Joe Rogan isnt sold on the Bing Bang theory finds Jesus resurrection more plausible

[shockaholic12]

Why do people have this right, who gives you this right?

I’m guessing you don’t think a chimp has a right not to get killed by a rival chimp so why are people special?

Chimps social structure will turn on individuals who are too aggressive. Chimp are capable of and carry out judgement regarding the rights of other chimps to be aggressive. We are not special.

“Chimpanzees have been observed punishing aggressive or violent members of their group, often through retaliation or by forming alliances to deter aggression.”

 

[shockaholic12]

I mean mathematics, calculus and even gravity aren't quite rhe same thing as the Big Bang.

Yes, much if it is, I didn't say otherwise. But I said much if it has changed over time with new understand. Thats how it works. But it also means a great deal of what he said and thought was not accurate.

We're talking about accurately predicting an event that happened 15 billion years ago. It’s not a stretch to say the concepts about the universe 15 billion years ago are at least as flawed as the concepts of this one planet a couple hundred years ago.

This logic doesn't make sense because his rules were formed after the big bang happened and describe what happened during the later parts. Before it happened there’s no way to know what rules would apply.

And his rules still apply today. Which was the point.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Because we're more evolved than they are and have more capacity for sentient thought and can understand big picture thinking.

I've never understood this argument, they're basically saying that if it weren't for their belief in a semi benevolent space deity they would be out there raping, stealing and murdering .

 

[Bob Gray]

This logic doesn't make sense because his rules were formed after the big bang happened and describe what happened during it. Before it happened there’s no way to know what rules would apply.

And his rules still apply today. Which was the point.

Somewhat. Like I said, much of what he came up with has been superseded by newer concepts so they wouldn't even apply to whatever models used to clarify the big bang. But this is kinda getting sidetracked.

My point is Newton was a goddamn genius and came up with stuff that people like us could never hope to accomplish. But despite being rooted in empircism and having measurable, predictable results, it's had newer and more accurate concepts replace it. They're always making new discoveries that make changes in what we know, both big and small. So the concepts that exist now will likely be very, very diffent in a century or two.

And thats all to do with stuff thats very recent and immediately observable as it happens. But there's still tons of refinement. Now think about something happening 15 billion years ago. Its hardly a stretch to argue that they're as wrong about an event 15 billion years ago as they were about stuff happening in front of their eyes on this one planet. I brought up the ptolemy model because it was as accurate as it could be, given what they knew at the time. But still massively inaccurate in concept despite predictive success and mathematical accuracy. What I'm saying is eventually it's very likely the concepts of something like the big bang will be uppended by a discovery as profound as the Earth not being the center of the universe. Then things will change. Thats how it almost always works.

 

[shockaholic12]

Somewhat. Like I said, much of what he came up with has been superseded by newer concepts so they wouldn't even apply to whatever models used to clarify the big bang. But this is kinda getting sidetracked.

My point is Newton was a goddamn genius and came up with stuff that people like us could never hope to accomplish. But despite being rooted in empircism and having measurable, predictable results, it's had newer and more accurate concepts replace it. They're always making new discoveries that make changes in what we know, both big and small. So the concepts that exist now will likely be very, very diffent in a century or two.

And thats all to do with stuff thats very recent and immediately observable as it happens. But there's still tons of refinement. Now think about something happening 15 billion years ago. Its hardly a stretch to argue that they're as wrong about an event 15 billion years ago as they were about stuff happening in front of their eyes on this one planet. I brought up the ptolemy model because it was as accurate as it could be, given what they knew at the time. But still massively inaccurate in concept despite predictive success and mathematical accuracy. What I'm saying is eventually it's very likely the concepts of something like the big bang will be uppended by a discovery as profound as the Earth not being the center of the universe. Then things will change. Thats how it almost always works.

Much of it has not been superseded. You are conflating that with new branches of science observing different conditions, like quantum level conditions. What he observed he mostly got right. Just like what much of what we have observed will still stand down the road.

 

[Crazy Source]

That’s a no on the first question, which means it’s a no on every follow up question by default.

NO, I don’t think animals “care”.

Holy shit........you don't think animals care?

I owe. When I say that, I mean that I have done things that I regret. Beyond helping my immediate family, I have brought into my life cats and dogs. Old ones, young ones. They shit the floor and we learn to live together. I have taken in abused animals, and given them a home. They made a home for me. In the madness that is my life, these sweet creatures loved me. I've seen a few pass, and I will surely see more pass, as I will also one day.

Animals do care, Koro.

 

[shockaholic12]

Holy shit........you don't think animals care?

I owe. When I say that, I mean that I have done things that I regret. Beyond helping my immediate family, I have brought into my life cats and dogs. Old ones, young ones. They shit the floor and we learn to live together. I have taken in abused animals, and given them a home. They made a home for me. In the madness that is my life, these sweet creatures loved me. I've seen a few pass, and I will surely see more pass, as I will I one day.

Animals do care, Koro.

But if you put “ “ around care do they still “care”?

 

[Crazy Source]

But if you put “ “ around care do they still “care”?

I am loved grammar police be damned. Are you?

 

[Bob Gray]

Much of it has not been superseded. You are conflating that with new branches of science observing different conditions, like quantum level conditions. Just like what much of what we have observed will still stand down the road.

General relativity greatly expanded on things that wernt accurate about his thoughts on light and gravity. There's other stuff but we're quibbling over things that dont really matter. Im not saying his contributions werent profound, I'm saying they were limited by the capabilities of his time period, and as knowledge grew, gaps in the work were patched up or expanded upon. Because that's what happens. Thats the process. Thats the same process that will continue for the next few centuries, just like the centuries that preceded it. And the knowledge in the next few centuries will present massive changes to current concepts.

 

[shockaholic12]

General relativity greatly expanded on things that wernt accurate about his thoughts on light and gravity. There's other stuff but we're quibbling over things that dont really matter. Im not saying his contributions werent profound, I'm saying they were limited by the capabilities of his time period, and as knowledge grew, gaps in the work were patched up or expanded upon. Because that's what happens. Thats the process. Thats the same process that will continue for the next few centuries, just like the centuries that preceded it. And the knowledge in the next few centuries will present massive changes to current concepts.

expanded on. Did not supersede. His rules still apply in many instances and as you said are valuable, so it seems you agree with me that he is evidence our contributions will be seen as applicable and valuable down the road too.

 

[Intermission]

Was he an atheist before?

 

[Andy Capp]

Much of it has not been superseded. You are conflating that with new branches of science observing different conditions, like quantum level conditions. What he observed he mostly got right. Just like what much of what we have observed will still stand down the road.

Newton hasn't been superseded at all. The laws of motion and calculus have been added to but not invalidated. I said as much in an earlier post already. In fact, you could have saved some time with your responses above by just quoting my posts earlier in the thread. There seems to be no way to get through to these people. It's tiresome.

Edit: didn't see this post before I commented.

expanded on. Did not supersede. His rules still apply in many instances and as you said are valuable, so it seems you agree with me that he is evidence our contributions will be seen as applicable and valuable down the road too.

Of course, it will be applicable. Just like the case of Newton's work, the big bang theory may be expanded upon, perhaps incorporated into a broader framework at some far flung time in the future, but it will not be invalidated.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Newton hasn't been superseded at all. The laws of motion and calculus have been added to but not invalidated. I said as much in an earlier post already. In fact, you could have saved some time with your responses above by just quoting my posts earlier in the thread. There seems to be no way to get through to these people. It's tiresome.

Edit: didn't see this post before I commented.

Of course, it will be applicable. Just like the case of Newton's work, the big bang theory may be expanded upon, perhaps incorporated into a broader framework at some far flung time in the future, but it will not be invalidated.

Just like Newtonian Mechanics, GR and QM will likely be seen as approximations of a deeper, more unified framework. I really doubt though that we'll ever be able to see empirically what happened before the Planck time after the Big Bang. If we can't find something testable then much of the unified theory will exist in Metaphysics/Philosophy and not science.

 

[Koro_11]

Animal can’t provide care for another?

Not trying to be a dick but that’s the dumbest thing I’ve heard in a minute. Ever heard of caring for their young?

Care (verb)
look after and provide for the needs of.

A caring act is an act that provides for others. Obviously animals are capable of this. And caring acts are moral. Since you stated that a caring act being a benefit to society doesn’t stop it from being moral the logic follows animals can be moral.

Care
(Verb)

feel concern or interest; attach importance to something.

Why would an animal risk its life to protect another in its social circle if it was not capable of feeling concern, interest, or attach any importance to it? You’re not making any sense here

Putting the word in quotes doesn’t change what it means.

Ok, as long as you're not "trying" to be a dick.

 

[Koro_11]

We are not special.

Not trying to be a dick but this is the dumbest thing you said on this thread.

Not special at all, meanwhile building spaceships while no other species has even got to primitive stone tools.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Agreed. Basically, slavery was considered socially acceptable before the 19th century all over the world, and we would in all likelihood think it was OK if born back then. Morals are socialized.

Slavery is still considered socially acceptable by posters on this message board provided the slaves are incarcerated first.

 

[shockaholic12]

Ok, as long as you're not "trying" to be a dick.

No tap out would be complete on sherdog without a gif. They’ve become the pouty white flag around here

 

[Koro_11]

No tap out would be complete on sherdog without a gif. They’ve become the pouty white flag around here

Nah, the tap out came from you when you could no longer stand someone disagreeing with you and you had to resort to insults.

 

[shockaholic12]

Not trying to be a dick but this is the dumbest thing you said on this thread.

Not special at all, meanwhile building spaceships while no other species has even got to primitive stone tools.

We are not special in the context of judging a member of its society for aggression and violence, which was the topic of your post.

Your post had nothing to do with technology. Blurting out “bu bu but spaceships” in the middle of all this makes me think you might be having a stroke.

 

[shockaholic12]

Nah, the tap out came from you when you could no longer stand someone disagreeing with you and you had to resort to insults.

I made fun of you statement because it was dumb. You didn’t even try to defend it so it seems you agree.

I’m sorry that putting words in “ “ while showing a clear lack of understanding of their definitions is dumb but it just is.