Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

[AWESOMEACE]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/judge-apple-must-help-us-005604451.html

So apparently the feds really cant get that phone unlocked.

Cliffs from the article: there were two other phones discovered that were so destroyed the feds couldn't get any information off of them, and there is still a hard drive missing from a computer that they have not been able to find. I am not sure what information this phone is going to have on it, if he took such measures to hide other information. It was a work phone.

 

[Bukowski82]

This seems like a fucking no-brainer to me...

Make it happen, Apple. And make it snappy.

 

[Hallelujah]

So the muslim terrorists were also computer/hacker wizards who were able to encrypt their smart phones?

 

[AWESOMEACE]

So the muslim terrorists were also computer/hacker wizards who were able to encrypt their smart phones?

Well you obviously didn't read the article but such is life. To answer your question, no. Apple has built encryption technology into all their phones, that apparently the feds can't figure out.

 

[VivaRevolution]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/judge-apple-must-help-us-005604451.html

So apparently the feds really cant get that phone unlocked.

Cliffs from the article: there were two other phones discovered that were so destroyed the feds couldn't get any information off of them, and there is still a hard drive missing from a computer that they have not been able to find. I am not sure what information this phone is going to have on it, if he took such measures to hide other information. It was a work phone.

My thought is that I have believed the NSA has a quantum computer for some time now.

This would shoot some holes in that idea.

 

[VivaRevolution]

So the muslim terrorists were also computer/hacker wizards who were able to encrypt their smart phones?

Installing PGP encryption, or some other form of encryption, is no great task.

 

[AWESOMEACE]

My thought is that I have believed the NSA has a quantum computer for some time now.

This would shoot some holes in that idea.

So what do you think the scenario is here?

 

[VivaRevolution]

So what do you think the scenario is here?

Well, we need to know the level of encryption to have a real idea. If we are talking 512K encryption, and there is no back door, and no quantum computers, it is basically impossible to crack.

If we are talking 256K encryption, no quantum computer, and no back door, it can be done, but will take some time.

If Apple has a back door to their encryption, then the government has put them in a rough position here, as by helping them unlock it, they basically admit there is a back door.


Edit: I am no expert on this by any means, my knowledge here is based on what I have read about the NSA.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

Amazing that the US gov't can't hack some schmo's cell phone.

"We can help with that."

 

[AWESOMEACE]

Well, we need to know the level of encryption to have a real idea. If we are talking 512K encryption, and there is no back door, and no quantum computers, it is basically impossible to crack.

If we are talking 256K encryption, no quantum computer, and no back door, it can be done, but will take some time.

If Apple has a back door to their encryption, then the government has put them in a rough position here, as by helping them unlock it, they basically admit there is a back door.


Edit: I am no expert on this by any means, my knowledge here is based on what I have read about the NSA.

I will give you a free pass for not reading the article also, as I was truly interested in what your response would be. The article states, that the technology is basically in the 'entry password,' the 4 digit personalized code you come up with on your own. If my understanding is correct and I am not going back to look at the article this time, if you fail at this code 10x, it wipes the phone of its data. The feds would know this and wouldn't be able to randomly guess his password. Quantum computing wouldn't necessarily work, where it could just infinitely run variables of a password until it guessed the right one, because you only get ten guesses. It appears Apple essentially made the technology more complex by simplifying it.

 

[VivaRevolution]

I will give you a free pass for not reading the article also, as I was truly interested in what your response would be. The article states, that the technology is basically in the 'entry password,' the 4 digit personalized code you come up with on your own. If my understanding is correct and I am not going back to look at the article this time, if you fail at this code 10x, it wipes the phone of its data. The feds would know this and wouldn't be able to randomly guess his password. Quantum computing wouldn't necessarily work, where it could just infinitely run variables of a password until it guessed the right one, because you only get ten guesses. It appears Apple essentially made the technology more complex by simplifying it.

Oh wow, that is interesting.

Thanks for the info.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

I will give you a free pass for not reading the article also, as I was truly interested in what your response would be. The article states, that the technology is basically in the 'entry password,' the 4 digit personalized code you come up with on your own. If my understanding is correct and I am not going back to look at the article this time, if you fail at this code 10x, it wipes the phone of its data. The feds would know this and wouldn't be able to randomly guess his password. Quantum computing wouldn't necessarily work, where it could just infinitely run variables of a password until it guessed the right one, because you only get ten guesses. It appears Apple essentially made the technology more complex by simplifying it.

Just how "wiped clean" can it really be? Isn't it very hard to completely wipe a hard drive?

I should start a Mayberry thread about that, since I want to throw out an old laptop but I don't just want to dump it. Someone could take it out of the trash and steal my identity or some shit.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

What's the legal basis for conscripting Apple's services? Expediency? Then there's more questions concerning Apple's ability to swiftly comply and why that ability exists at all.

 

[Banchan]

Just how "wiped clean" can it really be? Isn't it very hard to completely wipe a hard drive?

I should start a Mayberry thread about that, since I want to throw out an old laptop but I don't just want to dump it. Someone could take it out of the trash and steal my identity or some shit.

If the answer is more complex than reformat the hard drive , then i too need an answer .

 

[Rod1]

Just how "wiped clean" can it really be? Isn't it very hard to completely wipe a hard drive?

I should start a Mayberry thread about that, since I want to throw out an old laptop but I don't just want to dump it. Someone could take it out of the trash and steal my identity or some shit.

Its a flash memory, so beyond any form of repair.

Its not like HDDs where data is sequential.

 

[Rod1]

If the answer is more complex than reformat the hard drive , then i too need an answer .

HDDs write the data sequentially, since they need to physically access the data, its not the same with SSDs or flash drives since the data can be accessed from any point, so basically without the headers it would be like kicking a sand castle and then trying to figure out where which grain of sand goes.

 

[DoomPatrol]

I will give you a free pass for not reading the article also, as I was truly interested in what your response would be. The article states, that the technology is basically in the 'entry password,' the 4 digit personalized code you come up with on your own. If my understanding is correct and I am not going back to look at the article this time, if you fail at this code 10x, it wipes the phone of its data. The feds would know this and wouldn't be able to randomly guess his password. Quantum computing wouldn't necessarily work, where it could just infinitely run variables of a password until it guessed the right one, because you only get ten guesses. It appears Apple essentially made the technology more complex by simplifying it.

I wonder if the technology exists to copy the hard drive bit for bit. They have physical access to it If they did that, couldn't they take that copy and use it on a dummy phone and try the combinations?

I'm really surprised they don't have someone who can do this stuff for them.

 

[PolishHeadlock]

My thought is that I have believed the NSA has a quantum computer for some time now.

This would shoot some holes in that idea.

It's also possible 5hey won't tip their hand if it isn't necessary

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

If the answer is more complex than reformat the hard drive , then i too need an answer .

Your data is definitely recoverable if all you do is reformat.

 

[AWESOMEACE]

I wonder if the technology exists to copy the hard drive bit for bit. They have physical access to it If they did that, couldn't they take that copy and use it on a dummy phone and try the combinations?

I'm really surprised they don't have someone who can do this stuff for them.

It is puzzling to say the least. I think this may also be one area, that the people who really know what they are doing have the option of getting paid a boat load more to work for Apple than they do the government. It is a stereotype but the guys that are really good at this stuff usually do not have the mentality of trying to secure "that cushy government job." I think this is also a gray area in legal precedence, Apple has fought the idea of releasing the technology, they obviously do not support what happened, they just know it is a "slippery slope."