just to remove all doubt about Tony/Werdum dust-up

StonedLemur said:
How many guys you know with a win streak that long in the LW division?...not many.

You might not like him but to say he sucks is monumentally dumb sir.
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Khabib and Charles had winning streaks that long but actually beat to 3’s when To y and Dariush finally fought a top3 their win streaks got exposed as beating up gatekeepers and past primes. Tony had about as much chance against Khabib as he did with Werdun but he never stopped talking smack.
 
old school 2 said:
Khabib and Charles had winning streaks that long but actually beat to 3’s when To y and Dariush finally fought a top3 their win streaks got exposed as beating up gatekeepers and past primes. Tony had about as much chance against Khabib as he did with Werdun but he never stopped talking smack.
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You proved my point sir.
 
Dionysian said:
This is an attempt to post the real video instead of the bullshit edited video (and a larger bullshit narrative) fostered in places like the other thread and among several fans that don't know the larger story.

If you don't want to watch the whole video, I've got a summary here for you:

Start: Werdum is friendly, does a fist bump with Tony

5:00: Karyn starts interviewing Tony. Asks him if he’s taking Kevin Lee seriously. Tony replies that he’s only there because he has to be there (AKA he doesn’t want to talk to her). She replies it isn’t all bad.

5:45: After Tony gives a nonsensical reply to Karyn basically droning on about how he is a badass he then completely randomly states “I could be fighting Werdum for a fucking title, and I’d kick this guy’s ass” while pointing to Werdum who is seated right next to him. Werdum clearly hears him and has a surprised/confused look on his face. But he shows restraint and doesn’t react to this guy talking shit next to him who said to a third party that he'd kick Werdum's ass while Werdum is present.

6:00: Another narcissistic personality disorder rant from Tony about how great he is and how he “doesn’t see any other bitch asses fucking doing the same shit I’m doing.” More talk about how he is an inspiration to everyone online. Says who the fuck are Khabib and Conor. Says other fighters are “fake ass motherfuckers”

7:15: Another interviewer asks him about his fight prep. Tony says he isn’t eating “bourgie-ass food” as Werdum eats next to him and then drones some more about how great and special he is. Werdum, once again, shows restraint and tries to tune this asshole out chatting on the phone to someone / clearly is getting more annoyed the more Tony rants about how he’s the fucking greatest thing since sliced bread non-stop and insults every pro fighter on Earth.

9:00: Karyn lobs yet another softball about how Tony owns himself or whatever fluff talking point will encourage part 54 of the Tony monologue about how special he is. Tony's reply is to somehow transition to talking about how people can kiss his ass. Then calls Nate and Conor “pieces of shit”

10:00: Werdum talks to someone in the background. Tony cuts him off and puts his hand in his face to interrupt Werdum. Werdum finally has had enough bullshit and responds to him, calling him on his bullshit.

10:30: In a classic passive-aggressive move, Tony insults Werdum to bystanders rather than to Werdum. He calls Werdum “fake” to his interviewers while not looking at Werdum. He basically confirms he was insulting Werdum at the 6-minute mark when he labeled other fighters “fake ass motherfuckers.” Werdum proceeds to call him out for being an asshole after enduring 10 minutes of this utter bullshit.

10:45: Clearly having enough, Werdum stands. Tony stands in response and calls Werdum a “punk ass.” In classic passive-aggressive move #2, Tony insults Werdum to his face but then instinctively turns to OTHER people and suggests Werdum is somehow bullying HIM. “Big guy, huh?” thus fueling the BS narrative of the poor wittle LW getting picked on by the big bad HW for no weason boo hoo.

11:00: Once there is a third party between the two of them creating distance he sits down and says “have fun fighting on my undercard” and the ankle pick comment (again... now that they’re separated). Tony effortlessly transitions into part 85 of his narcissistic personality disorder speech, and attributes the dust up to his inherent greatness bothering other fighters, completely unable to perceive the fact that it might have had something to do with him being a prick for 10 minutes straight.

12:00: When the interviewer asks what that was all about, Tony nonsensically suggests Werdum is playing “grabass” with his manager, then plays the “HW trying to pick a fight with a 155er” card for the shit he just instigated and suggests Werdum is mad because he “got his ass knocked out” (Werdum had just lost the HW belt to Stipe around this time)

12:45: Congratulates himself on his supernatural ability to “read people” and credits that to his diagnosis of Werdum as “fake.” Tony pulls down his hood, now relaxing to transition into spewing more negativity/insults now that the big mean HW man that held him accountable has left








See above please guys / watch the unedited video.

Anyway... yeah. Sort of weird this is still necessary and that the fake video (and fake Tony narrative overall) still persists. If anything this is reflective of the fact that the "where's your kid" guy and the "I'll fight Werdum" guy and the "I broke my training partner's rib, it was great!" guy and the restraining order guy may have gotten his head so far up his ass due to the fact that the media and fans, rather than question any of it, lobbed "boy you are so unique and great" softballs/memes throughout the entirety of that process SOLELY because he happened to be on a win streak. Maybe if more Werdums in the world held him accountable for his behavior he wouldn't have gotten the positive reinforcement pushing him to become so unpleasant.

/end of rant and eagerly await all the "fuck you he's amazing" talk
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Thanks for including all the idiots blaming Werdum. Now I know who's opinions are null from now on.
 
similar to conor. where there's smoke there's fire. Tony's antics on TUF, his alleged wife beating, his run ins with the law and with mental health facilities. it's all documented. he's just a weird dude who probably suffers from some mental illness. but that's not too surprising that someone who steps in a cage and fights for a living is a whack job. sure he's got King Kong balls and is talented, but as person, it's pretty obvious he's a whack a doodle
 
Werdum is who all sherdoggers wish they were.

Werdum the typa guy to step up to nonsense mother fuckers who get too big for their britches just cuz lil online bitches hug their nutz
 
How this clown has fans is beyond me.

9eKIz.gif
 
Stone Golem said:
There have been several.




Accusing me of saying "he sucks" (when I never said that) is infinitesimally dumber.

It makes you look like you can't even read,
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I gotta say I mostly agree with your take on this, that Tony has been mostly overhyped and there have been a few LWs with impressive streak and Tony wasn't THAT special - really good,but not amazing. Having said that, he was really good and fantastic watching, he was just never gonna beat Khabib and relied on his chin/toughness in nearly every fight.

However, the real intrigue here, is your having used the phrase "infinitesimally dumber" to describe someone else's reading ability.

Infinitesimal
1. : immeasurably or incalculably small. an infinitesimal difference. 2. : taking on values arbitrarily close to but greater than zero.
 
Rear Naked Toke said:
I think what's lost in translation here is that Tony was a great fighter; UFC wouldn't give him a title shot, regardless of his streak, because they recognize that he's a bit nutty and didn't want the liability of him as champ; Tony misread that as he didn't talk enough shit to get a shot; and Werdum just happened to be sitting next to him that day.

Don't get me wrong, Werdum did talk over him, but directly in response to a question he was asked in portuguese by a reporter, and Tony felt disrespected. The reporter prompted that exchange, and I don't disagree that Werdum should've put the reporter on hold, but I honestly think he would've if Tony wasn't being such a twat.

Werdum stayed silent for a long time while Tony disrespected basically every fighter on the planet; so many other fighters wouldn't have stayed quiet as long as Werdum did.
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Solid take. Totally agree. I find it pretty hard to blame Werdum here. Tony was being an outright prick for the whole session.

Also, I like your thoughts on the overall context for Tony's increasing craziness around this time. I hadn't quite fleshed that out, but you seem to have nailed it. I remember when Tony's craziness was mounting feeling like there was something off about him. The Tony Shtick seemed too AUTHENTICALLY crazy, somehow. It was somehow concerning or something in a way that Chael, or Conor or even Colby's attention-grabbing asshole personalities just weren't.

and meanwhile, during this sense of Tony maybe really actually being crazy, he was putting up super impressive, action-packed wins against the division's best but was never fighting for the title. It didn't add up. I think you've maybe solved the equation: Tony misread the signals from UFC and doubled-down on the seeming instability and craziness.
 
Mr Fahrenheit said:
I just think he had bad timing.

Tony beat Barboza in December 2015 to take his win streak to 7. Khabib was most of the way into his two year hiatus at this point, so it looked like Tony would get to the belt before Khabib.

Unfortunately for Tony, Conor also beat Aldo in December 2015.

We know what happened from there — Conor-RDA was supposed to happen that spring; RDA pulled out; Conor lost to Nate instead; Eddie got the title shot while Conor rematched Nate; and in November, when it might have been Tony vs Eddie for the belt, Conor got the title shot and Tony got RDA. (Khabib returns and beats Horcher and Johnson during this time, then misses another year).

Conor wins the belt, pursues the Floyd fight instead of defending, and Tony fights Lee for the interim title. Should they have stripped Conor and made that fight for the real belt? In hindsight, yes. But at the time I can understand why they didn’t — Conor was their biggest star, they didn’t know he’d be gone THAT long, Khabib was lurking, and Lee didn’t really belong in a title fight.

Regardless, Khabib returns and beats Barboza two months later and now the real title shot to determine the best lightweight is set for the following spring. But then sunglasses, bus, Raging Al steps in, Khabib is champ. Realistically Tony’s window is now closed.

Conor vs Khabib is the fight to make at that point since Conor hadn’t lost the belt, especially since Tony had such a bad injury. He miraculously makes it back to fight on the same card but they were never going to plan for that.

Tony is finally booked for the title again, but Khabib drops out, Justin beats the shit out of Tony, and that’s that.

The only fault you can potentially find with the UFC is (1) not making Tony vs Lee for the full belt (even though it wouldn’t have felt real until he fought Conor or Khabib anyway), (2) not choosing Tony over Eddie, which would have tough with Eddie having been an established name who had just beaten Gilbert and Pettis, or (3) not moving Tony up fast enough in general.

Personally I think it just was what it was. It’s unlucky to win that many fights in a row without getting the belt, but it’s lucky that Khabib wasn’t healthy the whole time. If they’re both healthy and unobstructed they simply meet sooner and Tony gets beat 50-45. In some ways this is the better outcome, because now Tony is the champ who never was instead of another in the line of really good contenders who got squashed by Khabib.
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<mma4>
All very good and solid points. Great response. Cheers!
 
Stump said:
Solid take. Totally agree. I find it pretty hard to blame Werdum here. Tony was being an outright prick for the whole session.

Also, I like your thoughts on the overall context for Tony's increasing craziness around this time. I hadn't quite fleshed that out, but you seem to have nailed it. I remember when Tony's craziness was mounting feeling like there was something off about him. The Tony Shtick seemed too AUTHENTICALLY crazy, somehow. It was somehow concerning or something in a way that Chael, or Conor or even Colby's attention-grabbing asshole personalities just weren't.

and meanwhile, during this sense of Tony maybe really actually being crazy, he was putting up super impressive, action-packed wins against the division's best but was never fighting for the title. It didn't add up. I think you've maybe solved the equation: Tony misread the signals from UFC and doubled-down on the seeming instability and craziness.
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Yea, Chael laid the blueprint by basically developing a full blown WWE persona after coming over from the WEC buyout. Conor is naturally a wild showman that fully adopted the blueprint to sell fights, though he's now on the brink of crazy. I do feel like Colby only got it half right.

I only say half right because Chael and Conor wear their personas 24/7. Colby lost a bit of steam by not. On top of that, his persona usually just rubbed people the wrong way; he wasn't likable.

No matter the nonsense that came out of Chael and Conor, they were great talkers, and most importantly they were always likable (even to the people that hated them). Their use of comedy kept them on that fine line, whereas Colby just acted like an arrogant douchebag. He did that well, but it would've backfired fast if he wasn't also a good fighter.

Tony was a great fighter that didn't quite tick right; that's what sold his fights. That was a solid mix that didn't need any added ingredients.

Whomever agreed with him that it would be a good idea to suddenly start disrespecting the media and other fighters the way he did should be fired.
 
Dionysian said:
Very few people have. The fake 2 minute edited video becoming the dominant narrative is pretty annoying, as are all attempts to subvert objective truth in this world.

Anyway I appreciate the pre-emptive "fuck you he's amazing" haha
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well yeah, and then you got the most low IQ gullible forum of Sherdog, its makes for a perfect storm of false narrative
 
What year is it? Who cares? Both fighters are no longer elite or relevant.
 
FloydMayweatherMMA said:
Not you bro, I'm still trying to get the dude who claimed there were several people with a twelve fight win streak at lightweight to name one of them.
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Yeah that dude ranges from saying something smart to something absolutely moronic, and when you call him out on his idiocy he clams up like a shy girl sir lol.
 
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