Social Obama: I worry progressives may undercut Democratic allies

[Jack V Savage]

If villainizing an outside threat is how you are defining intersectional politics you'll have to show me what group Obama villainized to get elected in 2008. I don't remember that being remotely close to key part of his platform. Who did he villainize to get elected?

Obama was guilty of being elected while black, which makes him a "intersectional Cultural Marxist" according to idiots like Viva.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Obama was guilty of being elected while black, which makes him a "intersectional Cultural Marxist" according to idiots like Viva.

Again, this constant need to tell me what I said, instead of telling me what I said that you disagree with, and why.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Stop trying to tell me what my argument is.

My words mean exactly what they say.

So let's break this down step by step, if you really want to understand.

Do you disagree with the statement that Obama was credited in 2008 with building a new coalition, and that this new coalition was represented by the media as a new kind of demographics politics, and if so why?

Trump is not responsible for the Nazis among his supporters, but anyone who made an incorrect prediction about demographics and voting was told to directly by Obama. It's just logic.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Again, this constant need to tell me what I said, instead of telling me what I said that you disagree with, and why.

I'm telling you that what you said is wrong and only based on your own feelings about America electing a black guy.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Trump is not responsible for the Nazis among his supporters, but anyone who made an incorrect prediction about demographics and voting was told to directly by Obama. It's just logic.

That isn't what I said.

I love how you are so defensive about this, that you read me attributing intent, when no where did I do so.

The only intent I would ascribe, is the intent to craft a media narrative on how Obama won in 08, that went beyond Bush sucked giant elephant cock.

 

[VivaRevolution]

I'm telling you that what you said is wrong and only based on your own feelings about America electing a black guy.

No, you are telling me the fictitious argument you made up, is wrong.

 

[nac386]

Stop trying to tell me what my argument is.

My words mean exactly what they say.

So let's break this down step by step, if you really want to understand.

Do you disagree with the statement that Obama was credited in 2008 with building a new coalition, and that this new coalition was represented by the media as a new kind of demographics politics, and if so why?

Let's look at what you really said, and start with the first part. Bolded:

Funny, because Obama was the pioneer of this demographics theory, that led to the intersectionality, and is creating the circular firing squad.

Taking demographics into account when running for political office is not something Obama pioneered, it is something that politicians have done for a few hundred years in this country. The idea that Obama pioneered this idea is laughable.

You are backtracking now, reworking your stances as best you can, but it'd be a whole lot more honest to just say you made a really shitty post and that you take it back and would like to start fresh.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Let's look at what you really said, and start with the first part. Bolded:


Taking demographics into account when running for political office is not something Obama pioneered, it is something that politicians have done for a few hundred years in this country. The idea that Obama pioneered this idea is laughable.

You are backtracking now, reworking your stances as best you can, but it'd be a whole lot more honest to just say you made a really shitty post and that you take it back and would like to start fresh.

Dude, this is some revisionist history shit, trying to pretend that the whole DNC didn't believe after 08 that the Dems would never lose an election again, because demographics.

People are still arguing this, after losing over a 1000 seats in government since this theory became mainstream.

This is what kills me about you.

You don't want me to concede that what I meant was demographics deciding elections became this mainstream political theory, you want to play gotcha non-sense about how what I really meant was demographics were invented in 08 by Obama himself.

 

[nac386]

Dude, this is some revisionist history shit, trying to pretend that the whole DNC didn't believe after 08 that the Dems would never lose an election again, because demographics.

People are still arguing this, after losing over a 1000 seats in government since this theory became mainstream.

This is what kills me about you.

You don't want me to concede that what I meant was demographics deciding elections became this mainstream political theory, you want to play gotcha non-sense about how what I really meant was demographics were invented in 08 by Obama himself.

I'm quoting you. I'm not misinterpreting what you said, I'm quoting what you said. If you did not mean what you said, or if you misstated your own opinion, then take it back and say you did not actually mean it.

I just looked back, and it appears you actually edited your initial quote. I'm guessing you jumped the gun, and regretted how you phrased it. That's fine, just say that. But don't pretend that people reading your posts can read your mind when you make them.

Obama gets blamed for the silliest things, and he's commonly mischaracterized blatant ways. He happened to be President during the decade that memes hit peak popularity, and it seems to have melted the brains of a significant portion of the population.

 

[Lord Commander Palis]

This post is a good illustration of what's wrong with the WR.

1. Obama's point is fine but hardly new (not something that will "fall on deaf ears on the left" or something that "Conservatives about been touting" over the past couple of years. This is 40 years old, and leftists have joked/complained about this for longer than that:



Will Rogers in 1935: "I am not a member of any organized party — I am a Democrat."

2. There are three claims made in the last sentence, and none of them are supported. If we check the evidence, we see that the most recent elections were the best elections for Democrats in a long time, which seems to prove the last of the claims false. The first one seems ridiculous to anyone paying attention. The second is probably true.

When progressives turn on Obama due to their loony fundamentalism, LOL!

Obama was never considered stupid, even by his biggest detractors.

Nobody ever said Obama was stupid. False.

Cold? Fake? Calculating? Intelligent? Overrated? Yup.

Stupid, no way.

 

[VivaRevolution]

I'm quoting you. I'm not misinterpreting what you said, I'm quoting what you said. If you did not mean what you said, or if you misstated your own opinion, then take it back and say you did not actually mean it.

I just looked back, and it appears you actually edited your initial quote. I'm guessing you jumped the gun, and regretted how you phrased it. That's fine, just say that. But don't pretend that people reading your posts can read your mind when you make them.

Obama gets blamed for the silliest things, and he's commonly mischaracterized blatant ways. He happened to be President during the decade that memes hit peak popularity, and it seems to have melted the brains of a significant portion of the population.

Jesus dude. I edited spelling.

How dishonest are you?

 

[nac386]

Jesus dude. I edited spelling.

How dishonest are you?

No, you edited the post to change the meaning. You said Obama did something, and then said Obama's "political team" did something. Here is the original that I quoted:

Funny, because Obama was the pioneer of this demographics theory, that led to the intersectionality, and is creating the circular firing squad.

Here is the edit:

Funny, because the Obama political team was the pioneer of this demographics theory, that led to the intersectionality, and is creating the circular firing squad.

Like I said, it appears that you realized it was nonsensical after you made it, and went back to edit it. That's fine, just admit that. Sometimes you misstate your own opinion and have to change it to better represent yourself. Of course, the edited version is still silly since the "Obama team" also did not pioneer demographics or intersectionality.

 

[Renard]

What's "the movement" exactly? Divide and judge people based on their race and gender? Give free citizenship to everyone who crossed the border illegally? Reparations for black people? Free hormones for all "non gender conforming" children?
The only moment the left doesn't sound absolutely retarded is when they discuss economic policies, but even then they can't help but shoehorn "privilege", oppression and race into otherwise neutral discussions about policy meant to address poverty and socio-economic mobility for the entire society. They can't stop themselves from poisoning everything they touch.

Who's surprised such a "movement" has infighting? That's baked in the cake.

 

[VivaRevolution]

No, you edited the post to change the meaning. You said Obama did something, and then said Obama's "political team" did something. Here is the original that I quoted:



Here is the edit:

Yep, and the edit was in place before you responded. Check the time stamp.

 

[Jack V Savage]

What's "the movement" exactly?

The essence of liberalism is gov't based on reason. Equal rights, freedom of speech, and the whole liberal program flows from that. Obviously there will be more infighting with people who support than there will be with people who believe in a natural hierarchy that should be respected.

 

[Madmick]

"One of the things I do worry about sometimes among progressives in the United States —maybe it’s true here as well — is a certain kind of rigidity where we say, 'Uh, I’m sorry, this is how it’s going to be,' and then we start sometimes creating what’s called a 'circular firing squad,' where you start shooting at your allies because one of them has strayed from purity on the issues. And when that happens, typically the overall effort and movement weakens," he said.

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/4...progressives-may-form-a-circular-firing-squad

Obama makes a great point here, but I still think this will fall on deaf ears on the left. Conservatives have been touting on how the left have been eating themselves over the past couple of years and it seems like Obama is even starting to take notice.

While the majority of Republicans are moving left there are a lot of Democrats that are moving further to the left, which is causing a lot of former left leaning voters to vote Republican.

One of the best films of the last 20 years.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yep, and the edit was in place before you responded. Check the time stamp.

Obama treaded extremely carefully on racial issues and constantly promoted unity and outright attacked campus radicals on multiple occasions, but some people still see him as being one of them for no reason other than his skin color. It's sad.

 

[franklinstower]

"One of the things I do worry about sometimes among progressives in the United States —maybe it’s true here as well — is a certain kind of rigidity where we say, 'Uh, I’m sorry, this is how it’s going to be,' and then we start sometimes creating what’s called a 'circular firing squad,' where you start shooting at your allies because one of them has strayed from purity on the issues. And when that happens, typically the overall effort and movement weakens," he said.

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/4...progressives-may-form-a-circular-firing-squad

Obama makes a great point here, but I still think this will fall on deaf ears on the left. Conservatives have been touting on how the left have been eating themselves over the past couple of years and it seems like Obama is even starting to take notice.

While the majority of Republicans are moving left there are a lot of Democrats that are moving further to the left, which is causing a lot of former left leaning voters to vote Republican.

Here is why the democratic party and Obama is wrong. Progressive issues like these

Money out of politics
Universal Health Care
15 dollar minimum wage
Etc etc

These issues (when polled in a non manipulative way) enjoy 70 or higher support among the american people. The Dem leadership don't want these though. Why is that? Because of Money in politics, and because they themselves ARE the super wealthy and their friends are...... so they lie to us about needing to move the ball up the field a few yards and lie about not wanting to alienate the majority of moderates.

The DNC and the Obama and Clinton Democrats are corrupted liars. Noam Chomsky said that if you were fooled by Obama its only because you did not look at his record.....

The corporate Democrats do need to join the Democratic party--- which is a progressive party. Everything else is manipulative framing to protect the wealthy and enable them to continue milking and killing the middle class.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Obama treaded extremely careful on racial issues and constantly promoted unity and outright attacked campus radicals on multiple occasions, but some people still see him as being one of them for no reason other than his skin color. It's sad.

I agree.

In fact, I think Obama was so aware of how he would be viewed as the first black president that it led to him being very conservative in his goals.

The creep to intersectionalism was happenstance, not planned.

It was really a case study in how corporatism, and short term return thinking, is a failed ideology.

These people with their metrics, and to quote Jamie Dimon, no 'granular' understanding, will be the down fall of this nation.

My point was simply that the demographics argument led to the intersectional playbook.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I agree.

In fact, I think Obama was so aware of how he would be viewed as the first black president that it led to him being very conservative in his goals.

The creep to intersectionalism was happenstance, not planned.

It was really a case study in how corporatism, and short term return thinking, is a failed ideology.

These people with their metrics, and to quote Jamie Dimon, no 'granular' understanding, will be the down fall of this nation.

My point was simply that the demographics argument led to the intersectional playbook.

But it didn't really. What you're talking about isn't a thing that happened; it's just how the GOP decided to market Obama.