Social Joe Rogan tells his massive audience that healthy young people shouldn't get vaccinated

[dirtypablo]

Here's an article from John Hopkins that was taken down. It's an article by Genevieve Briand at John Hopkins. JH's explanation for taking it down and retracting it was because the information in the article was being used on "conspiracy sites" and they claim this particular study by Briand hadn't been fact-checked properly before publishing.

However, since they took it down, they have yet to provide any kind of scientific rebuttal to Genevieve's findings or provide further context to "put her findings in perspective" as they say.

Article was retrieved from web.archive.org

A Closer Look at U.S. Deaths Due to Covid-19

The entire article is worth reading but here are some interesting quotes for you, guy who doesn't know what he's talking about but thinks he's informed enough to call other people names, like a child, who disagree with him.

Read up, stupid.

It was taken down because it's easily and quickly debunked as nonsense.

 

[Horse Style]

It was taken down because it's easily and quickly debunked as nonsense.

So the data from a respected economist from a respected university is nonsense? Ok, where's the source that debunked this nonsense data because that's not the reason John Hopkins took it down.

 

[dirtypablo]

Most people die in hospital. Everybody in hospital is tested for covid. Everyone who tests positive within 28 days of dying for any reason are labelled as 'covid related deaths' or 'deaths with covid'. The number of 'deaths with covid' is used in the MSM as 'covid deaths'. The deaths due to covid are obviously exaggerated hugely if you just use your common sense (and this is even without including the huge number of false positives). Failure to see this is just plain indoctrination at this point because it's very simple to understand. The same people manipulated by MSM to fear this pandemic are the same people who are fooled by 'Russian aggression', WMDs, chemical weapons, 'China's super soldiers', 'this man is a dictator', 'ice caps are melting because of humans'. Indoctrinated people have no idea that they are being easily manipulated by propaganda. To someone who is vigilant it's easy to see through the lies but propaganda is so effective in this day and age, it's literally a science and it's never been easier to use now with so much consumption of media.

Again, you don't understand what you're looking at. Take covid completely out of the equation. How many people died in 2017? 2018? 2019? Now, take the average of those three numbers. That's the average number of people who die in the US in a year. Now, take the total number of people who died in 2020. Subtract that number from the average. What you're left with is the number of people who died in 2020 in excess of the average - in other words, ignoring causes, how many people died this year that we wouldn't normally expect to die? Now, if, as you are claiming, non covid deaths were being reported as such, that number would be smaller than the official covid count. Wanna take a guess on whether or not that's actually the case?

 

[Scerpi]

So the data from a respected economist from a respected university is nonsense? Ok, where's the source that debunked this nonsense data because that's not the reason John Hopkins took it down.

China Tactics detected...

 

[dirtypablo]

So the data from a respected economist from a respected university is nonsense? Ok, where's the source that debunked this nonsense data because that's not the reason John Hopkins took it down.

Briand was quoted in the article as saying, “All of this points to no evidence that COVID-19 created any excess deaths. Total death numbers are not above normal death numbers.” This claim is incorrect and does not take into account the spike in raw death count from all causes compared to previous years. According to the CDC, there have been almost 300,000 excess deaths due to COVID-19.
...
Because of these inaccuracies and our failure to provide additional information about the effects of COVID-19, The News-Letter decided to retract this article. It is our duty as a publication to combat the spread of misinformation and to enhance our fact-checking process. We apologize to our readers.

https://www.jhunewsletter.com/article/2020/11/a-closer-look-at-u-s-deaths-due-to-covid-19

Here's another article from the University explaining the same thing. Basically, this woman doesn't have the slightest clue as to what she's talking about, and her methodology explicitly excludes excess deaths if they're not part of a known cause. You know, like excess deaths that were caused by a new virus. So, she basically used a method that would remove excess deaths from a new virus to analyze excess deaths, then said hey look! No excess deaths from the pandemic!

https://www.jhunewsletter.com/artic...on-covid-19-deaths-a-look-at-u-s-data-webinar

 

[Horse Style]

https://www.jhunewsletter.com/article/2020/11/a-closer-look-at-u-s-deaths-due-to-covid-19

I love it. I already looked up and found that article before I posted Briand's because I knew you'd latch onto it.

The reason they retracted because people were using her data to downplay the severity of COVID-19. Then they felt the need to say she's not a medical expert (she's an economist) even though she wasn't approaching the COVID-19 numbers from a medical POV. She was focusing on the numbers.

Notice how they said "her study should not be used exclusively to understand the pandemic." They didn't say "her study and numbers were wrong and is debunked nonsense" (as you claim).

Then there's this part:

Briand also claimed in her analysis that deaths due to heart diseases, respiratory diseases, influenza and pneumonia may be incorrectly categorized as COVID-19-related deaths. However, COVID-19 disproportionately affects those with preexisting conditions, so those with those underlying conditions are statistically more likely to be severely affected and die from the virus.

This shows that when someone with heart disease, influenza and pneumonia died, they counted it as a COVID death if they happened to have COVID at the time, which implies COVID was the cause of death rather than the heart disease/influenza/pneumonia. When you look at Briand's graphs, if you adjust for this fact, the death rate is inline with previous years.

 

[dirtypablo]

I love it. I already looked up and found that article before I posted Briand's because I knew you'd latch onto it.

The reason they retracted because people were using her data to downplay the severity of COVID-19. Then they felt the need to say she's not a medical expert (she's an economist) even though she wasn't approaching the COVID-19 numbers from a medical POV. She was focusing on the numbers.

Notice how they said "her study should not be used exclusively to understand the pandemic." They didn't say "her study and numbers were wrong and is debunked nonsense" (as you claim).

Then there's this part:



This shows that when someone with heart disease, influenza and pneumonia died, they counted it as a COVID death if they happened to have COVID at the time, which implies COVID was the cause of death rather than the heart disease/influenza/pneumonia. When you look at Briand's graphs, if you adjust for this fact, the death rate is inline with previous years.

Look at my edit. There are multiple claims she makes that are incorrect, and if you read the follow up article, it is explained why what she is doing is a flawed methodology that doesn't account for excess deaths. Her methodology literally excludes excess deaths, then she uses that to proclaim there are no excess deaths.

 

[burningspear]

Disgusting -

 

[Horse Style]

Look at my edit. There are multiple claims she makes that are incorrect, and if you read the follow up article, it is explained why what she is doing is a flawed methodology that doesn't account for excess deaths. Her methodology literally excludes excess deaths, then she uses that to proclaim there are no excess deaths.

For the most part, they disagreed with her conclusions. There's nothing to say the data is incorrect. The excess deaths is for deaths for ALL causes. It's been noted in several articles that deaths that had co-morbidities were classified as COVID-19 deaths with nothing concretely pointing to COVID being what killed them.

As we see here, the death rate for 2020 is very, very similar to the death rate in the previous years. That means for COVID deaths to be so high, deaths for other causes had to had dropped and unless COVID destroys diseases like heart disease, pneumonia or influenza, there had to be something up with how deaths were classified.

 

[Lubaolong]

I actually do realize I’m not an expert in the field, that’s why I read what professionals write, and what I’ve read is that viruses mutate constantly, and that mRNA viruses mutate at a relatively high rate in addition.

Do you any sources that state otherwise?

If not, can you show me the data, or even estimates, on how many mutations of COVID we will stop through vaccination?

Edit:
Damn, didn’t realize I was responding to one of Sherdog’s biggest trolls, my bad.

It’s super basic. When someone is infected, you have hundreds of millions of virus particles. The virus is picking up mutations due to errors occurring during the replication process. Increasing immunity means fewer infections. Fewer infections means less virus replication. Less virus replication leads to fewer opportunities for the virus to pick up dangerous mutations in humans. Less opportunity to mutate = lower risk of new variants.

 

[Pakman]

Guarantee my résumé is better than yours my friend. Do yourself a favor and pick up a history book.

your resume? lol

I can assure you, you aren't as intelligent as you think you are.

 

[DespicablePeep]

That's what makes Merica so great... if you want the vaccine then get it and if you don't think you need it, because you're a healthy adult capable of making your own choice, then don't. I don't care either way

America stopped being america since 9/11, freedom was exchanged for "peace". I'm sure a bunch of regulation will be done after Covid and everyone will have a vaccine passport.

 

[dirtypablo]

For the most part, they disagreed with her conclusions. There's nothing to say the data is incorrect. The excess deaths is for deaths for ALL causes. It's been noted in several articles that deaths that had co-morbidities were classified as COVID-19 deaths with nothing concretely pointing to COVID being what killed them.

As we see here, the death rate for 2020 is very, very similar to the death rate in the previous years. That means for COVID deaths to be so high, deaths for other causes had to had dropped and unless COVID destroys diseases like heart disease, pneumonia or influenza, there had to be something up with how deaths were classified.

Thats incomplete data - as it says on the chart itself, that is AS OF 12/31/2020. It takes time for the cdc to collect data from every part of the US. The currently reported total number of deaths for 2020 is 3,358,814.

From your chart, if we assume the prior years are all correct, we get an average of 2,792,9117 deaths per year. The average year to year increase is 35,592, with a maximum value from 2016 to 2017 being 69,255 deaths, and the minimum being 15,795 from 2018 to 2019. So, we could expect an increase from 2019 to 2020 somewhere in that range - specifically, somewhere between 15k and 70k. What do we actually see? An increase of 503,814. Thats about 7 times what we might expect as an upper bound. Now, we have that 500k increase from 2019 to 2020, lets say that 100k of that was normal, expected year to year increase due to population growth (Way above the bound, as the average increase is 36k but lets just pretend). So, that leaves us with 400k dead that we wouldn't have expected to die. Well, how many people died from covid in 2020? The official US tally is 377,883, so we've still got another 23k dead with no explanation. In other words, once again for the morons who can't seem to figure this out, THE COVID COUNT IS UNDERREPORTED.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7014e1.htm


More of the same, and including analysis from Johns Hopkins, but you know, the actual people at Johns Hopkins who know how to look at the data.

Researchers at the University of Washington's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation analyzed excess mortality numbers and found about 6.9 million global fatalities from the virus. The current count reported by Johns Hopkins University's COVID-19 dashboard is over 3.2 million deaths.

"Pretty much we're seeing an undercount everywhere," Christopher Murray, IHME director, said during a press briefing. Almost every country has significantly underreported its deaths, according to the analysis.

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-...-half-of-global-coronavirus-deaths-unreported

 

[Horse Style]

Thats incomplete data - as it says on the chart itself, that is AS OF 12/31/2020. It takes time for the cdc to collect data from every part of the US. The currently reported total number of deaths for 2020 is 3,358,814.

From your chart, if we assume the prior years are all correct, we get an average of 2,792,9117 deaths per year. The average year to year increase is 35,592, with a maximum value from 2016 to 2017 being 69,255 deaths, and the minimum being 15,795 from 2018 to 2019. So, we could expect an increase from 2019 to 2020 somewhere in that range - specifically, somewhere between 15k and 70k. What do we actually see? An increase of 503,814. Thats about 7 times what we might expect as an upper bound. Now, we have that 500k increase from 2019 to 2020, lets say that 100k of that was normal, expected year to year increase due to population growth (Way above the bound, as the average increase is 36k but lets just pretend). So, that leaves us with 400k dead that we wouldn't have expected to die. Well, how many people died from covid in 2020? The official US tally is 377,883, so we've still got another 23k dead with no explanation. In other words, once again for the morons who can't seem to figure this out, THE COVID COUNT IS UNDERREPORTED.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7014e1.htm


More of the same, and including analysis from Johns Hopkins, but you know, the actual people at Johns Hopkins who know how to look at the data.



https://www.usnews.com/news/health-...-half-of-global-coronavirus-deaths-unreported

Yes, I see CDC has a running total of 3.36 million deaths so far. My mistake, I was drawing from incomplete data. The number will likely be higher when the final tally comes in later this year.

However, even if we say 378k of those deaths were because of COVID, there is still an abnormally large jump in deaths from 2019 to 2020. Is that going to be attributed to COVID or were these other factors at play (people being discouraged from going to the hospital, medical procedures delayed, etc.)?

The next point is how were deaths with co-morbidities counted? If someone dies and they had heart disease and COVID, which column is it attributed to: COVID or heart disease? If it was put under COVID, how do they know the heart disease wouldn't have killed in the same time frame sans COVID? We already have reports from doctors that they were pressured into adding COVID-19 to death certificates and diagnostic lists even if COVID had little to no relation to the cause of death.

 

[dirtypablo]

Yes, I see CDC has a running total of 3.36 million deaths so far. My mistake, I was drawing from incomplete data. The number will likely be higher when the final tally comes in later this year.

However, even if we say 378k of those deaths were because of COVID, there is still an abnormally large jump in deaths from 2019 to 2020. Is that going to be attributed to COVID or were these other factors at play (people being discouraged from going to the hospital, medical procedures delayed, etc.)?

The next point is how were deaths with co-morbidities counted? If someone dies and they had heart disease and COVID, which column is it attributed to: COVID or heart disease? If it was put under COVID, how do they know the heart disease wouldn't have killed in the same time frame sans COVID? We already have reports from doctors that they were pressured into adding COVID-19 to death certificates and diagnostic lists even if COVID had little to no relation to the cause of death.

We know that those people wouldn't have died during the same time because if they would have, we wouldn't have the excess deaths that we do - they would just be the normal, expected deaths we see every year. The explanation is clear and consistent across multiple countries that all report covid deaths in different ways. A shitload of people died in 2020 that we wouldn't have normally expected to die, in excess of what we call covid deaths. The count is underreported. Thats it. No need for complex conspiracy theories, its a simple, obvious explanation.

 

[dreden1982]

Are there numbers on r&d cost for these pharma companies for the vaccines and how much governments and or insurance companies or whatever are paying for the shots?

 

[Horse Style]

We know that those people wouldn't have died during the same time because if they would have, we wouldn't have the excess deaths that we do - they would just be the normal, expected deaths we see every year. The explanation is clear and consistent across multiple countries that all report covid deaths in different ways. A shitload of people died in 2020 that we wouldn't have normally expected to die, in excess of what we call covid deaths. The count is underreported. Thats it. No need for complex conspiracy theories, its a simple, obvious explanation.

Even accounting for CDC's COVID death count, the current running count is still much higher than expected. There's no indication that those unaccounted for deaths will all, or mostly, attributed to COVID.

There is still the question of how co-morbidities involving COVID are counted. There is also the reports of doctors being pressured to put down COVID on death certificates. That's not a conspiracy. Certain doctors have come out and admitted this so either they put their reputation at risk to feed a conspiracy theory or there is something that isn't on the up and up.

 

[ivantheterible]

Is this a real example you've taken from somewhere?

Real example for my inner circle

 

[fedorthegoat777]

Why would a healthy person get vaccinated?
Joe backtracked big time. Coward.

 

[Papi Chulo]

Here's an article from John Hopkins that was taken down. It's an article by Genevieve Briand at John Hopkins. JH's explanation for taking it down and retracting it was because the information in the article was being used on "conspiracy sites" and they claim this particular study by Briand hadn't been fact-checked properly before publishing.

However, since they took it down, they have yet to provide any kind of scientific rebuttal to Genevieve's findings or provide further context to "put her findings in perspective" as they say.

Article was retrieved from web.archive.org

A Closer Look at U.S. Deaths Due to Covid-19

The entire article is worth reading but here are some interesting quotes for you, guy who doesn't know what he's talking about but thinks he's informed enough to call other people names, like a child, who disagree with him.

Read up, stupid.

The Covid Plandemic is the biggest scam in the history of our nation. Maybe one of the biggest scams in the history of the world.