PS5 announced for 2020 Holiday Season

[GSP_37]

Can I stick a PS2 or PS3 disc in PS5 and play it, or is the disc only to prove you have legal possession of the disc so you can download the digital game only if they make it available?

I don't think I have enough PS2 memory cards and doubt I can buy more.

 

[COHAB]

Well yeah, the XBone doesn't play every 360 and Xbox game ever but it is a solid list nonetheless. As long as the PS5 can play big-name titles like Horizon Zero Dawn, The Last of Us, Bloodborne etc. most people are gonna be happy with the feature.

Yes, I hope so...I'd would love to play these games on ps5

 

[TrueBias]

Diminishing returns on graphics improvements

It's an old example but honestly more to the point.

Theres not an need for anything 'better. '

 

[rob mafia]

strongly disagreed, esp from a fps perspective. either definition of fps, really...

 

[empsim]

People also thought it couldn't get much better than Half-Life 2, and look at it now...

There is still massive room for improvement especially in lighting & physics, next gen probably still won't come anywhere close to really being as good as it gets.

As for the PS5, games line-up for the first few months will probably be trash again, but I will still be there day 1 - again.

 

[jefferz]

It's an old example but honestly more to the point.

Theres not an need for anything 'better. '

 

[Madmick]

We built a 'next-gen' Zen 2/Navi-based PC - how much faster is it than current-gen consoles?
Eurogamer doing their thing. They and Digital Foundry are just about the only websites that know their asses from their elbows that devote any kind of serious space towards technical speculation & analyses of the consoles:

Development kits are out, game makers are briefed. Sony's PlayStation 5 and Xbox Project Scarlett projects are under way - however, detailed specifications of the consoles are still a subject of much speculation. What has been confirmed is that both machines once again have much in common: both are produced in concert with AMD, both use the Zen 2 CPU architecture while the graphics cores are based on the latest Radeon Navi technology. The question is: can this deliver a full generational leap over PlayStation 4 and Xbox One?

I decided to get some idea of how these new technologies compare stacked up against the current-gen machines - specifically, the enhanced PS4 Pro and Xbox One X. The work was the basis of a presentation I delivered a couple of days ago at EGX 2019, where Asus Republic of Gamers helped out by building an AMD-based PC based on my specifications. Aspects of this unit were then tuned to match the increasingly compelling leaks based on the Gonzalo processor under development by AMD, a chip that is now almost certain to be the SoC within PlayStation 5.

This is what Asus decided ought to perform roughly equally to the PS5. Eurogamer and Digital Foundry usually afford ~30% processing power overhead to their mimic PC in order to acknowledge the advantage in optimization the console versions of games are afforded.

• CPU: Ryzen 7 3700X with Wraith Prism cooler
• GPU: Asus ROG Strix RX 5700XT (RX 5700 also used)
• Motherboard: Asus ROG Strix B450F Gaming
• Memory: 2x 8GB DDR4 3600MHz
• Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD
• Power Supply: Asus ROG 650W
• Optical Drive: Pioneer 4K UHD Blu-ray
• Case: Coolermaster N300

The GPU's clock really is impressively high, but on top of that, easily the most impressive jump here will be in CPU performance. Leaping from 1.8GHz in the previous gen's baseline to 3.2GHz, still octacore, with the even higher RISC architectural improvements, is going to supercharge the consoles, especially if they manage to use GDDR6 RAM as shared system RAM again like they did with GDDR5 for the PS4.

It's no wonder the Dev Kit has a design that is so obviously devoted to better cooling.

 

[rikwebb]

The GPU's clock really is impressively high, but on top of that, easily the most impressive jump here will be in CPU performance. Leaping from 1.8GHz in the previous gen's baseline to 3.2GHz, still octacore, with the even higher RISC architectural improvements, is going to supercharge the consoles, especially if they manage to use GDDR6 RAM as shared system RAM again like they did with GDDR5 for the PS4.

Plus the GPU has 3 speed settings, 800mhz, 911hmz and 2ghz from the Oberon tests. 800mhz is the PS4 clock and 911mhz is the Pro clock speeds. So they have the speeds ready for the Backwards Compatibility PS4 stuff.

Plus hopefully the 5700XT is just the tip of the iceberg for the GPU as i wouldn't be surprised if some RDNA 2 features are chucked in alongside the hardware ray tracing stuff.

 

[560ti]

We built a 'next-gen' Zen 2/Navi-based PC - how much faster is it than current-gen consoles?
Eurogamer doing their thing. They and Digital Foundry are just about the only websites that know their asses from their elbows that devote any kind of serious space towards technical speculation & analyses of the consoles:

This is what Asus decided ought to perform roughly equally to the PS5. Eurogamer and Digital Foundry usually afford ~30% processing power overhead to their mimic PC in order to acknowledge the advantage in optimization the console versions of games are afforded.

• CPU: Ryzen 7 3700X with Wraith Prism cooler
• GPU: Asus ROG Strix RX 5700XT (RX 5700 also used)
• Motherboard: Asus ROG Strix B450F Gaming
• Memory: 2x 8GB DDR4 3600MHz
• Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD
• Power Supply: Asus ROG 650W
• Optical Drive: Pioneer 4K UHD Blu-ray
• Case: Coolermaster N300

I understand what he's trying to say (it's 100% gonna smoke the PS4 performance for it's time) but I think he's overshooting it a little bit. The CPU is gonna have a single core boost of 3.2ghz but all cores I don't see it consistently being past the mid 2ghz.

GPU will be good but I don't see it being groundbreaking. I see it in the third party 2060 (non super), 1080, 5700 non XT realm.

Performance will be good but when it comes out it will reality is it will be on par with an almost 2 year old mid tier PC. That's why I laughed when he threw a $300+ CPU in there and said because of 30% overhead but the consoles are the ones currently disabling 25% of the cores for games.

Still will be good. When the PS4 came out you could literally buy a GPU 2x faster for $150 and the PS4 was using a lowend laptop CPU. Nothing close to that will happen next holiday

Plus the GPU has 3 speed settings, 800mhz, 911hmz and 2ghz from the Oberon tests. 800mhz is the PS4 clock and 911mhz is the Pro clock speeds. So they have the speeds ready for the Backwards Compatibility PS4 stuff.

Plus hopefully the 5700XT is just the tip of the iceberg for the GPU as i wouldn't be surprised if some RDNA 2 features are chucked in alongside the hardware ray tracing stuff.

I hope it doesn't get downgraded 2x last last gen.

All these editors where ranting about how the PS4 developers kit was on par with a 7950, then changed months later to now "7870 performance" then when it finally came out it was barely on par with a stock 7850 and the xboxone was even a slower than that

That's why I don't get too excited with these leaks/predictions. They talk big talk but reality is there trying to make money on selling these + power restrictions. Don't get me wrong though, it will be good (just having an SSD and getting rid of the garbage Jaguar CPU alone is huge)

 

[PEB]

We built a 'next-gen' Zen 2/Navi-based PC - how much faster is it than current-gen consoles?
Eurogamer doing their thing. They and Digital Foundry are just about the only websites that know their asses from their elbows that devote any kind of serious space towards technical speculation & analyses of the consoles:

This is what Asus decided ought to perform roughly equally to the PS5. Eurogamer and Digital Foundry usually afford ~30% processing power overhead to their mimic PC in order to acknowledge the advantage in optimization the console versions of games are afforded.

• CPU: Ryzen 7 3700X with Wraith Prism cooler
• GPU: Asus ROG Strix RX 5700XT (RX 5700 also used)
• Motherboard: Asus ROG Strix B450F Gaming
• Memory: 2x 8GB DDR4 3600MHz
• Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD
• Power Supply: Asus ROG 650W
• Optical Drive: Pioneer 4K UHD Blu-ray
• Case: Coolermaster N300

The GPU's clock really is impressively high, but on top of that, easily the most impressive jump here will be in CPU performance. Leaping from 1.8GHz in the previous gen's baseline to 3.2GHz, still octacore, with the even higher RISC architectural improvements, is going to supercharge the consoles, especially if they manage to use GDDR6 RAM as shared system RAM again like they did with GDDR5 for the PS4.

It's no wonder the Dev Kit has a design that is so obviously devoted to better cooling.

I saw a photo of what I believe was a photo of the PS5 motherboard and it has a heats sink unlike anything I and the person who showed it said. It's huge and forged unlike a cut part with cooling tubes running into it. Its GPU is not a regular AMD part and its part of a SOC but specific to Sony. It has Sony specific enhancements such as AI and ray-tracing apparently AMD working on their own ray-tracing and this has additional features not present in the AMD offering. There are cloud specific abilities to speed the processing of large datasets and texture maps.

 

[jefferz]

I saw a photo of what I believe was a photo of the PS5 motherboard and it has a heats sink unlike anything I and the person who showed it said. It's huge and forged unlike a cut part with cooling tubes running into it. Its GPU is not a regular AMD part and its part of a SOC but specific to Sony. It has Sony specific enhancements such as AI and ray-tracing apparently AMD working on their own ray-tracing and this has additional features not present in the AMD offering. There are cloud specific abilities to speed the processing of large datasets and texture maps.

There's been Ray Tracing code in AMD's drivers since July.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amds-drivers-have-apparently-had-ray-tracing-code-since-july

 

[PEB]

There's been Ray Tracing code in AMD's drivers since July.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amds-drivers-have-apparently-had-ray-tracing-code-since-july

I know about the software enhancements on the GPU drivers since July this is hardware enhancement with Sony specific hardware and microcode modifications. Sony been working on their own specific hardware modifications for their SOC. AMD actually through open source ray tracing API been able to handle it for a few years in realtime with substantial CPU overhead. Nvidia implementation is hardware based and beat AMD to market by over a year this was the reason why AMD downplayed the significance of the technology and released their software drivers. The biggest win for Nvidia was being able to decompress large and very large texture maps and raytrace the lighting in realtime using 2080 or the 2070 TI with these advanced shaders. AMD will have their own hardware based solution in early 2020 and possibly being a superior solution given the extra time they took on the NAVI related stuff.

 

[GearSolidMetal]

I don't know what most of the PC technical jargon means, but based on how advanced this technology is sounding it really makes me doubt its going to have a $400 pricepoint.

$600 minimum.

 

[rikwebb]

I saw a photo of what I believe was a photo of the PS5 motherboard and it has a heats sink unlike anything I and the person who showed it said. It's huge and forged unlike a cut part with cooling tubes running into it. Its GPU is not a regular AMD part and its part of a SOC but specific to Sony. It has Sony specific enhancements such as AI and ray-tracing apparently AMD working on their own ray-tracing and this has additional features not present in the AMD offering. There are cloud specific abilities to speed the processing of large datasets and texture maps.

Machine learning has been mentioned a few times lately in regards to PS5 stuff by some developers also.

 

[jefferz]

Machine learning has been mentioned a few times lately in regards to PS5 stuff by some developers also.

Ryzen cpus already have this, it’s called SenseMI

 

[rikwebb]

Ryzen cpus already have this, it’s called SenseMI

Wasn't aware of that, thanks

 

[jefferz]

I don't know what most of the PC technical jargon means, but based on how advanced this technology is sounding it really makes me doubt its going to have a $400 pricepoint.

$600 minimum.

Depends on how much of a loss they’re willing to take. Sony and Microsoft lose money at launch. Nintendo only started doing this with the Switch.

 

[Madmick]

I understand what he's trying to say (it's 100% gonna smoke the PS4 performance for it's time) but I think he's overshooting it a little bit. The CPU is gonna have a single core boost of 3.2ghz but all cores I don't see it consistently being past the mid 2ghz.

GPU will be good but I don't see it being groundbreaking. I see it in the third party 2060 (non super), 1080, 5700 non XT realm.

Performance will be good but when it comes out it will reality is it will be on par with an almost 2 year old mid tier PC. That's why I laughed when he threw a $300+ CPU in there and said because of 30% overhead but the consoles are the ones currently disabling 25% of the cores for games.

Still will be good. When the PS4 came out you could literally buy a GPU 2x faster for $150 and the PS4 was using a lowend laptop CPU. Nothing close to that will happen next holiday

I hope it doesn't get downgraded 2x last last gen.

All these editors where ranting about how the PS4 developers kit was on par with a 7950, then changed months later to now "7870 performance" then when it finally came out it was barely on par with a stock 7850 and the xboxone was even a slower than that

That's why I don't get too excited with these leaks/predictions. They talk big talk but reality is there trying to make money on selling these + power restrictions. Don't get me wrong though, it will be good (just having an SSD and getting rid of the garbage Jaguar CPU alone is huge)

Agreed. I don't mind the 30% buffer in terms of FLOP power afforded to the analogue build, since despite pure horsepower parity the Radeon 7850 obviously can't keep up with the PS4 practically in 2019, but the R7-3700X definitely appears to be overkill affording well above a 30% increase in FLOP power. After all, the 3700X is an 8-core (16-thread!) CPU that turbos on all cores to at least 3.9GHz. I'll wait until we see figures on FLOPs and all that before I scruple anything more closely, but I'm impressed by the clocks on both the CPU and GPU.

I knew that "10 year roadmap" was bullshit in 2013. Called that. Hell, not only could they not stick to 10 years, as pitifully underpowered as the PS4 and Xbox One were, but they couldn't even make it to 5 years before they had to release an upgrade revision with the Pro and X units.

 

[560ti]

Agreed. I don't mind the 30% buffer in terms of FLOP power afforded to the analogue build, since despite pure horsepower the 7850 obviously can't keep up with the PS4 in 2019

Considering PS4 games now a days are a mixture of low/medium 1080p with a 30FPS cap the 7850 might be able to keep up with it to be honest or at least be competitve. My parents PC is still rocking a RX460 which is probably 10% faster than a 7850 and there playing even modern titles on mostly medium settings 1080p

Old equivalent hardware can probably keep up it's just 95% of PC users will upgrade the moment they can't get a consistent 60FPS or the moment they have to start dropping settings down to medium.

This happened to me last generation as well. The first 4-5 years of last gen I had a third party 8600GT which wasn't much faster than the Xbox 360s GPU and I was able to keep up even with optimization/game engines being a complete mess that gen

 

[jefferz]

Considering PS4 games now a days are a mixture of low/medium 1080p with a 30FPS cap the 7850 might be able to keep up with it to be honest or at least be competitve. My parents PC is still rocking a RX460 which is probably 10% faster than a 7850 and there playing even modern titles on mostly medium settings 1080p

Old equivalent hardware can probably keep up it's just 95% of PC users will upgrade the moment they can't get a consistent 60FPS or the moment they have to start dropping settings down to medium.

This happened to me last generation as well. The first 4-5 years of last gen I had a third party 8600GT which wasn't much faster than the Xbox 360s GPU and I was able to keep up even with optimization/game engines being a complete mess that gen

Older hardware consumes more power so they run hotter. Usually it’s not an issue, but in a small form factor like consoles it’s a huge deal.