Rewatched islam charles

hswrestler

hswrestler

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Imo the fight was extremely close on the ground but islam had a clear edge in the striking.
Islam was able to get the takedowns but did little damage and charles was able to threaten submissions to get up basically at will.
Islam's finish was due to him rocking Oliveira which lead to the submission.

In his fight against dariush, Oliveira was still making the same striking mistakes against he did against Islam. Oliveira led with a knee which lead to a quick islam counter and he led with an obvious high kick against Dariush multiple times but Dariush was too slow to counter. He did look a bit faster compared to his fight against islam but at almost 34 I doubt he'd have a speed advantage against islam as islam had a clear speed advantage last fight.

That being said if islam is unable to hit Oliveira with something significant, he will be in for a long night as he'd find Oliveira hard to keep down and dangerous as ever on his feet.

Overall I'd favor islam as Oliveira would need a bang headshot dead moment but if anyone could get those moments it would be Oliveira.
 
Fengxian said:
No, the ground game wasn't close at all. Islam had clear advantage in the striking because Oliveira is so affraid to get taken down.

I guarantee if it's just kickboxing match Oliveira would win. Dagestani's grappling is just on different level.
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Oliveira did more damage on the ground and was able to get up quickly when he wasn't rocked. Oliveira has power but leaves himself open to counters
 
hswrestler said:
Imo the fight was extremely close on the ground but islam had a clear edge in the striking.
Islam was able to get the takedowns but did little damage and charles was able to threaten submissions to get up basically at will.
Islam's finish was due to him rocking Oliveira which lead to the submission.

In his fight against dariush, Oliveira was still making the same striking mistakes against he did against Islam. Oliveira led with a knee which lead to a quick islam counter and he led with an obvious high kick against Dariush multiple times but Dariush was too slow to counter. He did look a bit faster compared to his fight against islam but at almost 34 I doubt he'd have a speed advantage against islam as islam had a clear speed advantage last fight.

That being said if islam is unable to hit Oliveira with something significant, he will be in for a long night as he'd find Oliveira hard to keep down and dangerous as ever on his feet.

Overall I'd favor islam as Oliveira would need a bang headshot dead moment but if anyone could get those moments it would be Oliveira.
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You are going to get shit for this.

Fanboys think it was a one sided beatdown, one fighter running throug the other one etc.
But those who understand what they are watching, they know how that played out.
 
People will not agree because they saw islam on top, which means he was winning to them. They also thought lee was winning on top of charles lol. The truth is that islam was in defense mode during a lot of the mat grappling exchanges and Charles's activity from bottom shut down most of Islam's ground and pound.

The problem was charles running into the same counter over and over on the feet.
 
Oliviera did land an upkick which could finish Islam but it didnt.
Islam was by far the better grappler , it was not even close. Islam was the one on top and controlling the fight when they were on the ground.Charles was not able to take Islam down, he was just trying to escape.

but doesnt matter , next fight all will be different, I am with Islam but Charles is dangerous
 
Islam was a step above Charles everytime , everywhere.

Rocked him on the feet and finished him on the ground.

Charles made weird decisions like pulling guard and his striking looked a bit less polished than usual.

On the ground Islam did not accomplished much beside the sub but so did Charles.


Also 0 reason to favor Charles if you need to do mental gymnastics for your boy to win then he's gonna lose.
 
hswrestler said:
Imo the fight was extremely close on the ground but islam had a clear edge in the striking.
Islam was able to get the takedowns but did little damage and charles was able to threaten submissions to get up basically at will.
Islam's finish was due to him rocking Oliveira which lead to the submission.

In his fight against dariush, Oliveira was still making the same striking mistakes against he did against Islam. Oliveira led with a knee which lead to a quick islam counter and he led with an obvious high kick against Dariush multiple times but Dariush was too slow to counter. He did look a bit faster compared to his fight against islam but at almost 34 I doubt he'd have a speed advantage against islam as islam had a clear speed advantage last fight.

That being said if islam is unable to hit Oliveira with something significant, he will be in for a long night as he'd find Oliveira hard to keep down and dangerous as ever on his feet.

Overall I'd favor islam as Oliveira would need a bang headshot dead moment but if anyone could get those moments it would be Oliveira.
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Nice post and agree with a lot of what you said. Having said that the fight didn't last long enough to see what would have happened on the ground. Charles did get stuck for a few minutes under Islam back end of the first round but sometimes it's usually the 5th or 6th takedown where these takedowns REALLY begin to take a toll.

Charles is super dangerous on the ground and I think Islam's top control is slightly overrated BUT the fact is Charles did not want to go on the ground in the second round, he was aggressively defending any takedown efforts along the cage and wasn't striking as recklessly as he usually does. So, perhaps...the first round top control did make him adjust his gameplan.

Anyway, fight didn't last long enough to make a definite call either way.
 
Charles has a highly active guard which puts the top guy immediately in defence mode BUT is it the same after a round or 3 when you start to feel the weight of being stuck below your opponent for long periods. I doubt it but we probably would never find out, Charles' fights never last long lol.
 
Rektkid said:
Charles is super dangerous on the ground and I think Islam's top control is slightly overrated BUT the fact is Charles did not want to go on the ground in the second round, he was aggressively defending any takedown efforts along the cage and wasn't striking as recklessly as he usually does. So, perhaps...the first round top control did make him adjust his gameplan.
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Excellent point! Charles basically pulled guard on that first takedown. Tried to throw up a triangle but soon realized that wasn't going to work. Then proceeded to hold Islam hoping not to get hit by too many gnp. By the end of the round Charles knew his bottom game wasn't going to work and that's why he tried so hard to keep it standing in the 2nd. I mean why didn't he pull guard again if he was doing so well on the bottom cause he certainly was getting the worse of the standup?
 
yeah its not the grappling im worried about for charles he was doing fine in it, unless it goes to the later rounds (idk how good or bad his tank is). He has shown an ability to get up from under islam and defend his takedowns against the fence, though I do worry about the control time if he is stuck by the fence even if he takes little damage. Its him car crashing with no head movement like the 1st fight went that worries me the most
 
Charles was getting smushed by Islam's top pressure.

He really has nothing for him. Striking, grappling, strength, IQ, all goes to Islam. They can both knock eachother out but I'd put money on Islam repeating what he did last time... wobble Charles and snatch him up in a sub. Punch to Tapout in 5 sec.
 
hswrestler said:
Imo the fight was extremely close on the ground but islam had a clear edge in the striking.
Islam was able to get the takedowns but did little damage and charles was able to threaten submissions to get up basically at will.
Islam's finish was due to him rocking Oliveira which lead to the submission.

In his fight against dariush, Oliveira was still making the same striking mistakes against he did against Islam. Oliveira led with a knee which lead to a quick islam counter and he led with an obvious high kick against Dariush multiple times but Dariush was too slow to counter. He did look a bit faster compared to his fight against islam but at almost 34 I doubt he'd have a speed advantage against islam as islam had a clear speed advantage last fight.

That being said if islam is unable to hit Oliveira with something significant, he will be in for a long night as he'd find Oliveira hard to keep down and dangerous as ever on his feet.

Overall I'd favor islam as Oliveira would need a bang headshot dead moment but if anyone could get those moments it would be Oliveira.
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I hope to see how it plays out if charles doesnt get hurt, it's just that Charles tends to get hit and hurt so consistently. Usually he has the get out of jail card of falling to guard and challenging dudes to follow him down, but he doesn't really have that option against Islam who showed he's able to follow him down safely if he hurts him

I'm hoping to see Charles test Islam's grit and survival ability by hurting him bad with something and/or drag the fight into the championship rounds and test Islam's gas tank after the way it looked suspect vs Volk
 
fortheo said:
People will not agree because they saw islam on top, which means he was winning to them. They also thought lee was winning on top of charles lol. The truth is that islam was in defense mode during a lot of the mat grappling exchanges and Charles's activity from bottom shut down most of Islam's ground and pound.

The problem was charles running into the same counter over and over on the feet.
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Charles went with 1 triangle attempt and then switched to a closed guard for the rest of the round, people don't go for a closed guard when they're looking for subs from the bottom
 
Pious Augustus said:
Charles went with 1 triangle attempt and then switched to a closed guard for the rest of the round, people don't go for a closed guard when they're looking for subs from the bottom
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So you missed the baratoplata setup, and the armbar attempt?
It must suck to watch the fights and miss 70% of the action. High level BJJ in mma is like casting pearls before swine.
 
hswrestler said:
Imo the fight was extremely close on the ground but islam had a clear edge in the striking.
Islam was able to get the takedowns but did little damage and charles was able to threaten submissions to get up basically at will.
Islam's finish was due to him rocking Oliveira which lead to the submission.

In his fight against dariush, Oliveira was still making the same striking mistakes against he did against Islam. Oliveira led with a knee which lead to a quick islam counter and he led with an obvious high kick against Dariush multiple times but Dariush was too slow to counter. He did look a bit faster compared to his fight against islam but at almost 34 I doubt he'd have a speed advantage against islam as islam had a clear speed advantage last fight.

That being said if islam is unable to hit Oliveira with something significant, he will be in for a long night as he'd find Oliveira hard to keep down and dangerous as ever on his feet.

Overall I'd favor islam as Oliveira would need a bang headshot dead moment but if anyone could get those moments it would be Oliveira.
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I think the first fight and Islam's fight with Volk shows that Islam's striking is pretty underrated. Charles was rocked by the first straight left that Islam threw early on.

I don't see any way Charles wins this aside from a Hail Mary sub. He isn't particularly good at preventing takedowns (and seems far to comfy on his back when he is taken down) and his striking will be compromised because of the above and the fact that Islam hurt him before.
 
Pious Augustus said:
Charles went with 1 triangle attempt and then switched to a closed guard for the rest of the round, people don't go for a closed guard when they're looking for subs from the bottom
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My memory from before charles was rocked badly:

Islam lands in half guard, then charles re-gained guard, then threatens an armbar to triangle transition. Islam postures out, goes to half guard again and applies heavy shoulder pressure, charles creates space, uses deep half to transition to a leg attack which islam wants nothing to do with so he turns to pull out completely, allowing charles to come behind Islam on a body lock in order to get back to his feet. By the way, a similar leg attack sequence happened in the dariush fight, but dariush didn't fear it as much as islam did and defended and stayed on top, where as islam respected the threat a lot more and chose to disengage, thus giving charles space to get back up.

Later on islam gets a nice body lock in the clinch, lands a nice throw, stays heavy on charles with his chin under charles, smooshing charles against the cage. This is the best place for islam if he wants to grapple with charles. He gets some control time and soft gnp, but the round ends with islam eating an up kick and charles setting up a triangle.

Mind you I'm not saying charles won the grappling -- but it wasn't as black and white as some fans will make you believe.
 
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