Social More Tesla model 3s were sold last month than all models of BMW combined.

[MadSquabbles500]

So they sold more cars than a foreign company in a dying segment in America auto's.

Model 3 is a sedan. That segment is dying out? Maybe the Murka Auto makers have abandoned that market because of too much competition from German, and Japan car makers, but if anything I am seeing that segment grow.

More and more people moving to crowded cities, and not have large familes. They dont need the large pickup truck, or the minivan. Okay there is still the compact SUV, but eh whatever. I still see plenty of people driving new model sedans all the time.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

- In the US
- Excluding BMW SUVs

Isn´t passenger cars pretty much a dying segment in the US? GM and Ford seem to be cutting that segment completely in North America to focus on trucks and SUVs.

Maybe out in the country where everyone is like



But in the cities and burbs where more and more of the population is living, I still see people driving, and buying the new sedans coming out of japan and europe.

Well come to think of, I havent seen any new Audis, or VWs in a while. hmmm. But I see plenty of japanese and korean sedans.

 

[Andy Capp]

Model 3 is a sedan. That segment is dying out? Maybe the Murka Auto makers have abandoned that market because of too much competition from German, and Japan car makers, but if anything I am seeing that segment grow.

More and more people moving to crowded cities, and not have large familes. They dont need the large pickup truck, or the minivan. Okay there is still the compact SUV, but eh whatever. I still see plenty of people driving new model sedans all the time.

Exactly. Ford, GM, and Chevrolet have nearly forgotten how to make a good car and they don't seem to care, the market to Japan, SK, and Europe. I guess if you suck (comparatively) and you're good at another thing, it makes sense to concentrate on the thing you're good at, but you won't grow as a company in that case so I think it's short sighted.

 

[bad seed]

But in the cities and burbs where more and more of the population is living, I still see people driving, and buying the new sedans coming out of japan and europe.

Well come to think of, I havent seen any new Audis, or VWs in a while. hmmm. But I see plenty of japanese and korean sedans.

The CR-V is the best selling car in NYC. Followed by several other Japanese CUV's. There is no Japanese or Korean sedan in the top 10. Audi is in last place among German sedan sales but still sell magnitudes more than Genesis. VW has recently had its biggest sales gain all thanks to the new Atlas suv.

 

[bad seed]

Exactly. Ford, GM, and Chevrolet have nearly forgotten how to make a good car and they don't seem to care, the market to Japan, SK, and Europe. I guess if you suck (comparatively) and you're good at another thing, it makes sense to concentrate on the thing you're good at, but you won't grow as a company in that case so I think it's short sighted.

The reason Ford had to cut their sedans isn't because they werent selling- they were doing well as evidenced by the amount of new Fusions on the road- but because of the residuals and resale value value on sedans tanking year after year. Most cars are leased, not sold, and they run very tight margins to eek out profitability. When the residuals dip below a sustainable number they are LOSING money on each car sold/leased. The used sedan market right now is a disaster (for sellers) because NO ONE wants them anymore.

Ford was just the first to take this plunge, but others will follow. Expect all the Germans to drastically cut down sedan offerings while promoting CUV/SUV's too. Sedans are a terrible compromise that does nothing well- a dedicated sports coupe handles better, a CUV is more comfortable/hauls more, etc. Especially in cramped cities, a CUV is much more practical because they tend to be shorter in length and taller in height.

Most new sedans you see on the road were bought with STEEP incentives and discounts. Every automaker is panicking right now because sedanpocalypse is looming.

 

[bad seed]

Model 3 is a sedan. That segment is dying out? Maybe the Murka Auto makers have abandoned that market because of too much competition from German, and Japan car makers, but if anything I am seeing that segment grow.

More and more people moving to crowded cities, and not have large familes. They dont need the large pickup truck, or the minivan. Okay there is still the compact SUV, but eh whatever. I still see plenty of people driving new model sedans all the time.

Model 3 is not even the main volume seller. The Model Y (the upcoming crossover version of the 3) is the real sales juggernaut. It's silly that Tesla even made the model 3 first when it should have just been the Y. It's the antiquated Gen X mindset of Elon who still thinks sedans are the "default" car shape so felt it was appropriate to launch that first. Same reason Genesis launched with THREE different sedans to abysmal numbers. One luxury SUV could outsell all their sedans but their outdated mindset (and Korean focus groups) thought they needed a sedan.

 

[jefferz]

Model 3 is a sedan. That segment is dying out? Maybe the Murka Auto makers have abandoned that market because of too much competition from German, and Japan car makers, but if anything I am seeing that segment grow.

More and more people moving to crowded cities, and not have large familes. They dont need the large pickup truck, or the minivan. Okay there is still the compact SUV, but eh whatever. I still see plenty of people driving new model sedans all the time.

Car sales in America are drastically down.
Pickups and lights SUVs sell at double the rate of cars.

Car sales are on pace to hit a 60-year low, Automotive News reports, thanks to the huge growth coming from the light-truck sector, which includes both pickups and SUVs. 5.3 million cars might sound like a lot, but it would actually be the slowest year for car sales since 1958.
AN points out that the split was pretty much 50/50 five years ago, showing just how hard and fast this trend hit the market. But through May in 2018, light trucks outsold cars by more than double. And it's not just long-time buyers holding strong -- AN pointed out Edmunds data that shows only 52 percent of car buyers in 2018 bought another car. Everyone else went to light trucks.

 

[Joe_Armstrong]

From smoking with Joe Rogan to building spaceships and electric cars.
And he designed Paypal, not bad

 

[MicroBrew]

- In the US
- Excluding BMW SUVs

Isn´t passenger cars pretty much a dying segment in the US? GM and Ford seem to be cutting that segment completely in North America to focus on trucks and SUVs.

Yeah I made a mistake in not specifying it was only BMW cars.

For August 2018. BMW sold 23,789 vehicles ( all BMW branded vehicles, and not just cars)
For the same month they sold 14, 450 passenger cars and 9,339 light trucks

The below article that gives the above figures also mentions that Sport Activity vehicles made up 53.6% of vehicles sold. That is confusing, unless BMW considers Sport Activity Vehicles as passenger cars.

http://www.bmwusanews.com/newsrelease.do?id=3298&mid=

Autoblog states that the car sales figures published by BMW includes the crossovers like the X1 and X2.
There is some discrepancy on just how many Model 3s were sold but all estimates are greater than BMW car sales (14,450 )

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/09/06/tesla-model-3-outsells-entire-bmw-car-lineup/

The American firms, notably Ford, are pulling out of the passenger car segment because they can't compete with the Japanese and Germans. Here in the MidWest , around the Great Lakes, the ratio of cars to trucks/mini-vans/SUVs is about 1:1 . Seeing news footage around the country, there seems to be about as many cars as there are other vehicles.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

Any liberals want to explain precisely what they hate so much about Musk? I must have missed it.

 

[PHATV]

 

[computer fogie]

Any liberals want to explain precisely what they hate so much about Musk? I must have missed it.

Do you see anyone hating Musk in this thread? I must have missed it.

What if it turned out that Musk is actually pretty popular with liberals, more so than conservatives? Would you react by hating Musk?

 

[computer fogie]

He took a Bill Clinton hit, he didn't even inhale.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

 

[Carl Sonnen]

"There's a sucker born every minute." - Kenny Florian

 

[Madmick]

^^^^^And the order cancellations POURING in after people tire of waiting.

Among all the potential problems one might face I can't imagine there is a more desirable one for any businessman alive.

 

[PHATV]

Among all the potential problems one might face I can't imagine there is a more desirable one for any businessman alive.

Delivering product in exchange for money is how a business thrives, not by people walking off to a competitor because you can't serve them due to broken promises.

Or, loads of customers walking away with their money because you can't fulfill their needs is desirable from a business standpoint.

Hmm...

Now you have me thinking. Maybe you're right.

 

[GSP_37]

Is it possible a lot of those recorded sales were rich TSLA stock holders trying to prop up the stock by placing orders then canceling years later knowing they'll never actually be produced and fulfilled?

 

[BEER]

All the discussion in here and I feel like I'm the only person who likes sedans.

 

[Madmick]

Delivering product in exchange for money is how a business thrives, not by people walking off to a competitor because you can't serve them due to broken promises.

Or, loads of customers walking away with their money because you can't fulfill their needs is desirable from a business standpoint.

Hmm...

Now you have me thinking. Maybe you're right.

Precisely. You haven't thought about it.

If you had, you'd realize an overabundance of orders isn't a "problem". The inability to fill the orders is the problem. This only becomes a larger problem if growing to meet that demand means accepting funding that means giving up control. Why? Because if you have that kind of demand, you will have people who want to invest in you. The question is what they want in return.

Elon has made it clear he wants to retain as much control as possible. That is why he hasn't yet courted Apple, hasn't taken US government handouts, and hasn't gone public despite the tweet. It's why he's signing deals with Chinese investors to build new factories.

Elon doesn't have a Tesla business problem, he has a Tesla control problem. He is struggling to keep it, and to survive those who would take it away.