Musk , Mars and becoming an interplanetary species

[BearGrounds]

That's how exploration works.
You do it and learn about the benefits later as you've laid the foundation.
Staying in one place isn't going to pay off in the long run and the human race is in it for the long run.

I don't think we should stay in one place. I just think we should get things sorted out properly at home first, then move on. When laying a foundation you must ensure it is strong and can properly support what is built upon it, or all is inevitably doomed to collapse.

 

[JDragon]

I don't think we should stay in one place. I just think we should get things sorted out properly at home first, then move on. When laying a foundation you must ensure it is strong and can properly support what is built upon it, or all is inevitably doomed to collapse.

Things are probably better now on Earth than they ever were by all measures of Human Development. That does not mean things won't go downhill, but precisely because of that we should push space exploration.

Personally I am not sure the colonization of Mars is the answer to everything, as I don't believe we can fuck up Earth to the extent that Mars is a better place for humans to live. But just trying to get humans there will drive science and technology to the next level.

Humanity's future may be in space in the far future. But we need to make the next step.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

I don't think we should stay in one place. I just think we should get things sorted out properly at home first, then move on. When laying a foundation you must ensure it is strong and can properly support what is built upon it, or all is inevitably doomed to collapse.

We have the technology, the expertise and highly trained people who want to go, who are lining up.
We can do both.
I'm a big fan of the "why not both?" meme.

 

[Long Dark Blues]

Terraforming Mars is most likely impossible.

We would need to pump that planet's too thin atmosphere with so many greenhouse gasses and VOCs to increase the density that it would take noting short of bombarding it with asteroids for quite a few millennia, if not a million+ years, to achieve it.

We wouldn't even be able to set foot on it.

Mars has no magnetosphere, so any atmosphere we could create would just be lost to space. And there'd be no protection from solar radiation.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Terraforming Mars is most likely impossible.

We would need to pump that planet's too thin atmosphere with so many greenhouse gasses and VOCs to increase the density that it would take noting short of bombarding it with asteroids for quite a few millennia, if not a million+ years, to achieve it.

We wouldn't even be able to set foot on it.

Mars has no magnetosphere, so any atmosphere we could create would just be lost to space. And there'd be no protection from solar radiation.

Bubble domes. No need to try, as you point out correctly, the impossible.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Hes awesome. Seems half crazy too.

Can mars sustain an atmosphere?

Would mars be worth living underground?

Would the threats of earths extinction apply to mars simultaniously? (supernova or something macro)

Great questions , mars has a weak atmosphere, what it needs is some good ole green house gasses , we know how to produce those lol , job 1 would be to melt the poles .

Under ground is a n option but initially think inflatable enclosures.

Some catastrophes would affect Mars as well but the long term plan is not stop at Mars but use Mars as a new jumping off point.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Terraforming Mars is most likely impossible.

We would need to pump that planet's too thin atmosphere with so many greenhouse gasses and VOCs to increase the density that it would take noting short of bombarding it with asteroids for quite a few millennia, if not a million+ years, to achieve it.

We wouldn't even be able to set foot on it.

Mars has no magnetosphere, so any atmosphere we could create would just be lost to space. And there'd be no protection from solar radiation.

Thats not my understanding, do you have a link ?

Ive read as few has 100 years

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Cart before the horse type thinking, if you ask me. We haven't even learned to live properly on our current planet yet, but we're ready to entertain the notion of colonizing another? Yea, no. Let's get shit figured out here first, then we can talk branching out into space.

I suspect part of the reason Musk is in such a hurry is he wants to set a reset button on society but hes never said that , I'm reading between the lines to glean that

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

I'm following the launches, the landings and the spacex reddit regularly, as well as the Orbital Mechanics podcast, so you could say my interest is above average.

I'd like to note that the Mars 2018 is an umanned expedition, and mostly a proof of concept for SpaceX. They will roll out their havy launcher, the Falcon Heavy late this year, and the FH will launch the test mission for their Red Dragon capsule (based on their currently flying Dragon 1) in 2018, and then simply send it all the way to Mars on it's trial run. Simply put, it might be ambitious to get that going by 2018 - space is hard work, after all - but it's a surprisingly low effort operation, since it simply utilizes their future "off the shelf" equipment. What's still up for debate is what kind of cargo the Red Dragon will have. It will be by far the largest vessel that has landed on Mars, it will land propulsively, which is awesome. And later potential customers can simply buy a new flight using the same standardized craft and architecture.

Note that SpaceX is the only provider of launch vehicles which have open prices on their site, and note that they already have payload capabilities for Mars missions listed: http://www.spacex.com/about/capabilities

Finally, the most exciting cargo for the demo is a small, two stage rocket that will be launched from the Red Dragon and return to Earth with a small payload of samples. Which is awesome.

Their first manned mission is tentatively set for 2024 or 2026 (I think), but we'll know more about that in september when they unveil the architecture of the Mars Colonial Transporter.

Oh, and they're trying to land yet another rocket on wednsday. It has somewhat poor odds, considering the high-energy mission, but I'm still excited.


Never let perfect be the enemy of good. I don't see why living better here and exploring space is seen as diametrically opposed goals. Mankind use more money on makeup than rockets, ffs, but somebody using makeup rarely get told that they should focus on making the world better instead.

Great post , ty

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Hey, we already had one African-born President, why not a second?

Trump/Musk 2016.

Lol Trump Musk sounds like a really bad cologne.

Musk isn't eligible to be President unfortunately.

 

[Fawlty]

It's a damn shame that world governments have not yet collaborated on a moon base, or even an exploration to determine if we can mine materials there, or make the moon a reliable way station for getting on and off Earth. The International Space Station is old news- it should be child's play by now. I would have thought all of that would be in place before Mars missions. That makes the proposal of sending astronauts to Mars unbelievably ballsy. They will probably die. But we need to have faith in technological progress. Musk is definitely the man, he'll be in the history books.

 

[Supereem]

It's a damn shame that world governments have not yet collaborated on a moon base, or even an exploration to determine if we can mine materials there, or make the moon a reliable way station for getting on and off Earth. The International Space Station is old news- it should be child's play by now. I would have thought all of that would be in place before Mars missions. That makes the proposal of sending astronauts to Mars unbelievably ballsy. They will probably die. But we need to have faith in technological progress. Musk is definitely the man, he'll be in the history books.

Id be interested in investing in the transport used to move such raw materials around (if it becomes viable in our lifetime).

 

[Liquid Smoke]

I don't believe anyone has ever been to the moon. So I don't think anyone will go to mars either.

If god wanted us on the moon he'd've miracled us there by now.

 

[JDragon]

I'd pay more taxes for this.

Just thought about this. What would you think about a system where each citizen can decide how a small share of his / her taxes are allocated? Probably warrants its own thread...

 

[JDragon]

Also, I would love it if those keeping up with SpaceX & Co. could give updates in here whenever something happens.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Also, I would love it if those keeping up with SpaceX & Co. could give updates in here whenever something happens.

It seems there is interest so thats the plan , bring some positivity to the WR lol

 

[2DUM2TAP]

I don't believe anyone has ever been to the moon. So I don't think anyone will go to mars either.

Why does that no surprise me...

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I'd pay more taxes for this.

Just thought about this. What would you think about a system where each citizen can decide how a small share of his / her taxes are allocated? Probably warrants its own thread...

Americans do pay taxes towards..capsules. Nasa's Orion project in conjunction with Lockheed has cost around 20 billion. In fact, this new space race has started as a competition for tax dollars.

SpaceX Dragon (1 and 2) has cost around 2.5 billion.... and they actually have the landing capabilities (the supredraco propulsives are an incredible feat of engineering) and a better Thermal shielding as comparative testing through the van allen belt have demonstrated. Ironically, the Dragon project was intended for a cheap way to shuttle to the ISS while the Orion was born out of NASA's Constellation - which was geared towards planetary exploration. SpaceX just has more breakthroughs in the needed tech - ie reusability (10 missions before the need of refurbishment), direct landing and low cost. So they are now gearing towards Mars because their engineering has been solid and they have a happy habit of saying "hey, we already are doing this and doing better than you, so our results should be enough for government contracts"


There are other players in this as well with some recent rumblings that Sierra Nevada and Boeing to combine their CST-100 and DreamChaser projects in a last ditch effort to catch up.

To be fair, the field is wide open as NASA has not yet announced which program they are going to go with for cargo shipping to the ISS.

SpaceX is just taking it a step further by saying "while you try to make your decision -- we are going to go ahead and fund / build and operate an end to end solution and put action to our words.

2018 is a big year in which company wins the private space wars

side note - this space race has trickled down to all areas of the aerospace world. The company i work for and many others have been RFP'ing like crazy for the satellite and robotics contracts. This is a perfect representation of how privatization is cheaper, producing better technology and stimulating an economy.

 

[sub_thug]

Elon Musk is a visionary. This is one guy who has my backing 100%. Brilliant, brilliant man.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I'm following the launches, the landings and the spacex reddit regularly, as well as the Orbital Mechanics podcast, so you could say my interest is above average.

I'd like to note that the Mars 2018 is an umanned expedition, and mostly a proof of concept for SpaceX. They will roll out their havy launcher, the Falcon Heavy late this year, and the FH will launch the test mission for their Red Dragon capsule (based on their currently flying Dragon 1) in 2018, and then simply send it all the way to Mars on it's trial run. Simply put, it might be ambitious to get that going by 2018 - space is hard work, after all - but it's a surprisingly low effort operation, since it simply utilizes their future "off the shelf" equipment. What's still up for debate is what kind of cargo the Red Dragon will have. It will be by far the largest vessel that has landed on Mars, it will land propulsively, which is awesome. And later potential customers can simply buy a new flight using the same standardized craft and architecture.

Note that SpaceX is the only provider of launch vehicles which have open prices on their site, and note that they already have payload capabilities for Mars missions listed: http://www.spacex.com/about/capabilities

Finally, the most exciting cargo for the demo is a small, two stage rocket that will be launched from the Red Dragon and return to Earth with a small payload of samples. Which is awesome.

Their first manned mission is tentatively set for 2024 or 2026 (I think), but we'll know more about that in september when they unveil the architecture of the Mars Colonial Transporter.

Oh, and they're trying to land yet another rocket on wednsday. It has somewhat poor odds, considering the high-energy mission, but I'm still excited.


Never let perfect be the enemy of good. I don't see why living better here and exploring space is seen as diametrically opposed goals. Mankind use more money on makeup than rockets, ffs, but somebody using makeup rarely get told that they should focus on making the world better instead.

No idea how they did it, but they are reporting the F9 to be capable of 5.1 lbf on liftoff and a in flight of 1.9 - it would make it per square inch - the most powerful rocket on the market. Twice as powerful as the Saturn V MLVs

Heres the kicker - they did it without changing 99% of the hardware. They just added a new diffusion process to the Merlin 1D