Remember back when LnP was a thing in the UFC?

[Stonehenge]

Stupid wall n stall!

 

[Edgar Allan Hoe]

LnP has died down but GnP is pretty much non-existent as well unless somebody gets rocked before they hit the mat.

 

[tenniswhiz]

You remember that shit? People were always making threads here about the horrible travesty of how the unified rules are biased toward wrestlers and all different ideas for rule changes they should make to create a more even playing field for striking. Then what happened? A few years later the fighters have evolved, and it's not a common thing anymore. All the best fighters have found ways of getting it back to the feet and controlling where the fight goes. Nobody in the upper echelon of MMA competition is content to keep their opponent in guard and throw up hail mary triangles for fifteen minutes anymore; a whole array of techniques have been integrated into every competent bottom game for getting the fight back to the feet when fighters can't sweep or submit, and that game is still evolving. Haters can hate, but MMA is still awesome and it's so cool to watch the sport evolve.

The sport is still biased towards wrestlers, or rather, towards wrestling rules.

Getting back to the feet is all good, but you're now "behind" and are playing catch up.
These surprise TD's in the midst of a standup fight, with no intention of pursuing any further action on the ground is a huge scoring tactic. I've seen countless TD's from guys like Edgar and MM like this. Hell, I've even seen GSP do it against Shields...
Pressing your opponent's back to the cage wall is another big scoring tactic.

Take a guy down once for a few seconds in an otherwise even round and win the round 10-9.
With the standup even, take the guy down, pass guard, get mount, land some GnP, take the back, look for subs... and STILL you only get a 10-9.
Yes, the sport is biased towards wrestling. Any type of wrestling scoring (pins, near falls, TD's) also score in MMA.

 

[Forkfoot]

Take a guy down once for a few seconds in an otherwise even round and win the round 10-9.

If the standup was even, why wouldn't slightly more effective grappling win the round?

 

[tenniswhiz]

If the standup was even, why wouldn't slightly more effective grappling win the round?

You are interpreting the rules.

I am criticizing them.
A 'surprise' TD is not effective grappling. Especially if you don't keep the guy down or you take him down with 10 seconds left.

 

[biscuitsbrah]

I think the stand ups from the refs are a lot faster than they used to be as well. Either way I'm so glad it's gone

 

[Fight Professor]

Fitch, Shields and Davis were cut. GSP retired. Sonnen quit. Maynard fell in love with his striking.

 

[Forkfoot]

You are interpreting the rules.

I am criticizing them.
A 'surprise' TD is not effective grappling. Especially if you don't keep the guy down or you take him down with 10 seconds left.

I strongly disagree. All other things being equal, why shouldn't imposing your will on your opponent and temporarily forcing him into a disadvantageous position win you the round? Even if you don't do any damage, you forced your opponent to do something he was trying to avoid. All other things being equal, you're doing more imo.

 

[roventu]

Fitch, Shields and Davis were cut. GSP retired. Sonnen quit. Maynard fell in love with his striking.

davis wasn't cut. his contract expired and he chose to go to bellator


Hendricks displayed some wall'n'stall in his second fight vs Lawler. Dong still exists. I think cathal Pendred is a successful wall n staller, but he has tried to be a striker in his last few fights haha not many LnPers, although i recall Kawajiri's last fight was a stinker.

 

[Andy Capp]

Exactly. Also, judges have been less apt to reward it than they were in the past. I think any evolution beyond LnP had more to do with incentives being changed rather than with fighters becoming more skilled.

That seems pretty likely to me also while at the same time, I don't believe lay'n pray ever occurred nearly as much as this thread might indicate.

 

[JKS]

More rare to see it these days, guys are moved evolved

 

[VAfan]

it still exists though. as much as i hate to admit it because i was pulling for both guys, but both shields and mendes were doing it for almost entire rounds in their last fights.