Putin makes Holocaust denial a criminal offence punishable by up to five years in jail.

[uptheirons!]

i know i am saying it is my prediction that will happen within Poland. A young nationalist pole might come to see that thates Russia is not they enemy.


This was ready explained to you they did not count all those millions as jewish. Only 1 million so the number reduced was non jewish people mainly soviet prisoners. The soviets inflated the number.


Abig is a holocaust 'revisionist' which means basically denier or someone who thinks only like 200000 died. The person you are arguing with is same one who claims care about human rights but never mention abuse or horrors in Muslim world or African world or anywhere else but only in Israel against Palestinians. Abig also is one of those 'anti Zionists'.

They were off by 3 million, my last post didn't distinguish between jew and non-jew. If their numbers are that far out of wack then it shows they're just guesstimating and have no real evidence.

And you're the type of jackass who'll criticize everyone BUT Israel for human rights abuses, so go fuck yourself.

 

[Seaside]

It's not like Russia ever had free speech.

Have they made Holodomor/Stalin's purges denial a criminal offense yet?

It was an accident becauae negligence. But ukraine recognises it. They tried to pass laws against denying it but it failed because pro communists and pro Russian side not support it because they argue it was an accident.

They were off by 3 million, my last post didn't distinguish between jew and non-jew. If their numbers are that far out of wack then it shows they're just guesstimating and have no real evidence.

And you're the type of jackass who'll criticize everyone BUT Israel for human rights abuses, so go fuck yourself.

Huh? I dislike religion and so don'the care or give Israel special treatment. I just call like it is with that said I think Israel is better than the Muslim world. But at same time I actually lie and respect Islam as a religion more than christianity from religious view. Even though I think all 3 of that hough hse religions are insane and nonsense.

You are basically a wack job going onowhere about 3 million which is explained and which not the entire world to into account. So much more science evidence and historians and evidence proves your denial claims are just only the opinion of a idiot.

 

[TheGreatA]

It was an accident becauae negligence. But ukraine recognises it. They tried to pass laws against denying it but it failed because pro communists and pro Russian side not support it because they argue it was an accident.

One could make the case that the entire USSR structure was one big "accident".

That seems to be the general interpretation of it, for the Soviets. Everything bad is excused because it was done with good intentions. Including the starvation of millions.

Atleast the Nazis owned up to the fact that they were just a bunch of scumbags, out for themselves.

 

[uptheirons!]

It was an accident becauae negligence. But ukraine recognises it. They tried to pass laws against denying it but it failed because pro communists and pro Russian side not support it because they argue it was an accident.



Huh? I dislike religion and so don'the care or give Israel special treatment. I just call like it is with that said I think Israel is better than the Muslim world. But at same time I actually lie and respect Islam as a religion more than christianity from religious view. Even though I think all 3 of that hough hse religions are insane and nonsense.

You are basically a wack job going onowhere about 3 million which is explained and which not the entire world to into account. So much more science evidence and historians and evidence proves your denial claims are just only the opinion of a idiot.

I never denied anything, moron. I pointed out that if they're off by 3 million for 45 years then people have the right to question the official narrative. And Israel is worse than the Muslim countries because they do it with impunity while sucking american taxpayers dry and pretending to be a "beacon of democracy", when in fact they're a racist apartheid state occupying another people's land.

 

[Seaside]

One could make the case that the entire USSR structure was one big "accident".

That seems to be the general interpretation of it, for the Soviets. Everything bad is excused because it was done with good intentions. Including the starvation of millions.

Atleast the Nazis owned up to the fact that they were just a bunch of scumbags, out for themselves.

Nazis had a racial genocidal ambitions not same thing.

I never denied anything, moron. I pointed out that if they're off by 3 million for 45 years then people have the right to question the official narrative. And Israel is worse than the Muslim countries because they do it with impunity while sucking american taxpayers dry and pretending to be a "beacon of democracy", when in fact they're a racist apartheid state occupying another people's land.

Okay so you are an extremist who promotes wack job conspiracy theory.

 

[uptheirons!]

Nazis had a racial genocidal ambitions not same thing.


Okay so you are an extremist wack job got it.

Ok so you are a brain-dead zionist wingnut sheep, got it.

 

[Seaside]

Ok so you are a brain-dead zionist wingnut sheep, got it.

So I am a zionists because I know that the holocaust is real and that denying it is retarded?

 

[uptheirons!]

So I am a zionists because I know that the holocaust is real and that denying it is retarded?

No one here denied anything. You're a zionist mutt for downplaying the atrocities committed by Israeli pigs.

 

[TheGreatA]

Nazis had a racial genocidal ambitions not same thing.

I don't see how racist genocide differs from other types of genocide.

A lot of people get murdered either way.

 

[Seaside]

I don't see how racist genocide differs from other types of genocide.

A lot of people get murdered either way.

Genocide is always religious or race base. I am saying most people think soviet thing was accidental and not based on them wanting kill millions of Ukrainians.

 

[Seaside]

No one here denied anything. You're a zionist mutt for downplaying the atrocities committed by Israeli pigs.

WTF? Are people seeing how nuts this guy is?

 

[uptheirons!]

WTF? Are people seeing how nuts this guy is?

You've never commented on the occupation and atrocities of the zionists? Are you saying I've mixed you up with one of the other inbred wingnuts who defends israel?

 

[TheGreatA]

Genocide is always religious or race base. I am saying most people think soviet thing was accidental and not based on them wanting kill millions of Ukrainians.

Considering that it was state policy to sanction and "starve out" particularly troubling groups of peasants, in order to enforce the collectivization of their lands, I find that difficult to believe.

Ukrainians were the most troublesome of them all, since they were the most individualistic and rebellious bunch. It's obvious that most of the sanctions were directed against Ukrainians in particular.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colle...sistance_to_collectivization_and_consequences

 

[Seaside]

You've never commented on the occupation and atrocities of the zionists? Are you saying I've mixed you up with one of the other inbred wingnuts who defends israel?

Who talks like how you talk? You are off rails. Where do you live? For your sake you better hope it is not a country you can be arrested for this speech of crazy.

I dont focus on Israel case they do not bother my country or nobody except Palestinians. I focus more on USA because the Americans the ones with history of regime change all throughout latin america and africa and asia and it is the americans who encircle china and russia and
destroyed iraq and libya with there allies. Palestinians are not exacrly victims and. the hypocritcal muslim world. So I ignore the whines of Muslim world when they focus on Israel is influenced by the hee stupid religion.

Considering that it was state policy to sanction and "starve out" particularly troubling groups of peasants, in order to enforce the collectivization of their lands, I find that difficult to believe.

Ukrainians were the most troublesome of them all, since they were the most individualistic and rebellious bunch. It's obvious that most of the sanctions were directed against Ukrainians in particular.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colle...sistance_to_collectivization_and_consequences

What are you arguing for? You do realise many still dispute if it was on purpose or not? Nobody is to deny the collectivization but what they do is to ask was purpose to kill millions?

 

[TheGreatA]

What are you arguing for? You do realise many still dispute if it was on purpose or not? Nobody is to deny the collectivization but what they do is to ask was purpose to kill millions?

In most Russian nihilist philosophy (which the Russian revolution, in truth, derives from, more so than Marxism, which served merely as a vehicle to achieve the goals), the general understanding was that tens of millions of people would have to die, so that a new society could be built in the old one's place. So I would certainly say that the possibility of that was seen as an "acceptable loss" by Soviet leadership.

It is funny (and of course, horrifying) how Stalin ended up imposing Dostoevsky's depiction of nihilist/socialist philosophy:

"Shigalyev is a historian and social theorist, the intellectual of Verkhovensky's revolutionary group, who has devised a system for the post-revolution organization of mankind. "My conclusion" he says, "stands in direct contradiction to the idea from which I started. Proceeding from unlimited freedom, I end with unlimited despotism."[49] Ninety percent of society is to be enslaved to the remaining ten percent. Equality of the herd is to be enforced by police state tactics, state terrorism, and destruction of intellectual, artistic, and cultural life. It is estimated that about a hundred million people will need to be killed on the way to the goal."

Considering that Stalin received his education in life as a bank robber, murderer, torturer, kidnapper for Lenin's revolution, it's not a stretch to say that he probably subscribed to a similar viewpoint, as the Russian nihilists. He was well-known to have been completely amoral and ruthless, uncaring of anyone else's plights, including that of his own family.

 

[uptheirons!]

Who talks like how you talk? You are off rails. Where do you live? For your sake you better hope it is not a country you can be arrested for this speech of crazy.

I dont focus on Israel case they do not bother my country or nobody except Palestinians. I focus more on USA because the Americans the ones with history of regime change all throughout latin america and africa and asia and it is the americans who encircle china and russia and
destroyed iraq and libya with there allies. Palestinians are not exacrly victims and. the hypocritcal muslim world. So I ignore the whines of Muslim world when they focus on Israel is influenced by the hee stupid religion.


What are you arguing for? You do realise many still dispute if it was on purpose or not? Nobody is to deny the collectivization but what they do is to ask was purpose to kill millions?

More bullshit. Palestinians are victims by every definition of the word.

You clearly have no idea how many countries Israel has attacked, or how they influenced Congress on Iraq, and tried to do the same with regards to Iran. They're a menace and a rogue state. And no one whines more than the zionist pigs, or plays the race card more than them, so stop talking smack you ignorant buffoon.

 

[Trotsky]

Now we're veering into territory where I have to side with the Holocaust revisionists.

Palestinians are absolutely the victims by any rational appraisal of the situation.

 

[uptheirons!]

Now we're veering into territory where I have to side with the Holocaust revisionists.

Palestinians are absolutely the victims by any rational appraisal of the situation.

I'm not a revisionist, I just gave reasons for why I think people should be allowed to question the official narrative without being jailed. Whether 600 died or 6 million won't change or affect my life.

 

[ImNotSurpisedDonks!]

If questioning a narrative is illegal, then who is the one that decides the narratives? Historians are still split on what exactly happened in WWII, the Holocaust and after you read 'The Holocaust Industry', you realize why this subject is a touchy one, as some lofty positioned people have profited trillions of dollars off the Holocaust. We dont teach history in our schools, we indoctrinate with propaganda and create a bunch of dum dums that think everything in history was black or white.

 

[TheGreatA]

I'm not a revisionist, I just gave reasons for why I think people should be allowed to question the official narrative without being jailed. Whether 600 died or 6 million won't change or affect my life.

I think people should be allowed to question it, even if the figures were undeniably fool-proof and set in stone.

The inconvenience of having Holocaust deniers around, is one that I'm personally far more willing to live with, than the idea of a society being able to punish its citizens for an opinion that they may hold. Regardless of how untrue it might be. The state doesn't get to determine what is true or not.

We don't punish people for questioning the number of victims of Mongol invasions or Napoleonic wars, either. Or Stalin's purges, as I've previously referred to.