Jordan Peterson seeks 'emergency' drug detox treatment in Russia

[Samjj]

Some people deserve it but I don't Peterson has done close to enough to.

I tend to think Peterson is mostly well intending despite his flaws, so agree with your sentiment.. but when you’re around enough suffering dying people, it’s hard to wish that on people, even ones you hate.

 

[WhiteMousse]

This is the war room.

That said I'm disappointed in a lot of you here.

 

[Lubaolong]

I read something similar. In Russia they’ll put you in a coma like state so you can detox without the withdrawal pains. This almost killed him.
Seems dangerous.

She also said doctors in the US were influenced by pharmaceutical companies and give one drug to cover up the effects of something else, while doctors in Russia are supposedly free from this influence. Not sure what this means or what they're giving him in Russia to detox. The mention of the lung infection in the context of him withdrawing makes you wonder if he's not being detoxed properly, having seizures, and aspirating. Wonder if they're regretting their decision now.

 

[KONG-D'SNT-TAP]

She also said doctors in the US were influenced by pharmaceutical companies and give one drug to cover up the effects of something else, while doctors in Russia are supposedly free from this influence. Not sure what this means or what they're giving him in Russia to detox. The mention of the lung infection in the context of him withdrawing also makes you wonder if he's not being detoxed properly, having seizures, and aspirating. He's definitely not getting evidence-based treatment there if they put him in a coma to detox from benzos. Wonder if they're regretting their decision now.

I wonder if he’ll ever recover or there will be mental problems going forward. Possible physical problems as well. This treatment wasn’t a smart move. Very short sighted

 

[Lubaolong]

Lmao that's like the "tinted with lefty hatred" version of what she said, not what she actually said. "Derp derp we sent him to a crazy clinic because Peterson is evil and we're bad people"

From her interview, it sounds like they shopped around to multiple different hospitals in the US, didn't find anyone willing to do what they wanted, so they went outside the country.

 

[MilesAbove]

unlike the limbaugh situation, this is a sad one. Addiction is a real beast. All reason and fortitude can feel helpless against it. Peterson isn't a bad person. He's not even particularly mean-hearted. I hope he finds his way out of this mess.

 

[Lubaolong]

Guess it's impossible to say if it is appropriate or not without knowing more information about him and what they're doing for him there.

I would say for someone mixing large amounts of benzos and alcohol, it wouldn't be uncommon to see these people ending up in an ICU on a fixed-dose phenobarb taper.

I'm not sure how exactly a medically-induced coma is defined. I have a different picture in mind, like someone sedated after brain injury or something, but I suppose it could be defined as being snowed in the ICU tapering off phenobarb, but defer to medicine colleague @Samjj

 

[Social Distance Warrior]

unlike the limbaugh situation, this is a sad one. Addiction is a real beast. All reason and fortitude can feel helpless against it. Peterson isn't a bad person. He's not even particularly mean-hearted. I hope he finds his way out of this mess.

Ladies and gentlemen....and non-binary folk, this is a classy response.

everyone take note.

 

[Sano]

I can't stand Peterson and his pseudoscience bullshit, but with that said wish him well and hope he recovers.

A lot of hypocrisy in this thread on both sides. The majority of what goes on in here is reveling in others pain, so those taking offense in this instance probably shouldn't act so high and mighty.

 

[Seano]

LIFE IS SUFFERING.

Is that not the ultimate human truth?

Yes, he's going through some things, but...this is The War Room.

He is fodder, unless people straight up wish him to die.

I personally find him to be toxic toxic toxic toxic.......hence the irony with his condition.

Suffering in life doesn't really mean we should celebrate one's suffering though, right? Someone who celebrates another persons pain and suffering is shit on the shoe of the world.

 

[Samjj]

Guess it's impossible to say if it is appropriate or not without knowing more information about him and what they're doing for him there.

I would say for someone mixing large amounts of benzos and alcohol, it wouldn't be uncommon to see these people ending up in an ICU on a fixed-dose phenobarb taper.

I'm not sure how exactly a medically-induced coma is defined. I have a different picture in mind, like someone sedated after brain injury or something, but I suppose it could be defined as being snowed in the ICU tapering off phenobarb, but defer to medicine colleague @Samjj

From what I understand, he failed going on a very gradual benzo taper. Swapping out a low dose benzo for a more potent GABA agonist in a barbiturate sounds like a questionable therapeutic strategy but who knows the quantities that he was actually taking in/or mixing...no idea what they’re doing over there...

 

[JDragon]

Don't know what happened, but in any case he sounds fucked up, and we probably won't see him again.

Almost seems like there's a good reason why US clinics won't do this kind of treatment...

 

[Ruprecht]

Is he still struggling with this? I thought the thread must have been a necro at first.
Taking a long time to get his shit together for someone whose career is telling people how to get their shit together.

 

[Lubaolong]

From what I understand, he failed going on a very gradual benzo taper. Swapping out a low dose benzo for a more potent GABA agonist in a barbiturate sounds like a questionable therapeutic strategy but who knows the quantities that he was actually taking in/or mixing...no idea what they’re doing over there...

That's actually pretty common. People who abuse both alcohol and benzos supposedly desensitized gaba receptors, so benzo tapers don't work as well for them. Where I trained, it was standard to use phenobarb for these people. Phenobarb both enhances gaba activity and suppresses glutaminergic activity. I would guess this woudl be the approach at a lot of big academic addiction hospitals. My question though is what is considered a med induced coma. I usually hear about that for people who have strokes or head injuries. I've never heard of a phenobarb taper for benzo withdrawal being called a med induced coma, but technically, maybe you could consider it that. Dunno if that's what they did for him in Russia or if they did something that might be more questionable.

 

[Zazen]

People on this forum are seriously monsters, this is why I disappear for a year or two at a time. This place isn't healthy

 

[BJ@LW&WW]

if this emergency detox is efficacious, why is it not available in the states?

 

[PolishHeadlock2]

Why Russia?

Vodka cleanse?

Going to Russia over the US and Canada for medical treatment caught my eye as well.

His daughter said something like "They have the courage to medically detox people" and I have no idea what that means. But you can actually die from Benzo withdrawal if you go cold turkey

 

[TheGreatA]

Almost seems like there's a good reason why US clinics won't do this kind of treatment...

Based on their own account (which we obviously can't know to be 100% true), he was misdiagnosed, given random drugs which had no effect on his condition in the US, and ended up contracting pneumonia in one of the hospitals, for which he was treated in Russia.

The word is that he's actually doing OK now, but still has a long way to go to recovery, if he will ever recover fully at all.

Sounds like a shit-show all around.

 

[Samjj]

That's actually pretty common. People who abuse both alcohol and benzos supposedly desensitized gaba receptors, so benzo tapers don't work as well for them. Where I trained, it was standard to use phenobarb for these people. Phenobarb both enhances gaba activity and suppresses glutaminergic activity. I would guess this woudl be the approach at a lot of big academic addiction hospitals. My question though is what is considered a med induced coma. I usually hear about that for people who have strokes or head injuries. I've never heard of a phenobarb taper for benzo withdrawal being called a med induced coma, but technically, maybe you could consider it that. Dunno if that's what they did for him in Russia or if they did something that might be more questionable.

I didn't know that about phenobarb. Quick uptodate search leaves me w/... nothing about benzo withdrawal though.

Barbiturate coma — Pentobarbital and thiopental infusions may be used to manage elevated ICP refractory to other therapies. While effective for the control of ICP, the use of barbiturate coma has not been shown to improve outcomes following TBI [192]. Our practice is to consider barbiturate coma for ICP control only when first-line measures, including hyperosmolar therapy as well as a propofol infusion titrated to deep sedation (RASS score of -5), have been ineffective and surgical decompression is not feasible.

These agents profoundly decrease cerebral metabolic demand, CBF, and cerebral blood volume [193]. A loading dose of 5 to 20 mg/kg of pentobarbital is typically administered, followed by 1 to 4 mg/kg per hour. Continuous electroencephalography (EEG) monitoring is used, with the pentobarbital infusion titrated to produce a burst-suppression pattern. While effective for the control of ICP, pentobarbital infusions are associated with morbidity. The neurologic examination is precluded for an extended period of time because of the long half-life of this drug. This may also result in delays in the determination of brain death. Other common side effects include hypotension requiring vasopressor support, adynamic ileus, and poor pulmonary mucus clearance, with the consequent risk of ventilator-associated pneumonia [194]. Severe metabolic acidosis from propylene-glycol toxicity has been reported with the use of pentobarbital infusions [195,196].

 

[The Big Bang]

Suffering in life doesn't really mean we should celebrate one's suffering though, right? Someone who celebrates another persons pain and suffering is shit on the shoe of the world.

The suffering of THE WORLD is what gives humans a reason to FIGHT.

We are not alone.

Yes, we are all going to die, but so is everyone else.

Live. In. Moments.

 

[hillelslovak87]

Based on their own account (which we obviously can't know to be 100% true), he was misdiagnosed, given random drugs which had no effect on his condition in the US, and ended up contracting pneumonia in one of the hospitals, for which he was treated in Russia.

The word is that he's actually doing OK now, but still has a long way to go to recovery, if he will ever recover fully at all.

Sounds like a shit-show all around.

How is somebody a clinical psychologist and not able to recognize they've not been prescribed the right drugs or given the right diagnoses?

He shouldn't have the power to prescribe people this stuff since he clearly does not know what he's doing. From his insanely stupid diet to the pills, Jeez.