Throwback Rewatched Khamzat vs Usman

Greyscale said:
So now we gotta be impressed that he wasn't as gassed as everybody thought against an over-the-hill late replacement from a lower weight class.
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You dont have to be impressed. However you dont have to use it as some fact when evaluating borz in this fight.
 
kingmob6 said:
Khamzat was gassed.....No he wasn't. He looks pretty fresh all the way to the last 2 min of the third, and even then he didn't look dead or anything, just looked OK. Moves well, with energy, no visible fatigue that I see that would indicate that he was gassing out there and Usman was taking over.
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So he just randomly stops being as good of a fighter in round 2? It's happened twice now. If you don't want to call it gassing then call it something else, but don't try to pretend it doesn't happen.
 
blaseblase said:
So he just randomly stops being as good of a fighter in round 2? It's happened twice now. If you don't want to call it gassing then call it something else, but don't try to pretend it doesn't happen.
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It didnt happen here. I just call it how i saw it. He didnt look gassed.
 
kingmob6 said:
False. I simply gave it a fresh look. Dispelled a few myths
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While giving strength to your own myths..

This fight was just one of those that show that fighter X is actually human. We kind of got it from the Burns fight but yes, late replacement Usman with no camp on a 3 round fight.
 
kingmob6 said:
What would my myths be?
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First off, you're dismissing valid observations about Khamzat's cardio. Just because he wasn't completely gassed doesn't mean fatigue wasn't a factor. Fighters can slow down and lose effectiveness without looking like they're about to collapse. You're also downplaying Usman's success in rounds 2 and 3. Sure, they were competitive, but Usman was the one pushing the pace and landing the cleaner shots. A late/early takedown doesn't automatically balance out a round of better striking. Your scoring criteria seem inconsistent. You're giving a lot of weight to Khamzat's takedowns and control time in round 3, but then you're not factoring in the striking exchanges where Usman had the edge. MMA scoring isn't just about control time – effective striking and octagon control matter too.

I think you're also overlooking Usman's defensive wrestling. You mention Khamzat going 4/12 on takedowns like it's a positive, but that means Usman stuffed 8 attempts. That's significant. Look, I get that rewatching a fight can change your perspective. But I think you might be overcorrecting here. Khamzat got the win, sure, but let's not pretend it was some clear-cut victory and it is normal if some people consider it a robbery. Also don't think it is one of those fights were commentary influences anything, the fight sucked overall.
 
Didn't Usman have like the best TDD in UFC history and Khamzat ragdolled and controlled him easily in the first?
 
kingmob6 said:
Just popped up on my youtube feed, and I love UFC Eurasia.

Full fight with no commentary IN HD, amazing watch. I definitely like not hearing some biased or annoying yelling, and just forming my own thoughts without any interference.
Gotta say that my initial impressions are way different after rewatching this.

So a few things that constantly get repeated I can pretty much dismiss.
Khamzat was gassed.....No he wasn't. He looks pretty fresh all the way to the last 2 min of the third, and even then he didn't look dead or anything, just looked OK. Moves well, with energy, no visible fatigue that I see that would indicate that he was gassing out there and Usman was taking over.
Rounds 2 & 3 were actually very close, Usman did not dominate by any means. Round 2 was Usman's round, but by a very thin margin, Usman landed shots could be counted by single digits - it felt in-fight to be very low output, Khamzat threw even less, but did score a late takedown, which didn't amount to much with round expiring.
Round 3 there was a bit more activity, with Usman landing a few more shots and a few even exchanges (I saw Borz block quite a few shots), but also Khamzat got another takedown much earlier in the round and got a good amount of control time, and some scoring from the top. There were a few exchanges at the end, but nothing too significant. I can see this round going either way to be honest, depending on how prominent you score the control time for Khamzat. But scoring it for Khamzat It is not some robbery as some claim. The amount of overall strikes thrown in all 3 rounds was very low for both fighters, but I would say it was very close on success rate.

Also, it seemed like Khamzat was conserving some of his activity and looking for shots to land takedowns, and this was just making him too inactive with striking, but Usman really didn't fair much better. Borz was fainting a lot (stats say 4/12 on takedowns, but it seemed like it was more like 4/7 during the fight), trying to get in -- and only had a few takedowns overall, and honestly, that is what gives the impression that he was gassed, probably mixed in with some crappy commentary to sway an opinion.
So I would say the W for Khamzat was justified. He wasn't gassed. Usman did not dominate, won 1 round clearly. Round 3 scoring depends on how you score control time, but wasn't a slam dunk for Usman by any means.

Stats for the fight pretty on par with that.

UFC 294: Makhachev vs. Volkanovski 2 - Kamaru Usman v Khamzat Chimaev Fight Statistics

UFC 294: Makhachev vs. Volkanovski 2 - Kamaru Usman v Khamzat Chimaev Fight Statistics
sports-statistics.com sports-statistics.com
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You pretend like you're a non-biased commentator, yet every positive thing about Usman and every negative thing about Khamzat has a "but..." attached or is otherwise framed to suggest the opposite. Borderline false flag stuff
 
Shay Brennan said:
Didn't Usman have like the best TDD in UFC history and Khamzat ragdolled and controlled him easily in the first?
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Didn't Anderson Silva have the best striking in UFC history and then get TKO'd by Uriah Hall?

Usman is 37 with shot knees, it doesn't matter how good he was - father time is (as far as I'm aware) entirely undefeated.
 
blaseblase said:
So he just randomly stops being as good of a fighter in round 2? It's happened twice now. If you don't want to call it gassing then call it something else, but don't try to pretend it doesn't happen.
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Perhaps slowed down and paced is a better word. Gassing is way different
 
biscuitsbrah said:
Perhaps slowed down and paced is a better word. Gassing is way different
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People think Khamzat is gassing because he isn't sprinting like Usain Bolt out there like he does in the 1st round. Realistically the pace he still keeps after the 1st round, albeit much slower than how he started, is still a very high pace for anyone to deal with.
 
Shay Brennan said:
Didn't Usman have like the best TDD in UFC history and Khamzat ragdolled and controlled him easily in the first?
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Only on a number against mostly shite wrestlers

Georges is the TDD king along with Aldo and Jon
 
ticho123 said:
You pretend like you're a non-biased commentator, yet every positive thing about Usman and every negative thing about Khamzat has a "but..." attached or is otherwise framed to suggest the opposite. Borderline false flag stuff
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I dont know why you triggered. The mass opinion around here is that borz was gassed, usman clearly won 2&3, and looked better, should have won etc. I am pretending at nothing. Simply offered an opinion based on my personal objective view. I have no
agenda
 
If Khamzat can sustain his pressure for 3 rounds or longer, he'd be one of the greats.
 
chinarice said:
Only on a number against mostly shite wrestlers

Georges is the TDD king along with Aldo and Jon
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True.
But I disagree with the second statement.
Jose Aldo is the lone king of TDD. His elite TDD spans over 2 weight classes and was the most tested in terms of that. Even when past prime, a world class wrestler like Merab couldn't take him down once.
 
Shay Brennan said:
Didn't Usman have like the best TDD in UFC history and Khamzat ragdolled and controlled him easily in the first?
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No, both fights with Leon removed his "best TDD" stat.

Khamzat fans just love to pretend that it wasn't an out of prime Usman on super short notice - far from the best version of Usman - that Khamzat was in there with.
 
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