidest things I've ever read in my life.
"If everyone fought like the ppv king, the biggest draw in MMA history, the UFC would be in serious trouble."

Right. And smoking crack is good for your teeth.

this is exactly what i mean.