Just rewatched Fedor versus Werdum

[King Cobra]

Rampage's defence was not as good as Nogs back in the day, he depended much more on his chin and indeed very specifically stated he didn't want to fight Fedor.

By the time Nog was in the UFC he was clearly on his way down, look at the difference between his fights vs Herring, looked worse again vs SYlvia and then aweful vs Mir. If anyone can watch the latetr especially and say that's the same level of performance as he gave in Pride then either they have no idea what there watching or are wantonly dishonest.

Some of Fedor's offence was cover for looking for the clinch of course and not aimed very well but a lot of it wasn't and the fact it was often in the form of big looping shots is not a negative, just look at JDS's offence for example and how effective that is. The nature of MMA with smaller gloves makes such punchs a lot more effective, watch Fedor/Goodridge for example, almost the first punch Fedor throw sneaks around Goodridges high guard and rocks him setting up everything that follows.

The problem with looping shots is that they are easy to counter by good boxers so in turn it will backfire on you. You have to be really good to defend a counter after you throw a looping shot. This depends on your reflex which decreases over time.

I think Fedor would still do well today if he were to add in more uppercuts and inside hooks. Even body shots too. Fedor is a heavy head hunter but if he were to add in more body shots he would still be a wrecking machine today.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

The problem with looping shots is that they are easy to counter by good boxers so in turn it will backfire on you. You have to be really good to defend a counter after you throw a looping shot. This depends on your reflex which decreases over time.

I think Fedor would still do well today if he were to add in more uppercuts and inside hooks. Even body shots too. Fedor is a heavy head hunter but if he were to add in more body shots he would still be a wrecking machine today.

Yeah I agree there, Fedor's classic style was definitely one that depended a lot on speed/reactions, against Crocop(as good a counter boxer as you'll find in MMA history) for example he slips potentially fight ending left straights about a dozen times.

Back in the day of course Fedor wasn't just a head hunter, he worked Goodridge over with bodyshots and put Fujita away with a liverkick. That said I don't agree with calling him a "brawler" until the Bigfoot fight, he was still timing shots pretty well then and showing good defence.

I do actually think you saw Fedor adapting a bit post Strikefroce, he cut back on the aggression and depended less of head movement and more on controlling distance. The big advantage of that was also of course that he left himself less vulnerable to being taken down and really grappling weakness(which declined a lot more than his striking IMHO) was what ended his run at the top.

 

[vintagemmafan]

I am not delusional nothing. I've been watching MMA since 1993. The one here that is delusional is you who obviously wants to be Fedor's lover but unfortunately for you Fedor does not roll that way buddy. Your worshiping of the man is what makes you delusional.

And this was the case on here back then around 2005 and on with your weirdos.
[

[/QUOTE]

I can't know for sure if you have been watching since 1993 but I'm gonna call bullshit on that simply because you repeat the tired used group think on this site about Fedor which is simply a side effect of young indoctrinated UFC fans believing everything and anything Dana White has to say and if I want
to be Fedor's lover its pretty obvious you want to be Dana's
because you hold his opinion higher than actual reality and facts.

This whole exchange we've been having can be easily summed up with the fact that you said Fedor has always
fought like he did in his losses and recent fights,if that's not
delusional than it can only be one other thing and its a hater
and now that I think of it I'd say its the latter.

 

[vintagemmafan]

Yeah I agree there, Fedor's classic style was definitely one that depended a lot on speed/reactions, against Crocop(as good a counter boxer as you'll find in MMA history) for example he slips potentially fight ending left straights about a dozen times.

Back in the day of course Fedor wasn't just a head hunter, he worked Goodridge over with bodyshots and put Fujita away with a liverkick. That said I don't agree with calling him a "brawler" until the Bigfoot fight, he was still timing shots pretty well then and showing good defence.

I do actually think you saw Fedor adapting a bit post Strikefroce, he cut back on the aggression and depended less of head movement and more on controlling distance. The big advantage of that was also of course that he left himself less vulnerable to being taken down and really grappling weakness(which declined a lot more than his striking IMHO) was what ended his run at the top.

WOW you guys on here are so fucking ignorant when it comes to Fedor,his punches are not looping there actually straight and how do I know this because I've been to Fedor's seminar and seen the cork screw punch demonstrated and
it is in fact straight not looping or wide,its the moment where he cork screws his fist that makes the punch seem looping,if you don't believe and just want to believe its a looping punch because of how its perceived when watching it on tv than just it out in his book on combat and techniques where it clearly shows he uses next to no looping punches.

Now if your talking about the terrible fights he had in Strikeforce than yes they were extremely sloppy poorly executed and is an indication that at that time Fedor was
not mentally or physically there anymore and hasn't been
ever since those fights,I know this for sure because I have not witnessed Fedor throw a proper cork screw punch since his Pride days,Fedor has been past since the Arlovski fight
and has turned into a brawler for the most part,these UFC
fans that keep saying hes always been like that are haters that just like seeing him do bad and obviously didn't watch Fedor when he was in Pride during his prime because they would know his style of punching and upper body td's and ground work,instead people judge his fighting off of his losses and recent performances and use that as evidence of how he fights which coundn't be further from the truth.

 

[King Cobra]

I can't know for sure if you have been watching since 1993 but I'm gonna call bullshit on that simply because you repeat the tired used group think on this site about Fedor which is simply a side effect of young indoctrinated UFC fans believing everything and anything Dana White has to say and if I want
to be Fedor's lover its pretty obvious you want to be Dana's
because you hold his opinion higher than actual reality and facts.[/quote]

Bro shut the fuck up already lol. If that is the only argument you have for anybody who is a critic of Fedor than that shows how you really do not have any logical argument to use against his critics while you continue to worship the guy.

You are too stupid to comprehend the fact that the argument I am presenting in my posts are from me having watch Fedor fight when he was in his prime at Pride. Derp.

You think that because you worship Fedor as your God that others will instead worship Dana White as their God. That is called you projecting.

This whole exchange we've been having can be easily summed up with the fact that you said Fedor has always
fought like he did in his losses and recent fights,if that's not
delusional than it can only be one other thing and its a hater
and now that I think of it I'd say its the latter.

My point is that Fedor has never fought a strong BJJ expert like Werdum except for Arona and then Big Nog. Big Nog however was never as slick from the bottom as Werdum was. Ricco Rodriguez who submitted him in a grappling tournament gave him issues in their Pride fight and Frank Mir owen him on the ground. Those would had never happened to Werdum.

Plus Arono had Fedor beat. This is fact. It was close but Arona could had easily taken a decision win that night.

And as for his punches, I feel that as striking evolved in MMA that his still of offense would be much more capable of being negated with more advanced boxing defense.

That was my point.

 

[King Cobra]

I can't know for sure if you have been watching since 1993 but I'm gonna call bullshit on that simply because you repeat the tired used group think on this site about Fedor which is simply a side effect of young indoctrinated UFC fans believing everything and anything Dana White has to say and if I want
to be Fedor's lover its pretty obvious you want to be Dana's
because you hold his opinion higher than actual reality and facts.

Bro shut the fuck up already lol. If that is the only argument you have for anybody who is a critic of Fedor than that shows how you really do not have any logical argument to use against his critics while you continue to worship the guy.

You are too stupid to comprehend the fact that the argument I am presenting in my posts are from me having watch Fedor fight when he was in his prime at Pride. Derp.

You think that because you worship Fedor as your God that others will instead worship Dana White as their God. That is called you projecting.

This whole exchange we've been having can be easily summed up with the fact that you said Fedor has always
fought like he did in his losses and recent fights,if that's not
delusional than it can only be one other thing and its a hater
and now that I think of it I'd say its the latter.

My point is that Fedor has never fought a strong BJJ expert like Werdum except for Arona and then Big Nog. Big Nog however was never as slick from the bottom as Werdum was. Ricco Rodriguez who submitted him in a grappling tournament gave him issues in their Pride fight and Frank Mir owen him on the ground. Those would had never happened to Werdum.

Plus Arono had Fedor beat. This is fact. It was close but Arona could had easily taken a decision win that night.

And as for his punches, I feel that as striking evolved in MMA that his still of offense would be much more capable of being negated with more advanced boxing defense.

That was my point.

 

[dontlaugh]

Fedor is the GOAT, do we really need to compare him to Jon "Limp" Bones or Anderson "Cialis" Silva?

Really the true argument is between him and GSP.

Just curious, don't people ever mention Aldo, Cruz and MM in GOAT conversations ? i mean, they did clean their top 5 and have impressive streaks...

 

[abs_maniac]

I'm not so sure that Fedor actually hurt Werdum. Looks like Werdum is doing his usual "get touched anywhere and pull guard" routine. He does it against everyone, even against Browne. Still no shame at all about getting caught by Werdum, or losing to TRT Bigfoot/Hendo for that matter.

braced his "fall", eyes glued to Fedor the entire time... Werdum was collected, 100% guaranteed. Fedor probably did get a good punch in, though, and Werdum used it to trick Fedor.

 

[vintagemmafan]

Bro shut the fuck up already lol. If that is the only argument you have for anybody who is a critic of Fedor than that shows how you really do not have any logical argument to use against his critics while you continue to worship the guy.

You are too stupid to comprehend the fact that the argument I am presenting in my posts are from me having watch Fedor fight when he was in his prime at Pride. Derp.

You think that because you worship Fedor as your God that others will instead worship Dana White as their God. That is called you projecting.




My point is that Fedor has never fought a strong BJJ expert like Werdum except for Arona and then Big Nog. Big Nog however was never as slick from the bottom as Werdum was. Ricco Rodriguez who submitted him in a grappling tournament gave him issues in their Pride fight and Frank Mir owen him on the ground. Those would had never happened to Werdum.

Plus Arono had Fedor beat. This is fact. It was close but Arona could had easily taken a decision win that night.

And as for his punches, I feel that as striking evolved in MMA that his still of offense would be much more capable of being negated with more advanced boxing defense.

That was my point.

You must stupid to say that Fedor has never fought a strong BJJ fighter and then turn around and say except for Arona and Nogueira,well what are they fucking white belts genius,also Werdum subbng Nogueira or Nogueira getting beat in adcc by Ricco doesn't someone prove Werdum is better than Nogueira because Nogueira was completely shot at the time,but the time that they both fought at %100 Nogueira owned Werdum on the and on the feet so Nogueira
is better than Werdum everywhere,as for Arona if he won the
fight he would have been awarded the decision but he wasn't
because didn't and the judges knew that,there was also no reason for them to give Fedor the win,its not like Fedor was even known or marketable back then if anything it would make more sense to give it to Arona because he is more marketable has a nice body builder look but again they didn't because he LOST and group think from UFC noobs on forums is irrelavant.

 

[tenniswhiz]

Fedor is the GOAT, do we really need to compare him to Jon "Limp" Bones or Anderson "Cialis" Silva?

Really the true argument is between him and GSP.

Fedor was truly great.
Such an incredible career.

He's 3rd on my list.

1. Sakuraba
2. Conor
3. Fedor

 

[King Cobra]

You must stupid to say that Fedor has never fought a strong BJJ fighter and then turn around and say except for Arona and Nogueira,well what are they fucking white belts genius,also Werdum subbng Nogueira or Nogueira getting beat in adcc by Ricco doesn't someone prove Werdum is better than Nogueira because Nogueira was completely shot at the time,but the time that they both fought at %100 Nogueira owned Werdum on the and on the feet so Nogueira
is better than Werdum everywhere,as for Arona if he won the
fight he would have been awarded the decision but he wasn't
because didn't and the judges knew that,there was also no reason for them to give Fedor the win,its not like Fedor was even known or marketable back then if anything it would make more sense to give it to Arona because he is more marketable has a nice body builder look but again they didn't because he LOST and group think from UFC noobs on forums is irrelavant.

Dude........All you are doing ot insulting those that do not worship the manlike you do. Shut the fuck up already and stop being so butt hurt.

I posted that Arona gave him issues and could had easily gotten the decision in that fight if the judge would had given it to him. Plus Arona was a light heavyweight.

I also told you that Big Nog was not as slick from bottom as Werdum or even Frank Mir were. Mir owned him on the ground and also the game chances when you are getting punch in the face.

Aside from Big Nog and Arona Fedor never fought a master BJJ guy meaning that had he fought more BJJ dudes than he may have been tapped out earlier on in his career rather than by Werdum later on.

 

[vintagemmafan]

Dude........All you are doing ot insulting those that do not worship the manlike you do. Shut the fuck up already and stop being so butt hurt.

I posted that Arona gave him issues and could had easily gotten the decision in that fight if the judge would had given it to him. Plus Arona was a light heavyweight.

I also told you that Big Nog was not as slick from bottom as Werdum or even Frank Mir were. Mir owned him on the ground and also the game chances when you are getting punch in the face.

Aside from Big Nog and Arona Fedor never fought a master BJJ guy meaning that had he fought more BJJ dudes than he may have been tapped out earlier on in his career rather than by Werdum later on.

You're absolutely rediculous and very bad at debating because you just finished saying Fedor never fought master BJJ guy aside from Arona and Nogueira(2),well what is Nogueira not a master,what a contradiction and besides those two what about Monson who was incredible in adcc and has subbed lots of really good fighters and beat pe de pano in mma,Fedor had no problem with against him.

Fedor lost against Werdum not because he was a BJJ fighter but because Fedor was no longer mentally into it at the time,Fedor didn't have to go to the ground with Werdum he choose to fight that way,he also escaped the first triangle and put his head right back into it,that is a clear sign of someone that wasn't mentally into competing at that point,not a weakness to BJJ.

 

[WAR RANDLEMAN!]

fedor was a japanese invention just like crocop, once they started fighting real fighters and not overweight retarded brazilians and 110 lb japanese dishwashers they were exposed

 

[myjohnson9]

Fedor was kicking the shit out of werdum and made the mistake of jumping into his guard.

Also Fedor = GOAT


Fedor bless

 

[tarumady]

Fedor catches Werdum at 4:33. He could have let Werdum get up, and repeated his onslaught again until Werdum was really out, but he fell into the Werdum trap of wer-doom. Credit to Werdum, he has been a UFC HeavyWeight champ. He's only lost to the best in the world.

A lesser grappler would have been finished, but Werdum was arguable THE BEST GRAPPLER IN THE WORLD at the time, based on ADCC performance.

The point I'm making is that this was the end of Fedor's reign. Fedor may have lost the will after this, or this may have been the end of his prime. Different fighers have different lifespans when it comes to being in their prime. He may have also slacked off training and started swiggin on some vodka.

He's still the GOAT.

• He could have beaten Werdum.
• Werdum is an awesome fighter, Top 5 Heavy Weight all time.
• Fedor's prime ended around this time.
• Fedor always came with 100% intensity, never ran, never backed down from a position like Conor or Runereem.
• Was brave enough to fight the GOAT grappler at his own game and lost.

Boo

 

[King Cobra]

You're absolutely rediculous and very bad at debating because you just finished saying Fedor never fought master BJJ guy aside from Arona and Nogueira(2),well what is Nogueira not a master,what a contradiction and besides those two what about Monson who was incredible in adcc and has subbed lots of really good fighters and beat pe de pano in mma,Fedor had no problem with against him.

Listen I know that you are slow and stupid being that you think Fedor is God but I will try to simplify it as much as I can okay?

Fedor has never fought a BJJ master as slick from the bottom as Werdum is. Big Nog was never as slick as Werdum and he was inconsistent in MMA when it came to his grappling. He got subbed by Mir, lost to Barnett and won a controversial fight aaginst Ricco Rodriguez who was the real that should had gotten the win in that fight.

Okay? You think you can comprehend that?

Okay now let me continue. The only guy who was as slick from the bottom as Werdum was Arona, but he was a Light Heavyweight, and he still control that fight enough to have deserved the decision win.

Okay little buddy?

Fedor lost against Werdum not because he was a BJJ fighter but because Fedor was no longer mentally into it at the time

Wait....Fedor was no loner mentally into it at the time? Are you kidding me?

Fedor was set on destroying Werdum with ground and pound because he though he smelled blood. If he was not into it, he would had been passive and just jab with Werdum throughout the fight. You fucking idiot.

Fedor neevr fought a HEAVYWEIGHT BJJ fighter as slick as Werdum is from the bottom. And as a result he got tapped out in quickly.

You are a pathetic worshiper would be become Fedor's sex slave if he offer you the chance. You are weird. I am done here.

 

[vintagemmafan]

Listen I know that you are slow and stupid being that you think Fedor is God but I will try to simplify it as much as I can okay?

Fedor has never fought a BJJ master as slick from the bottom as Werdum is. Big Nog was never as slick as Werdum and he was inconsistent in MMA when it came to his grappling. He got subbed by Mir, lost to Barnett and won a controversial fight aaginst Ricco Rodriguez who was the real that should had gotten the win in that fight.

Okay? You think you can comprehend that?

Okay now let me continue. The only guy who was as slick from the bottom as Werdum was Arona, but he was a Light Heavyweight, and he still control that fight enough to have deserved the decision win.

Okay little buddy?





Wait....Fedor was no loner mentally into it at the time? Are you kidding me?

Fedor was set on destroying Werdum with ground and pound because he though he smelled blood. If he was not into it, he would had been passive and just jab with Werdum throughout the fight. You fucking idiot.

Fedor neevr fought a HEAVYWEIGHT BJJ fighter as slick as Werdum is from the bottom. And as a result he got tapped out in quickly.

You are a pathetic worshiper would be become Fedor's sex slave if he offer you the chance. You are weird. I am done here.

OK first off you're just a poster on sherdog and not someone who is a judge of BJJ skill,so you saying Werdum is slicker than Nogueira from the bottom is totally just you're opinion and not fact,another thing you're using a loss to Mir that occurred long after Nogueira's best days and just because he might have been a champion at the time doesn't prove a thing except that UFC has inferior fighters,the Ricco fight I agree that Ricco controlled Nogueira but if you weren't such a big UFC noob you would know that Pride fights aren't scored on LnP but rather on effort to finish the fight which Nogueira had with the kimura he locked up almost subbing Ricco and then you brinng up losing to Barnett and whats your point there Barnett is fucking amazing especially back then and on the ground as a catch wrestler,those are some real shitty points you made right there.

Arona was as slick from the bottom as Werdum,really because the only time I can remember Arona doing jits off his back was the time against Jackson and he got slammed on his head and put unconscious real slick,Arona was a top player for the most part,I'm really thinking you get your knowledge of past fighters from watching youtube and opinion pieces because the things you regurgitate don't add up.

I'm not even gonna go over your analysis of the Fedor/Werdum fight because your arrogance is showing when you think you know what he was thinking at the time and what he would done,just astounding you must be an insider or were there in his camp when this all went down
either that or your psychic.

 

[King Cobra]

OK first off you're just a poster on sherdog and not someone who is a judge of BJJ skill,

Come to Northvale Renzo Gracie BJJ gym and I will show you who the poster is.

And as a fan of the sport a smart man can criticize and make points about the sport just like fans do for football or what not.

STFU. Holy shit you re annoying. Dude Fedor is not gay. Get off his nuts already he does not want you.

 

[King Cobra]

but if you weren't such a big UFC noob.

You call me a UFC noob but yet agree with me about one of my points pertaining to Big Nog fighting Ricco in Pride.

You lost it. Go back to sleep little buddy.

 

[lostdog000]

werdum claimed he was not hit - but baited him into his guard
looks like he got hit
but i certainly was yelling at fedor on my tv not to go into his guard...