International Russia/Ukraine Megathread V8

[SandisLL]

Human shield was literally confirmed by amnesty (mariupol). Russian speaking side of internet was full of talks about ukr setting positions in apartments with civvies in them or putting mortars in yards of houses where people lived (though might not be much choice since they really tried to hold it)

Otherwise few pow torture vids at start of conflict plus civilian bombings in donetsk and thats about it i think

Amnesty is Russia's puppet and should be treated as they are.
Basically Russian propaganda, nothing more.

Also Ammesty are pro Kremlin organisation and always will be.

They always will use all possible obstacles to protect China and Russia.

Like we all know that WHO is China's puppet org....

 

[SandisLL]

The whole thing about civies used as shield is just cunts from Amnesty International fachists...

Always in all world's wars !!! if fight is in city for long term....and you as civilian didn't managed to relocate before big party really started....

Stuff will be this: military, especially local
, does knows where best bombs shelters are ....and more suitable basements!

Also military usually will have some water and food and might provide this to civilians....
As help.


While maybe better they had ordered civilians to stay on the street?
Not let them go in good bomb shelter?
Refuse to provide water?

This most likely was best outcome for Amnesty?

Even in WW2 sometimes civilians had used the same shelters as military.
Cos you can't kick local ppl to die on the street or refuse them to get water!

USSR and Germany, U.K then too should be accused that they had used civilians as shield....

Amnesty is complete joke.....

 

[SandisLL]

Basically just propaganda instituion imho...

Let's be realistic.
The same WW2.

I knew ppl who had used the same bomb shelter as Gestapo guys.
Dos this mean that they had been used as human shield during city bombing?
The stuff was simple and plain.
They loved to station Gestapo guys in most comfortable flats and apartments in city...
And kick owners/ tenants out... easy....in 1 minute.

And Gestapo guys were animals...
While sometimes animals might for some moment have heart...
Air raid... alert.
Okey, some from them sometimes told: U have access to bomb shelter x?
Maybe go with us, we have access to shelter y, it is deeper and more safe and we have ...water...
Even some from these animals didn't felt comfortable cos knew that as criminals had settled in foreign country and kicked out locals from their property.
Ofc it might look strange and ofc they had supermacy idea and were crazy.
While some % from these beasts assumed that they are capable to buy legally stuff they are using...

GESTAPO was lottery.
Sometimes in calm time you might die in one second... just cos they assumed that you are suspicious... 0 questions. Pif Paff. BTW even germans weren't protected from this.
In some rare cases they might had offered shelter or allow you to get place in truck to evacuate.....

___
Once they ordered to replace piano in truck with some local civilians...in evacuation....

World really is crazy and brainwashing propaganda does wonders with ppl if enough large sums and time invested...

 

[Ruthless Ryan]

Damn, seems like someone forgot to tell the Ukrainians there is no point in fighting

I'll reserve judgement until I see a real map provided by San Marino.

 

[Yotsuya]

Yes, and if this war hasn't convinced you, I don't know what will. If your stance is 'fuck Europe, leave them all on their own' it's a legitimate stance.

This! One can defend isolationism, just don't spread disinformation doing it. I have never seen intellectually honest defence of that argument in current situation and I have lost several online friends after getting tired of their stubbornness of being useful idiots.

 

[Cid]

I dunno. China would probably face some serious logistical problems of their own if they went to war. We know Russia couldn't invade them, so the war would take plus on Russian soil. There is a loooooot of inhospitable land between China and the heart of Russia.

I'm just talking general military power. Geography makes all out conflict unlikely. Kazakhstan and Mongolia are kinda in the way.

Hypothetical scenario where Kazakhstan allows China it's land and air space... Russia get drubbed.

China knows it's behind America, hence the big % R&D budget allocation. Official goal is to be equal power by 2050. Has had that high percentage towards R&D for 3 decades now. Russia has been the opposite of late. Gearing up for a war requires kit and training, not R&D.

Only China has been smashing Russia when it comes to new kit. I don't know the ins and outs of which is better but when it comes to 5th gen planes I can say without doubt China has a lot more. Basically the same down the list of all high price military kit. China is producing more at a time when they're not trying to. With a substantially smaller % budget allocation (still apx 3x in size I believe)

A China that was anticipating or looking for a conflict will pump out an insane amount of kit. There's no reason to believe a country that already manufactures apx 25% of consumer goods, has a billion people, an economy not much smaller than America and a massive PPP advantage can't produce kit in American Army sized numbers in an insanely short time. It's not going to be as good, but to beat Russia it doesn't need to be.


*disclaimer* Sounds like I'm sucking CCP Military dick here... only looks that way because I'm comparing them to Russia.

China military isn't good. Similar to Russia they bolster numbers with crappy old kit, though not the same extent. Also militarily incompetent historically with no evidence this is being focused on. China just has the other qualities: money, manufacturing and population. Combine $ with high R&D% allocation and you have tech.

 

[Cole train]

I'm just talking general military power. Geography makes all out conflict unlikely. Kazakhstan and Mongolia are kinda in the way.

Hypothetical scenario where Kazakhstan allows China it's land and air space... Russia get drubbed.

China knows it's behind America, hence the big % R&D budget allocation. Official goal is to be equal power by 2050. Has had that high percentage towards R&D for 3 decades now. Russia has been the opposite of late. Gearing up for a war requires kit and training, not R&D.

Only China has been smashing Russia when it comes to new kit. I don't know the ins and outs of which is better but when it comes to 5th gen planes I can say without doubt China has a lot more. Basically the same down the list of all high price military kit. China is producing more at a time when they're not trying to. With a substantially smaller % budget allocation (still apx 3x in size I believe)

A China that was anticipating or looking for a conflict will pump out an insane amount of kit. There's no reason to believe a country that already manufactures apx 25% of consumer goods, has a billion people, an economy not much smaller than America and a massive PPP advantage can't produce kit in American Army sized numbers in an insanely short time. It's not going to be as good, but to beat Russia it doesn't need to be.


*disclaimer* Sounds like I'm sucking CCP Military dick here... only looks that way because I'm comparing them to Russia.

China military isn't good. Similar to Russia they bolster numbers with crappy old kit, though not the same extent. Also militarily incompetent historically with no evidence this is being focused on. China just has the other qualities: money, manufacturing and population. Combine $ with high R&D% allocation and you have a tech.

I expect china to start some small conflict when they consider their military "ready"that would not awake western powers ,simply to try out their army

 

[Yehudim]

I expect china to start some small conflict when they consider their military "ready"that would not awake western powers ,simply to try out their army

That has been their MO, but they’ve overreached and have no sympathy from us anymore.

Maybe after 2030 we’ll all have forgotten how much we hate them, and they can get back to salami slicing conflicts, like they did in the South China Sea.

Do a bunch of small, aggressive things and when we take concrete action, they can play the victim and say we overreacted, and where the American public is oblivious or actually agrees with them (in other words, are being useful idiots)

 

[SandisLL]

I'm just talking general military power. Geography makes all out conflict unlikely. Kazakhstan and Mongolia are kinda in the way.

Hypothetical scenario where Kazakhstan allows China it's land and air space... Russia get drubbed.

China knows it's behind America, hence the big % R&D budget allocation. Official goal is to be equal power by 2050. Has had that high percentage towards R&D for 3 decades now. Russia has been the opposite of late. Gearing up for a war requires kit and training, not R&D.

Only China has been smashing Russia when it comes to new kit. I don't know the ins and outs of which is better but when it comes to 5th gen planes I can say without doubt China has a lot more. Basically the same down the list of all high price military kit. China is producing more at a time when they're not trying to. With a substantially smaller % budget allocation (still apx 3x in size I believe)

A China that was anticipating or looking for a conflict will pump out an insane amount of kit. There's no reason to believe a country that already manufactures apx 25% of consumer goods, has a billion people, an economy not much smaller than America and a massive PPP advantage can't produce kit in American Army sized numbers in an insanely short time. It's not going to be as good, but to beat Russia it doesn't need to be.


*disclaimer* Sounds like I'm sucking CCP Military dick here... only looks that way because I'm comparing them to Russia.

China military isn't good. Similar to Russia they bolster numbers with crappy old kit, though not the same extent. Also militarily incompetent historically with no evidence this is being focused on. China just has the other qualities: money, manufacturing and population. Combine $ with high R&D% allocation and you have tech.

The problem is that for example the same batch of 2450 drones from Iran.
China with 0 doubts is capable 20x more in the same timeframe than Iran and Russia together.
More than 10 X larger population and workforce for manufacturing industry....etc factors...

 

[SandisLL]

China not likely will invade Kazahstan.
All they really needs from Kazahstan is to get access for mining, buisness and banking sector more than today.

While they might offer ofc also to buy weapons and will be happy to see this happen.
Maybe some friendly exercises with friendly tropps in Kazahstan.

It is widely rumoured ( not without pragmatic reasons ) that Xi had under the table offered secret treaty to warrant Kazahstan's sovergeinity with China playing here as nuclear armed state as protector and umbrella.
With CLAUSES...

In USSR times when China get thermonuclear weapons they in response for soviet threats had told one phrase : ' Let's use nukes comrades ....we have 10X more ppl and know that we will have more chances to win vs USSR.
Let's not talk, please press button.
You are small nation compare with us and will have lesser chances to survive nuclear war vs our country. So comrades, press buttons or shut mouth....
1970 ies....
China never will fear Russia, they are looking on them as on small nation ....

 

[Blayt7hh]

Hang on. I thought the whole imposition of a no-fly zone was a no no because it would lead to WWIII if NATO planes shot down Russian ones? This is assuming that the RAF plane was not in Ukrainian or Russian airspace (which would again go against the idea of NATO not going to war). If they shoot down a NATO plane it would force NATO into a corner. It would be the same if Russia tried to take out a ground based radar system in Poland.

What’s Russia going to do about it? If you’re referencing why we haven’t been shooting them down in Ukraine already keep in mind that this would be in retaliation of Russia shooting down a NATO plane. It would be Russia escalating it.

 

[SandisLL]

Russia now is using air def missiles in ground to ground mode.....and Iranian drones.
Definitely even 4 th military in the World?

 

[Blayt7hh]

Trying to hide the truth in the Ukraine.
https://odysee.com/@OurFreeSociety:2/Theyre-trying-to-hide-the-Nazi-truth-in-Ukraine:3

I hope you goobers ran a virus scan after clicking on that link

What a lovely rambling diatribe

You see the part where he admitted to crying to a mod? <Lmaoo> I should stop laughing though. This dude really has had a full meltdown in here.

Actually fuck him. He was the one that said I was lying about being a veteran when he should already none better. What a little ____

 

[Yotsuya]

Seemed weird that Russians were so eager to evacuate civilians from Kherson. Well according to ISW they are using them as human shields while pulling out their troops from the area.

 

[Nameless King]

Europe needs adult supervision from the US? I think France, Germany, Britain, and Italy can handle Putin and Russia just fine. We Americans have better things to worry about. Those 4 countries can create their own alliance and fund it. They sure as shit have not done much to help sustain NATO prior to Russia's invasion.

No matter whos in power in US, Trump or Biden. US needs Europe and vice versa. If Europe falls, US falls soon after.

 

[PEB]

Wow this is going fly up Putin's ass but what's he going to do sizable amount of his forces are mutining.

 

[I Eat Cabbage & Potatoes]

Seemed weird that Russians were so eager to evacuate civilians from Kherson. Well according to ISW they are using them as human shields while pulling out their troops from the area.

Nothing should be “according to ISW”

You are aware of what the may think tank is and what it does in DC right?

 

[Yehudim]

Nothing should be “according to ISW”

You are aware of what the may think tank is and what it does in DC right?

Suggest a better source

 

[aries]

Human shield was literally confirmed by amnesty (mariupol). Russian speaking side of internet was full of talks about ukr setting positions in apartments with civvies in them or putting mortars in yards of houses where people lived (though might not be much choice since they really tried to hold it)

Otherwise few pow torture vids at start of conflict plus civilian bombings in donetsk and thats about it i think

Yeah pretty much fuck all. Contrast this to what Russia are doing to anti-war protesters, it's own citizens (covered by Amnesty International Russian-anti-war-activist-beaten-and-raped):

 

[aries]

What’s Russia going to do about it? If you’re referencing why we haven’t been shooting them down in Ukraine already keep in mind that this would be in retaliation of Russia shooting down a NATO plane. It would be Russia escalating it.

You just said 'I think it could end up with an air conflict where we start shooting down anything that gets too close to our planes.' Isn't that NATO vs. Russia? i.e. war? And that would be NATO escalating which is why I brought up NATO not setting up a no-fly zone. But now you say they'll shoot down Russian planes, how would that not be contradictory?