Prime Mike Tyson vs Prime Muhammed Ali

[Buddy Revell]

Evrytime this comes up the first two things that come to mind are:

Nobody ever beat Tyson off the back foot.

Nobody beat him off the ropes either.

So It’s hard to see how 85-89 Tyson loses to any version of Ali

Not saying Mike was historically better. Just saying that he was all wrong for Ali

 

[defjaam]

Evrytime this comes up the first two things that come to mind are:

Nobody ever beat Tyson off the back foot.

Nobody beat him off the ropes either.

So It’s hard to see how 85-89 Tyson loses to any version of Ali

Not saying Mike was historically better. Just saying that he was all wrong for Ali

James Tillis was handling him well off the back foot... So did an older & rusty Larry Holmes... Buster Douglas defeated him with a jab, right hand and movement.

 

[revoltub]

I go back and forth on this one. But lately I'm favoring tyson.

People are going to bring up the Mathis and Patterson fights, but I think Cus trained tyson as a response to the Ali clones that were around. The peekaboo style tyson had was much more explosive and much more effective than the one floyd and buster sr had imo.

The left hook thing people keep bringing up is obvious too. Ali let himself eat plenty of left hooks by frazier. Now is Tyson's left hook better than fraziers? Its close, but tyson had other weapons he could also use.

I think people WANT Ali to win this one

 

[Woldog]

Only things Tyson is lacking for this fight is height, reach and a winning record against quality opponents. But Tyson was a new beast against old school opponents, you saw it with Trevor Berbick.

 

[defjaam]

I go back and forth on this one. But lately I'm favoring tyson.

People are going to bring up the Mathis and Patterson fights, but I think Cus trained tyson as a response to the Ali clones that were around. The peekaboo style tyson had was much more explosive and much more effective than the one floyd and buster sr had imo.

The left hook thing people keep bringing up is obvious too. Ali let himself eat plenty of left hooks by frazier. Now is Tyson's left hook better than fraziers? Its close, but tyson had other weapons he could also use.

I think people WANT Ali to win this one

Cus probably taught him the way he taught everyone... Mike just had different physical attributes.

 

[Wayne Adderson]

Who would win in this hypothetical match-up?

Anthony Joshua thinks Tyson would have won.
"Anthony Joshua, one of the current heavyweight champions, had previously told JD Sports he believed Ali would struggle against the heavyweights of today.

“With Lennox Lewis, you know how they started getting bigger, hence why in the amateurs they then created a super-heavyweight division,” Joshua said. “The current heavyweight division in the amateurs is what we class as the cruiserweight division. So Muhammad Ali wouldn’t have been a fully-fledged heavyweight."

“So let’s say we bulked Muhammad Ali up and put size and strength to him, I truly believe Mike Tyson would’ve won. The reason being when you watch the fight with Joe Frazier and Muhammad Ali, you see a certain Tyson-esque to Frazier’s style. Tyson used to study that Joe Frazier. The moving, the hooks. He managed to put Ali down in the fight, it was a very tough fight for Ali. And I just believe Mike Tyson was better schooled, times have evolved, Mike Tyson was more developed. More science, more information.”

But Mike Tyson himself is not so sure.

“I know it’s a fantasy game,” Tyson said. “Most likely I would win the fantasy, but I wouldn't win the real fight. Ali’s the greatest there’s ever been.”

"Tyson was the youngest heavyweight champion of all-time at 20 years old. But throughout his life, Tyson had admired Ali and always showed respect toward one of the greatest fighters in the sport."

“He'll fight you to the end. He's really game, like a pitbull or a f--king rooster,” Tyson said of Ali in a 2016 interview with GQ Magazine. “But he looked like a model in his prime! He looked more like a model than a fighter. He was just a dead-game guy. He was dead game. He had too much pride. He refused to lose.”

Who do you think would win?

Mike Tyson admits he would not have lasted against Muhammad Ali in dream fight

Tyson providing he gets him out before the fifth

 

[Streeter]

If Ali could take the Foreman bombs n still win he can beat Tyson.. better question is Prime Foreman vs Tyson

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

If Tyson gets getting frustrated during the fight he's going to lose. Prime Ali which I think he was Cassius Clay seemed unstoppable. I think he would have been to quick to be hit and that would have frustrated Tyson, plus the adding trash talking would got to Tyson head. Ali/Cassius Clay FTW.

 

[Buddy Revell]

James Tillis was handling him well off the back foot... So did an older & rusty Larry Holmes... Buster Douglas defeated him with a jab, right hand and movement.

Tillis gave Mike a good scrap and did well to make the final bell but he never hurt Mike. Was never a threat or even close to winning. Not a winning strategy. Same for Holmes.

What these guys and everyone who thought Spinks had a Chance didn’t know at the time was that Tyson had a great beard to go along with his great balance and defense... which is to say that it was going to take a sustained beating/mugging in order to beat him. Like the ones delt by Douglas, Evan Fields, Lennox

 

[defjaam]

Tillis gave Mike a good scrap and did well to make the final bell but he never hurt Mike. Was never a threat or even close to winning. Not a winning strategy. Same for Holmes.

What these guys and everyone who thought Spinks had a Chance didn’t know at the time was that Tyson had a great beard to go along with his great balance and defense... which is to say that it was going to take a sustained beating/mugging in order to beat him. Like the ones delt by Douglas, Evan Fields, Lennox

Well, Tyson disagrees with you. He says Tillis and Holmes gave him tough fights.
My point was that Ali was better than Tillis, and certainly better than a rusty Holmes in his late 30s.

Both men had things that would be tricky for the other, but Tyson wasn't that dangerous after the first 6 rounds, and Ali sure isnt getting knocked out early on. IMO Tyson takes the L here... 1978 Larry Holmes would beat him too.

I agree with @Streeter that George Foreman is the most interesting opponent for Tyson from that era.

 

[Buddy Revell]

Well, Tyson disagrees with you. He says Tillis and Holmes gave him tough fights.
My point was that Ali was better than Tillis, and certainly better than a rusty Holmes in his late 30s.

Both men had things that would be tricky for the other, but Tyson wasn't that dangerous after the first 6 rounds, and Ali sure isnt getting knocked out early on. IMO Tyson takes the L here... 1978 Larry Holmes would beat him too.

I agree with @Streeter that George Foreman is the most interesting opponent for Tyson from that era.

Good job of not explaining exactly how you think Ali would have won the fight, beyond just playing keepaway against a guy who it was impossible to run away from.

Here. I’ll do the job for you. How does Ali beat Tyson?

1. He gets the fight in an open air venue, somewhere deep in the heart of Africa or South East Asia. Somewhere really hot and humid so that you can use the elements against the more muscular, aggressive, and less economical fighter and then hope to stop him late. That’s it. That’s Ali’s only chance to actually beat Tyson, cause he’s sure as hell not Phantom punching or bullying Tyson.

Edit: and what Tyson thinks is of no importance. He was and is extremely reverential of all the past greats. Don’t think I’ve ever come across one instance of him putting himself above the greats of the past.

 

[ssx]

People either underestimate or overestimate both guys. Ali wasn’t this unhittable magician that people like to fantasize about, he also had plenty of trouble against guys who did the exact things Tyson did, except Tyson did them better.
Tyson didn’t blow every human out of the water, and he did have a tendency to allow himself to be tied up.
Both guys could win this fight, and at their respective absolute peaks I’d say it’s 50/50 in a 12 round fight. I’d give Ali a 70/30 edge in a 15 rounder.
Let’s not pretend that the Henry Cooper, Doug Jones, Frazier and Norton fights never happened. Same with the Tillis, Bonecrusher and Douglas fights.

 

[Seano]

If they fought 10 times, Ali likely would have won the majority of the fights.

Thats said, Ali was far from untouchable. He really took a tremendous beating in a lot of fights and was a sucker for the left hook, which is one of Tysons best shots. I think if Henry Cooper could put Ali on queer street, Tyson could have put him out. I think the rope a dope would have been a disaster against Tyson with those explosive uppercuts.
Tyson shared some similarities with a few guys Ali fought, Liston, Patterson and Frazier especially, (IMO) but none of those guys had his speed or explosiveness.
Ali is the favorite and rightly so but Tyson would have a good shot.

 

[BoxingMMA]

Nonsense.

I wish all arguments that clearly would go without end simply ended like that. Nice

 

[Eisenhans]

Both are MASSIVELY overrated, but Ali probably takes it.

Tyson couldn't hit like Foreman and Ali ate those shots no problem - with the known consequences. Ofc, the nasty rumors about Big George being drugged are ignored in my short but genius assessment.

 

[aries]

Ali would have fucked up Tyson mentally before they even stepped foot in the ring. Tyson was a mental midget and Ali was king of the psychological war. Tyson would have been broken even before the first bell.

 

[defjaam]

Good job of not explaining exactly how you think Ali would have won the fight, beyond just playing keepaway against a guy who it was impossible to run away from.

Here. I’ll do the job for you. How does Ali beat Tyson?

1. He gets the fight in an open air venue, somewhere deep in the heart of Africa or South East Asia. Somewhere really hot and humid so that you can use the elements against the more muscular, aggressive, and less economical fighter and then hope to stop him late. That’s it. That’s Ali’s only chance to actually beat Tyson, cause he’s sure as hell not Phantom punching or bullying Tyson.

Edit: and what Tyson thinks is of no importance. He was and is extremely reverential of all the past greats. Don’t think I’ve ever come across one instance of him putting himself above the greats of the past.

Lol, ok.

 

[defjaam]

Ali would have fucked up Tyson mentally before they even stepped foot in the ring. Tyson was a mental midget and Ali was king of the psychological war. Tyson would have been broken even before the first bell.

There's really no evidence or example of someone getting in Mike's head and this having an effect on his performance. This is just boxing folklore that people trace back to Ali having success with it again certain opponents and Tyson biting Holyfield, which had more to do with him being mentally damaged from prison, combined with Holyfields head butting. You're a mental midget, not him.

 

[djacobox372]

Tyson is a bad matchup for Ali, it would be close.

Tyson edges a 12 rounder and Ali takes it in 15.

 

[Heath Robinson]

doesn't that argument kinda fall apart when you consider that Ali was not in his prime post exile? which includes Frazier 1?

Dundee always maintained that post exile Ali wasn't the same fighter. I suspect Ali's absolute prime would likely have occurred during that 43 months of downtime.