Somebody please show me the receipts!

Welterskelter said:
I'm sorry but this just isn't helpful and doesn't bring us any closer to a truthful answer to my questions. This is all assumption, presumption, and speculation.
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This is you being so invested in this warped narrative of yours which is the complete opposite of reality that you're ignoring what's right in front of you.

You believe that he was scared to fight Ngannou, believed he would lose, etc. You have some weird bias against Jones and cant let it go.

That's what this comes down to.

Which is dumb in itself. Jones would've made it look easy against Ngannou too. Just like Smith, DC, Glover and countless other fighters have also said.

With that in mind, this all becomes even more ridiculous.

Ngannou is the one who didn't sign the contract and left the UFC. He was given an opportunity to fight Jones and didn't take it.

Your whole thought process is the exact opposite of what actually happened and you're doubling down to the point where it's just getting weird.
 
Welterskelter said:
Exactly. So if Jones doesn't want to fight Ngannou, he can just stay retired. How can you say with a straight face that that's not what he did? Are you starting to understand?
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I think this is one of the most delusional takes in a long time.
 
Shilajit said:
This is you being so invested in this warped narrative of yours which is the complete opposite of reality that you're ignoring what's right in front of you.

You believe that he was scared to fight Ngannou, believed he would lose, etc. You have some weird bias against Jones and cant let it go.

That's what this comes down to.

Which is dumb in itself. Jones would've made it look easy against Ngannou too. Just like Smith, DC, Glover and countless other fighters have also said.

With that in mind, this all becomes even more ridiculous.

Ngannou is the one who didn't sign the contract and left the UFC. He was given an opportunity to fight Jones and didn't take it.

Your whole thought process is the exact opposite of what actually happened and you're doubling down to the point where it's just getting weird.
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I'm not invested in anything but the truth. I have nothing to gain or lose from whatever is the real story. You are the one who's taken a stance and dismissing any other perspective.
 
Welterskelter said:
Exactly. So if Jones doesn't want to fight Ngannou, he can just stay retired. How can you say with a straight face that that's not what he did? Are you starting to understand?
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So let's evaluate again

Jones is the one who called out Ngannou for a super fight back in 2021. He hyped up the fight on podcasts, interviews, tweets.

He's at the stage of his career where he's only coming back for a big money fight, which can only be satisfied in a HW title bout.

Spends 2 years gaining size, strength and training or heavyweight. With the clear recognition that Ngannou is the one holding the belt.

That's the fight if he wants that big payday. No question.

Calls out the HW division again after the Gane, Ngannou fight

And somewhere near the end of 2022, definitely appears to have come to an agreement. Otherwise the UFC would not have released a date for his potential return.

All of these things considered, the conclusion you arrive at is, Jones was scared to fight Ngannou.

<Huh2>
 
Shilajit said:
So let's evaluate again

Jones is the one who called out Ngannou for a super fight back in 2021. He hyped up the fight on podcasts, interviews, tweets.

He's at the stage of his career where he's only coming back for a big money fight, which can only be satisfied in a HW title bout.

Spends 2 years gaining size, strength and training or heavyweight. With the clear recognition that Ngannou is the one holding the belt.

Calls out the HW division again after the gane Ngannou fight

And somewhere near the end of 2022, definitely appears to have come to an agreement. Otherwise the UFC would not have released a date for his potential return.

All of these things considered, the conclusion you arrive at is, Jones was scared to fight Ngannou.

<Huh2>
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Calling a fighter out does not amount to anything more than calling someone out. None of the announcements made by Jones or the UFC guaranteed an Ngannou match, and quite the opposite in act. Media alluded to the fact that Ngannou may no longer be in the UFC when Jones returns at HW. I've simply asked for evidence and you continue to fill this thread with hot air. As I suspected from you following anyone who disagrees with you in every Ngannou thread, you've made this emotional for yourself.
 
Welterskelter said:
Tell that to everyone else who also has questions. Why so defensive?
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Major media outlets were saying March 4th for a return date for Jones.

Back in December 2022. Which is exactly the date he came back on.

Ngannou was still in negotiations and was offered 8 million for the Jones fight.

So, do you think they announced dates for his return, even offered Ngannou the fight in a legal binding document when they hadn't even signed him yet?
 
Welterskelter said:
I'm not invested in anything but the truth. I have nothing to gain or lose from whatever is the real story. You are the one who's taken a stance and dismissing any other perspective.
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What I'm saying is the truth. But you're too invested in this weird bias against Jones that you're refusing to acknowledge the points that have been made.
 
Welterskelter said:
Calling a fighter out does not amount to anything more than calling someone out. None of the announcements made by Jones or the UFC guaranteed an Ngannou match, and quite the opposite in act. Media alluded to the fact that Ngannou may no longer be in the UFC when Jones returns at HW. I've simply asked for evidence and you continue to fill this thread with hot air. As I suspected from you following anyone who disagrees with you in every Ngannou thread, you've made this emotional for yourself.
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I'm not emotional. I'm just sort of baffled at the thought process and mental gymnastics required to twist things to such a profound degree.

I think it has to come from either hate or some extreme bias.

Certainly not the musings of a rational human.
 
Shilajit said:
What I'm saying is the truth. But you're too invested in this weird bias against Jones that you're refusing to acknowledge the points that have been made.
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You didn't come here to give us the truth did you? You came to insult Ngannou and to insult me and anyone who disagrees with you. Thanks for hijacking another thread.
 
Welterskelter said:
Calling a fighter out does not amount to anything more than calling someone out. None of the announcements made by Jones or the UFC guaranteed an Ngannou match, and quite the opposite in act. Media alluded to the fact that Ngannou may no longer be in the UFC when Jones returns at HW. I've simply asked for evidence and you continue to fill this thread with hot air. As I suspected from you following anyone who disagrees with you in every Ngannou thread, you've made this emotional for yourself.
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If you understand how contracts work, the fact that Ngannou was offered the Jones fight says Jones was already signed.

And it was reported to the media outlets they were looking at March 4th for his return. Which affirms exactly that. While simultaneously acknowledging that Ngannou was still deeply entrenched in negotiations.

This is evidence.
 
Welterskelter said:
You didn't come here to give us the truth did you? You came to insult Ngannou and to insult me and anyone who disagrees with you. Thanks for hijacking another thread.
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I've made points, asked you to explain your reasoning. Asked questions.

But it seems you're ignoring anything that doesn't align with this narrative of Jones being a pussy who ducked Ngannou.
 
Shilajit said:
If you understand how contracts work, the fact that Ngannou was offered the Jones fight says Jones was already signed.

And it was reported to the media outlets they were looking at March 4th for his return. Which affirms exactly that. While simultaneously acknowledging that Ngannou was still deeply entrenched in negotiations.

This is evidence.
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"Former longtime champion Jon Jones is targeted to return to the octagon after more than three years at UFC 285 in March, but speculation about who will be standing across from him continued to run rampant.
Jones (26-1 MMA, 20-1 UFC) and the UFC brass are working toward setting his long-awaited heavyweight debut for the UFC’s March 4 pay-per-view event. With divisional champion Francis Ngannou in the midst of a contractual crossroads with the promotion, though, it’s not clear who Jones will fight.
MMA Junkie reported earlier this month that various names are in the running if Ngannou (17-3 MMA, 12-2 UFC) parts ways with the UFC, but as of now the whole situation reeks of uncertainty.
So, if Jones is indeed going to finally get back to competition, which fight are we most likely to see?"
December 1, 2022 MMA Junkie Staff
This is the article you posted as evidence. Read every line and tell me how Ngannou was guaranteed Jones and Jones was guaranteed Ngannou.
 
Welterskelter said:
"Former longtime champion Jon Jones is targeted to return to the octagon after more than three years at UFC 285 in March, but speculation about who will be standing across from him continued to run rampant.
Jones (26-1 MMA, 20-1 UFC) and the UFC brass are working toward setting his long-awaited heavyweight debut for the UFC’s March 4 pay-per-view event. With divisional champion Francis Ngannou in the midst of a contractual crossroads with the promotion, though, it’s not clear who Jones will fight.
MMA Junkie reported earlier this month that various names are in the running if Ngannou (17-3 MMA, 12-2 UFC) parts ways with the UFC, but as of now the whole situation reeks of uncertainty.
So, if Jones is indeed going to finally get back to competition, which fight are we most likely to see?"
December 1, 2022 MMA Junkie Staff
This is the article you posted as evidence. Read every line and tell me how Ngannou was guaranteed Jones and Jones was guaranteed Ngannou.
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It's insinuated that Jones was already signed by this point. Otherwise, they wouldn't have released that date to the media outlets. The date which he ultimately ended up fighting on, by the way.

If that were not the case and Jones was still in negotiations, not only would a date not be released like this, but the UFC and Dana would make it very clear to the public.

But when something like this is publicized in the media, it's insinuated that he's come to an agreement.

It wasn't guaranteed because Ngannou was in the midst of contract negotiations and until that concluded, they obviously didn't know who he would fight.
 
Shilajit said:
It's insinuated that Jones was already signed by this point. Otherwise, they wouldn't have released that date to the media outlets. The date which he ultimately ended up fighting on, by the way.

It wasn't guaranteed because Ngannou was in the midst of contract negotiations and until that concluded, they obviously didn't know who he would fight.
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<WellThere><WellThere><WellThere>
There's a distinct possibility he knew he wouldn't fight Ngannou. Looks like you've finally provided the admission I was looking for so it hasn't been a complete waste of my time. MODS: Please Stand down. I took care of @Shilajit myself.
 
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