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I think it’s because I did it in a PM
Thats even worse imo. In public I get you must keep it clean but in PM you can just ignore the guy.
I think it’s because I did it in a PM
Yeah it is what it is , but honestly it’s better to just play nice and not seek out arguments . I learned my lessonThats even worse imo. In public I get you must keep it clean but in PM you can just ignore the guy.
How many fighter you see backed on the cage reverse the position, that option wasn't available to Jorge?
There are fighters so physically gifted that no person could easily escape being pressed up against the cage....Some fighters are naturally stronger and it has nothing to do with "skill", it takes time to escape a clinch where the initiating fighter literally refuses to do anything offensive because the moment he would try, he would then lose the clinch, this is called "stalling".....and it takes time to escape that stalling, which usually takes up the majority of the round.....blame masvidal for being controlled
If he lacked control, why couldn't Masvidal escape the position?
If fighter A takes fighter B down and lands strikes, it's on fighter B to escape the position to avoid getting scored on.
If fighter A puts fighter B against the cage and lands strikes, isn't it still on fighter B to escape the position to avoid getting scored on?
yeah but there is a big difference to what Mayweather was doing and what Usman was doing... to make this a similar comparison it would be like Maywather constantly goes for a clinch and wont let go for 3-4 minutes at a time, which would be boxing equivalent to entire round... imagine watching that....Need to place a time limit on that wall and stall.
If the fighter applying it cannot get his opponent to the floor, or into a submission, or isn’t striking in any form...break it up after 30-45 seconds. More than likely the fighter applying it is doing so in order to AVOID COMBAT. I don’t understand how avoiding combat can be applied to combat sports.
I guess we should ask Mayweather.
Maybe you missed the part where masvidal was intentionally backing up to the fenceso he could do the ATT wall walk... he was getting rag dolled and GNPd in the center of the octagon. Lol. Jorge's defensive wrestling is awful btw.Usman could only control him partially. Enough to keep Masvidal against the fence, but still not enough control to progress to a takedown because he knows if he goes for the takedown Masvidal escapes. And also when he eventually did get a takedown he couldnt do anything with it because he doesnt have full control. Masvidal pops back up.
Well ofcourse! But why cant fighter A progress to takedown > improve position > smash his face > sub/tko? Because he is unable to do it, not skilled enough yet against this fighter B.
Need to place a time limit on that wall and stall.
Maybe you missed the part where masvidal was intentionally backing up to the fenceso he could do the ATT wall walk... he was getting rag dolled and GNPd in the center of the octagon. Lol. Jorge's defensive wrestling is awful btw.
yeah but there is a big difference to what Mayweather was doing and what Usman was doing... to make this a similar comparison it would be like Maywather constantly goes for a clinch and wont let go for 3-4 minutes at a time, which would be boxing equivalent to entire round... imagine watching that....
Missing punches and countering is entirely different thing then wall and stall, maybe both are not fun to watch, but 1 is pure 100% skill, the other is just physical ability/endurance, nothing to do with skill, just a game being played
I stopped reading here. It's not 2 fighters pressed up against the side of the cage. It's 1 fighter pressing another fighter up against the cage against the other fighter's will.
If 2 fighters are pressed up against the side of the cage, and both are throwing little footsie stomps and shoulder bumps, and nothing significant is being attempt like a takedown, a sub attempt, or even a significant strike, that entire portion of the round should be scored as a draw or should not be scored at all.
I dont see how that is more advantageous for the initiating fighter when he cant do anything because the moment he tries to throw a significant strike or go for a takedown he will lose the position....thats not a area that should be scored for either fighter unless one of those things i mentioned above happens.
Using example from last night Masvidal vs Usman
Usman had Masvidal pressed up the cage in the 2nd round for about 4 minutes...throwing nothing but shoulder bumps and foot stomps....after the clinch broke up, Masvidal threw like 5-10 strikes in a rapid fire burst before the round ended... that round should be scored for Masvidal.... nothing else significant happened....the clinch is not a dominant position the way that Usman was using it, im not talking about Mui Thai plums and judo throws, none of that was even attempted....if a fighter wants to stall against the cage because he is playing the point game, that should be much harder to do then it is now.
again, im not talking about wrestling, im not talking about bjj, im simply talking about the stalling position that Masvidal and Usman were in pressed up against the cage doing literally nothing, that needs to be separated a lot sooner and it should not count for almost any points if any at all as its not an advantageous position that generated any offense.
I stopped reading here. It's not 2 fighters pressed up against the side of the cage. It's 1 fighter pressing another fighter up against the cage against the other fighter's will.
The point is not to approximate real world fighting. It's to win under a certain set of rules. And retraining and neutralizing your opponent is a path to victory.Let me ask you a question, if for some reason MMA incorporated something like darts or other skill based game into the sport, would you still consider it fighting simply because its taking place in a sport where people KO and submit each other regularly?
Why does holding someone against a fence mean anything in a sport where the point is to approximate real world fighting as closely as possible?
well to be honest, we probably would have a lot less close fights this way because you would have less stalling or stalling would become less efficient... What we consider "draws" are close fights usually because fighters are not very active, and it usually has something to do with lack of action caused by stalling.The problem is athletic commissions being completely phobic to scoring draws
well to be honest, we probably would have a lot less close fights this way because you would have less stalling or stalling would become less efficient... What we consider "draws" are close fights usually because fighters are not very active, and it usually has something to do with lack of action caused by stalling.
Fighters would be swayed more if they knew that just clinching is not going to get them points, thus creating opportunities for actions, thus presenting a window for MMA skill to actually shine and we go from there.
I just feel like the stalling in MMA is not being talked about enough, and the rules that are in place to protect us from it are not being enforced, we should not have entire rounds being wasted by 2 dudes foot stomping each other clinching on the side of the cage... there should be out rage just as much as if a ref lets a fight go on too long (Aldo vs Yan) or an early stoppage....or a bad decision.... there should be a lot more "WTF SEPARATE THEM NOTHING IS GOING ON" and shit like that, hopefully causing more attention for when it happens again and at some point maybe some changes to the rules or the enforcement of rules to help prevent or make "stalling" less effective.