International Russia/Ukraine Megathread V12

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AWilder said:
i wouldn't say this guy is russian propaganda but he certainly has the doom and gloom for Ukraine niche covered. based on his twitter feed.
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People who I knew in Ukraine estimated at the start of the war that maybe 10% of men had any interest in fighting. The other 90% were terrified at the prospect of it and were wanting to hide or flee. This Hollywood narrative that the majority of Ukrainians are ecstatic to be sent to the front lines to avoid living under a different flag, "not one square inch," etc. shouldn't pass anyone's smell test.

There was an article from the Economist that was also posted on that sub, but it has seemingly been taken down. It talks about the public's mood in general beginning to sour on the war and the government in response to the failure of the counteroffensive. This is also consistent with what people I know in Ukraine have been saying.

It also states the same sentiment mentioned in the articles posted by the other user.

"For young men, in constant danger of being served conscription papers and sent to the front, the pressure is particularly intense. Those keen to fight volunteered long ago; Ukraine is now recruiting mostly among the unwilling. "It makes the air so thick that you can actually feel it," says Ms Zamula. Everyone knows that the cost of regained territory is dead soldiers. "Even hoping for success in the counter-offensive has become an act of self-destruction."

https://www.economist.com/europe/20...-counter-offensive-is-souring-the-public-mood
 
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lsa said:
Well it should not really be a surprise.
The war have been going on for more than a year.
How many countries has an unlimited supply of people they can throw at the enemy?

Does this indicate that Ukraine will run out of people /soldiers?
Not at all imo. I believe Russia has problem too in this area.

It does show that war is stupid. I will never understand why we keep doing it.
The cost is enormous on so many levels.
If the leaders that rage war was forced to be on the front lines I am sure we would see a lot less wars.
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Putin has been able to protect the elite in Moscow and Moscow City now that protection is in question. All the Countries that have had ties to him where many oligarchs have moved to have become economic targets for the west. Putin special operation his put most of Russia within range of targeted drone attacks with little options due to the size of Russia.
 
Bojka said:
People who I knew in Ukraine estimated at the start of the war that maybe 10% of men had any interest in fighting. The other 90% were terrified at the prospect of it and were wanting to hide or flee. This Hollywood narrative that the majority of Ukrainians are ecstatic to be sent to the front lines to avoid living under a different flag, "not one square inch," etc. shouldn't pass anyone's smell test.

There was an article from the Economist that was also posted on that sub, but it has seemingly been taken down. It talks about the public's mood in general beginning to sour on the war and the government in response to the failure of the counteroffensive. This is also consistent with what people I know in Ukraine have been saying.

It also states the same sentiment mentioned in the articles posted by the other user.

"For young men, in constant danger of being served conscription papers and sent to the front, the pressure is particularly intense. Those keen to fight volunteered long ago; Ukraine is now recruiting mostly among the unwilling. "It makes the air so thick that you can actually feel it," says Ms Zamula. Everyone knows that the cost of regained territory is dead soldiers. "Even hoping for success in the counter-offensive has become an act of self-destruction."

https://www.economist.com/europe/20...-counter-offensive-is-souring-the-public-mood
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Economists tends to lean on Chinese interest on the matter so no doubt their stories will be pointed to China and their audience. You can expect they will be reporting any issues that Ukraine is having VS the problems with the quality of the personal they been able to conscript.

"The Corporate Network relies on the "information, insight, and interaction" provided by regional experts in its parent organization.[13] 81% of its customers are business executives at the director or senior management levels. It has offices in Dubai, Johannesburg, Beijing, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Singapore and Tokyo.[14]"
 
PEB said:
Economists tends to lean on Chinese interest on the matter so no doubt their stories will be pointed to China and their audience. You can expect they will be reporting any issues that Ukraine is having VS the problems with the quality of the personal they been able to conscript.

"The Corporate Network relies on the "information, insight, and interaction" provided by regional experts in its parent organization.[13] 81% of its customers are business executives at the director or senior management levels. It has offices in Dubai, Johannesburg, Beijing, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Singapore and Tokyo.[14]"
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The Economist is one of the more trusted magazines in the world.

They posted this on the 14th. Claiming some pro-China or Russia bias in this conflict is a bit ridiculous.

https://www.economist.com/finance-a...a-will-struggle-to-cope-with-a-sinking-rouble
 
Bojka said:
The Economist is one of the more trusted magazines in the world.

They posted this on the 14th. Claiming some pro-China or Russia bias in this conflict is a bit ridiculous.

https://www.economist.com/finance-a...a-will-struggle-to-cope-with-a-sinking-rouble
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Yes, it is very biased resource because large Hong Kong banks does have very huge impact on this media.


Conscription, sorry, even in peace time wasn't popular nor in russia nor in ukraine.
Unless lad was poor.
 
So, let's take Moscow and Kiev in some 2000 th or 2019 th.

1. If you want real military career you should have military education like college or uni level. Only then you might get enlisted officer rank like leutenant and above. Normal salaries for ground forces are starting with mayor / leutenant - colonel level.

2. Private employers will gave f*** if you aren't applying to work in security company etc...

Basically all mantra : experience, experience, experience.

Therefore if you don't have military education then opportunities to rise in military ranks are limited.

Basic flowchart for lads in St Pete, Moscow was to enlist in fulltime college / uni and to find some job for weekends or evenings.
And this isn't just cos draft dogging.

After fall of USSR employers are very sharp.
If you don't learn something and don't have job this day or decent experience they are looking on your application like on peace of shit and you are peace of shit for them.

Therefore best road to avoid unemployment is to elist in some institution and then will be easier to get first job somewhere.

When you will have 1+ y. experience for CV, life for you will change.

If appliciants number is high, they will not read CVs without experience. In no case.

Also if you want to earn money in security industry better is if you will have education like military, law, police... college/ uni level.
For law degree it is at least 5 -6 years fulltime eq to be considered that maybe you know something ( master's degree + specialisation ) ....
 
Bojka said:
People who I knew in Ukraine estimated at the start of the war that maybe 10% of men had any interest in fighting. The other 90% were terrified at the prospect of it and were wanting to hide or flee. This Hollywood narrative that the majority of Ukrainians are ecstatic to be sent to the front lines to avoid living under a different flag, "not one square inch," etc. shouldn't pass anyone's smell test.

There was an article from the Economist that was also posted on that sub, but it has seemingly been taken down. It talks about the public's mood in general beginning to sour on the war and the government in response to the failure of the counteroffensive. This is also consistent with what people I know in Ukraine have been saying.

It also states the same sentiment mentioned in the articles posted by the other user.

"For young men, in constant danger of being served conscription papers and sent to the front, the pressure is particularly intense. Those keen to fight volunteered long ago; Ukraine is now recruiting mostly among the unwilling. "It makes the air so thick that you can actually feel it," says Ms Zamula. Everyone knows that the cost of regained territory is dead soldiers. "Even hoping for success in the counter-offensive has become an act of self-destruction."

https://www.economist.com/europe/20...-counter-offensive-is-souring-the-public-mood
Click to expand...


In the absence of a military breakthrough, peace negotiations with Russia would be an even harder sell. True, there have been some signs of a shift in mood, in unexpected quarters. In early August a Ukrainian sniper fighting north-west of Bakhmut made waves by dismissing the prospect of Ukraine ever regaining its full territory. He suggested that many soldiers would now welcome a ceasefire—a notion that would once have been unthinkable. But for now, few would agree. Too much blood has been spilt. “Any peace now is delayed war,” says the general-staff source. “Why hand the problem to the next generation?”

I wonder how true this statement is as I'm personally skeptical. Peace gives you time and time buys you opportunities. Things can swing in your favor before stepping onto a battlefield however I understand the sentiment. There's been a lot of lives lost and giving up now would be a tough pill to swallow.
 
lsa said:
The foundation I work for was featured in the Economist last summer edition.
Has nothing to do with this, I just wanted to brag. We had a full page in it.
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you work for RT? i kid i kid
 
General "Armageddon" Surovikin was relieved from the post of commander of the Aerospace Forces and left at the disposal of the Ministry of Defense, - RosMedia

Rest in piss bozo
 
I fully endorse anyone on either side of this conflict not fighting. It's not worth it, just worry about yourself and your loved ones. Let the elites fight their own wars. The average man is considered disposable by government and by the interests that own them. You won't see any elites on the frontlines, nor will you see women(Unless they volunteer) If all the men sent to be fodder on both the Ukrainian and Russian side refused to fight, this would be over very quickly.

Their is this notion that somehow military aged males are mandated to suffer and die on the whims of corrupt and murderous governments while everyone else sits back doing nothing. Fuck all that.
 
Bojka said:
People who I knew in Ukraine estimated at the start of the war that maybe 10% of men had any interest in fighting. The other 90% were terrified at the prospect of it and were wanting to hide or flee. This Hollywood narrative that the majority of Ukrainians are ecstatic to be sent to the front lines to avoid living under a different flag, "not one square inch," etc. shouldn't pass anyone's smell test.

There was an article from the Economist that was also posted on that sub, but it has seemingly been taken down. It talks about the public's mood in general beginning to sour on the war and the government in response to the failure of the counteroffensive. This is also consistent with what people I know in Ukraine have been saying.

It also states the same sentiment mentioned in the articles posted by the other user.

"For young men, in constant danger of being served conscription papers and sent to the front, the pressure is particularly intense. Those keen to fight volunteered long ago; Ukraine is now recruiting mostly among the unwilling. "It makes the air so thick that you can actually feel it," says Ms Zamula. Everyone knows that the cost of regained territory is dead soldiers. "Even hoping for success in the counter-offensive has become an act of self-destruction."

https://www.economist.com/europe/20...-counter-offensive-is-souring-the-public-mood
Click to expand...

But Ukraine wants to fight or something. Yeah, everyone but those being forced to fight. Put the elites, the families of the elites, and women on the frontline and see how quickly this shit stops.

I hope men keep waking up to the fact that they're more or less seen as disposable by society. They are seen as disposable manpower and disposable labor.
 
Goober stoober said:
In the absence of a military breakthrough, peace negotiations with Russia would be an even harder sell. True, there have been some signs of a shift in mood, in unexpected quarters. In early August a Ukrainian sniper fighting north-west of Bakhmut made waves by dismissing the prospect of Ukraine ever regaining its full territory. He suggested that many soldiers would now welcome a ceasefire—a notion that would once have been unthinkable. But for now, few would agree. Too much blood has been spilt. “Any peace now is delayed war,” says the general-staff source. “Why hand the problem to the next generation?”

I wonder how true this statement is as I'm personally skeptical. Peace gives you time and time buys you opportunities. Things can swing in your favor before stepping onto a battlefield however I understand the sentiment. There's been a lot of lives lost and giving up now would be a tough pill to swallow.
Click to expand...
Ceasefire might make russia only stronger and better prepared.

Maybe better might be open mouths in more honest mode.

West wants russia at least partially win something therefore such supplies.
Putin wants Ukraine but in general without ukrainians.


So there might be done one real deal.
POTUS, Senate and Congress issues U.S citizenship to all ukr willing to relocate from Ukraine.
U.S friends in Kremlin will get all Ukraine without ukrainians and everyone will be happy plus russian taxpayers will pay for reconstruction.
 
The XL said:
I fully endorse anyone on either side of this conflict not fighting. It's not worth it, just worry about yourself and your loved ones. Let the elites fight their own wars. The average man is considered disposable by government and by the interests that own them. You won't see any elites on the frontlines, nor will you see women(Unless they volunteer) If all the men sent to be fodder on both the Ukrainian and Russian side refused to fight, this would be over very quickly.

Their is this notion that somehow military aged males are mandated to suffer and die on the whims of corrupt and murderous governments while everyone else sits back doing nothing. Fuck all that.
Click to expand...

Problem is that the "elites" on one side want to erase your culture and enslave you, so you either fight or flee.

I never thought about you as a pro-refugee guy.
 
AWilder said:
General "Armageddon" Surovikin was relieved from the post of commander of the Aerospace Forces and left at the disposal of the Ministry of Defense, - RosMedia

Rest in piss bozo
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He can't turn Ukr into Alepo No2 and then all he might do is to build fortifications and install minefields, plus russia does have huge mountains with anti tank and anti infantry mines.
 
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