"only a white belt"

It's been so long ago that i was a white belt, that I cant remember how long i had it. What i do remember is the cool feeling I get whenever I smell a new gi, that pure cotton smell takes me back to when I first put on a gi, how awkward i felt in that huge boxy thing right out of the back and yet excited as i was doing something completely new.
Starting Judo when I was in 5th grade has been the gift my Father gave me that I am the most thankful for. Here I am over 30 years later and the smell of a pure cotton gi still gives me that cool feeling I first had. I wouldn't be so concerned with what others say. People will always talk, its whether you choose to listen or not that really matters. At the end of the day you only have yourself to answer to. After 2 years of training I would think you must have a very good foundation to start building on. Where will you be 2 years from now its hard to say but as long as your on a mat somewhere you will be fine.
Cheers'
 
He, i smashed a traditional ju-jitsu black belt after around 6 months of gi training. He felt silly.
 
Can we please make a different thread about Gi vs No-Gi? And keep all the hilarious stories about other people's ignorance in this one :)
 
I just have one point to make...I won't say one is better than the other (gi vs. no-gi)

But is it fair to say that when taking someone who trains gi all of the time vs. someone who trains no gi all of the time and putting them into the other guy's world...

That it would be a harder transition for the no-gi guy to wear a gi and be successful against other gi guys?
 
Oh yeah that has definitely happened to me. I've been training for about 8 months now and I'm a 2 stripe (almost 3) Gracie Jiu-Jitsu white belt and I was sparring with a karate black belt who has been doing karate for 6 years and I absolutely destroyed him. It was funny when he asked if I was a black belt or what, and I was like, no I'm just a lowly white belt.
 
I had a kid come in and said he was a brown belt in Japanese JJ and I tapped him about 4 times in 5 minutes and he asked what belt I was and I told him a white belt. I think he quit.

LOL
 
I think it's really good that it is so hard to get a new belt in bjj.
Keeps all the posers away and makes the belts really mean something.
 
I think that guys with experience in gi's will probably rough you up pretty good until you figure out where to grab and not to grab. There are alot of nasty wrist locks and chokes that the gi opens up.

Yep, I had trained the past year (no prior BJJ), no GI and felt like I was progressing. The first time I went to the GI class, it was a whole different ball game. I was getting grabbed like crazy, where the movements I was used too from No Gi were less restricted. It is definately a different feel.
 
I just have one point to make...I won't say one is better than the other (gi vs. no-gi)

But is it fair to say that when taking someone who trains gi all of the time vs. someone who trains no gi all of the time and putting them into the other guy's world...

That it would be a harder transition for the no-gi guy to wear a gi and be successful against other gi guys?

I went from training exclusively with the gi for a few years to training almost exclusively without it, and I can tell you both from my own personal experience and from witnessing many others make the same transition that that is not the case. Either way there's going to be a steep learning curve.

A purely no-gi grappler trying to adjust to the gi game will face a number of problems. While his repertoire of techniques will be intact (since every no-gi technique is theoretically possible with the gi), some of them will be less effective than usual as there will be gi techniques that can counter them. Most of those problems will be when he is in his opponent's guard; maintaining posture, defending armbar/choke/sweep attempts, and passing the guard are all more difficult when the guy on his back can use gi grips. Then there is the whole issue of collar chokes - something he has absolutely no prior exposure to, and therefore will have a tough time defending.

Despite all those difficulties, however, the no-gi grappler does have a number of advantages that will make his transition to the gi easier. While he will have to add a lot to his game, there really isn't much he will have to subtract from it. His offensive game, both from the top and from the guard, will be solid because the absence of gi grips will have forced him to develop tight body control. For the same reason, he will have developed excellent hip movement to aid pass defense and sweeps. And while he will bring a relatively smaller number of techniques to the table, he will be very well versed with those techniques. Basically, he will have a solid foundation on which to build his gi game.

The purely gi grappler moving to no-gi faces the opposite challenge - a lot of what he knows doesn't work anymore. All collar chokes and a large number of sweeps are immediately thrown out the window as there is simply no way to perform them without the gi. Many other techniques are either flat out ineffective or require extensive modification to perform without clothing to grab onto. Anything that requires controlling your opponent's body - setting up guard passes, breaking down the opponent in your guard, maintaining position, sweeps, submissions - will be more difficult without the gi.

The biggest problem with guys who previously trained entirely in the gi (myself included) is that many of them have developed bad habits by allowing grips to substitute for proper body control/movement. When you have a sleeve to grab onto, you can get away with being a little loose with your legs in an armbar, or a little lax with your hip movement in a sweep. That's not the case in no-gi. As a result, they find themselves having a hard time finishing submission attempts and just controlling their opponent in general, even against people with far less overall grappling experience. Unfortunately, rather than fault themselves for using poor technique, many choose to blame it on strength/speed/slipperiness and talk about how much more technical the gi game supposedly is.

Basically, both gi and no-gi grappling present different challenges and force you to develop different aspects of your game to a higher level. Neither is better or more complete than the other; in fact, a complete grappler would train in both. Gi players would get a lot of benefit from working more without it, as the body control they develop will make them that much more effective when they add the grips back in. No-gi players would also benefit from working more with the gi, since the larger number of sweeps they face will force them to improve their base quicker. Either one stepping into the other's world for the first time is going to find certain areas of his game severely lacking, but if he takes that opportunity to improve himself rather than whine about how his style is so much better, he'll gain by doing so.
 
Oh yeah that has definitely happened to me. I've been training for about 8 months now and I'm a 2 stripe (almost 3) Gracie Jiu-Jitsu white belt and I was sparring with a karate black belt who has been doing karate for 6 years and I absolutely destroyed him. It was funny when he asked if I was a black belt or what, and I was like, no I'm just a lowly white belt.

Do you mean you were standup sparring with him or rolling?
 
True Helio story:

Helio came to a school I trained at like 6 years ago. Tons of people who trained other MA's were there for a seminar. It was mainly Judo guys and BJJ or TJJ guys though and they know what's up when it comes to the Gracies and BJJ ranking for the most part.

There were these two guys there though from some other MA (not sure if he was a Ninja or something similar) bother wearing Black BJJ gi's and black belts. They were looking around at everyones belts in the locker room and you could tell they were feeling good about themselves.

Someone referred to Master Mansur and Master Helio and when they left the room the one Ninja says to the other "When they said Master I thought they were talking to me." lol

Later on Helio was demonstrating a key lock from side control defense and pulled one of the guys out to help demonstrate it was Ryron.

He told the Ninja to put Ryron in a tight (through a translator) side mobilization and the guy just sat there clueless. Then said he didn't understand, got up and said he was sorry but couldn't help. His face was bright red.

Everyone at the seminar (like 60+ ppl) had a good laugh. I'm sure the Ninja was embarrassed.

Later when it was time the roll the two of them just left.
 
I've been training 2 years or so and still a white and went to this new school when I just recently moved and They were teaching combat wrestling or something like that. they had different color shirts to distinguish the veterans from the beginners. I guess that was their belt system.

Make a long story short, I dominated. They asked what I trained in and when I told them I was a white in BJJ they stared at me like I was sandbagging them.
 
i sit there and take the time to explain it to people because i guess it still irks me when they're like "oh you've been doing it for years and youre not a black belt, are you like slower than other students or something?"

if someones going to take all the hard work, blood, sweat, time, energy, sacrifice that you pour into the mat and compare it to some pansy ass 15 yr old at the strip mall who did a couple forms and ran up and down a room for a yr pretty much taking dance lessons, then yeah take 3-5 minutes to set them straight.

uuuuhhh im 15.. and i agree with mostly everything but not all young kids are like that ive been doing bjj sense i was 8 and only got to my 2nd belt but i could care less im putting so much work into the stuff i do i could care less about the belt
 
I think it's the emphasis that differs in each martial art. In BJJ, you get your blue belt when you have the basics down. On the other hand, in Judo, you get a black when you have the basics down.

Many arts - judo, taekwondo, some forms of karate - have the philosophy that once you attain the black belt, your training really begins. In BJJ, you're considered a master when you get your black belt.

in our karate branch your considered a master at 4th degree bb
 
Oh yeah that has definitely happened to me. I've been training for about 8 months now and I'm a 2 stripe (almost 3) Gracie Jiu-Jitsu white belt and I was sparring with a karate black belt who has been doing karate for 6 years and I absolutely destroyed him. It was funny when he asked if I was a black belt or what, and I was like, no I'm just a lowly white belt.

Im just curious what you mean by destroyed
cuz if you were just doing ju-jitsu then isnt that kind of the point. Now if you destroyed him striking then Ill actually give you props but if you just destroyed him grappling then......sorry Im not to impressed
 
I went from training exclusively with the gi for a few years to training almost exclusively without it, and I can tell you both from my own personal experience and from witnessing many others make the same transition that that is not the case. Either way there's going to be a steep learning curve.

A purely no-gi grappler trying to adjust to the gi game will face a number of problems. While his repertoire of techniques will be intact (since every no-gi technique is theoretically possible with the gi), some of them will be less effective than usual as there will be gi techniques that can counter them. Most of those problems will be when he is in his opponent's guard; maintaining posture, defending armbar/choke/sweep attempts, and passing the guard are all more difficult when the guy on his back can use gi grips. Then there is the whole issue of collar chokes - something he has absolutely no prior exposure to, and therefore will have a tough time defending.

Despite all those difficulties, however, the no-gi grappler does have a number of advantages that will make his transition to the gi easier. While he will have to add a lot to his game, there really isn't much he will have to subtract from it. His offensive game, both from the top and from the guard, will be solid because the absence of gi grips will have forced him to develop tight body control. For the same reason, he will have developed excellent hip movement to aid pass defense and sweeps. And while he will bring a relatively smaller number of techniques to the table, he will be very well versed with those techniques. Basically, he will have a solid foundation on which to build his gi game.

The purely gi grappler moving to no-gi faces the opposite challenge - a lot of what he knows doesn't work anymore. All collar chokes and a large number of sweeps are immediately thrown out the window as there is simply no way to perform them without the gi. Many other techniques are either flat out ineffective or require extensive modification to perform without clothing to grab onto. Anything that requires controlling your opponent's body - setting up guard passes, breaking down the opponent in your guard, maintaining position, sweeps, submissions - will be more difficult without the gi.

The biggest problem with guys who previously trained entirely in the gi (myself included) is that many of them have developed bad habits by allowing grips to substitute for proper body control/movement. When you have a sleeve to grab onto, you can get away with being a little loose with your legs in an armbar, or a little lax with your hip movement in a sweep. That's not the case in no-gi. As a result, they find themselves having a hard time finishing submission attempts and just controlling their opponent in general, even against people with far less overall grappling experience. Unfortunately, rather than fault themselves for using poor technique, many choose to blame it on strength/speed/slipperiness and talk about how much more technical the gi game supposedly is.

Basically, both gi and no-gi grappling present different challenges and force you to develop different aspects of your game to a higher level. Neither is better or more complete than the other; in fact, a complete grappler would train in both. Gi players would get a lot of benefit from working more without it, as the body control they develop will make them that much more effective when they add the grips back in. No-gi players would also benefit from working more with the gi, since the larger number of sweeps they face will force them to improve their base quicker. Either one stepping into the other's world for the first time is going to find certain areas of his game severely lacking, but if he takes that opportunity to improve himself rather than whine about how his style is so much better, he'll gain by doing so.

Great post. I agree 100%.
 
Im just curious what you mean by destroyed
cuz if you were just doing ju-jitsu then isnt that kind of the point. Now if you destroyed him striking then Ill actually give you props but if you just destroyed him grappling then......sorry Im not to impressed

choked out or to the point of tapping is destroyed, a tap is a signal that hey you could have killed me there ffs

other joint submissions pretty much equals a severe handicapp if you were to continue fighting
 
Great post. I agree 100%.


this was a seriously great post. i agree a 100% i have also made this transition from no-gi to gi and its been nice to not have to subtract things. but your right i have had to add a lot of things having to do with handles on the gi and how different it is to have them.
 
how bout we leave the GI vs No-Gi Debate out of this thread?

followed by 8 pages of
better
worse
better
worse
cumbaya
better
worse
that's spelled KUMBAYA
better
worse

= Epic FAIL


I'm amazed we haven't invoked Godwin's law yet.
 
If you're training BJJ for the "badass" reputation with normal folks then you're likely to never advance past white belt (wrong reasons for training) and may continue to get laughed at by the non-training public.

If you're training BJJ for the right reasons: personal satisfaction, fitness, appreciation of the art, etc... then you wont care what non-BJJ people think of your belt rank.
 
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