Jiri is Nothing More than a Bigger, Longer, More Athletic, Keith Jardine. You Know I'm Right.

[Sukuri Aoki]

Look me in the eyes and tell me I'm wrong. That is exactly what Jiri is.

Dude has made it to the highest levels of MMA purely off of aggression, athleticism, an 80 inch reach, and being "herky jerky" with weird movement.

In the fight game, nothing beats technique. Jiri does not have elite striking. Period. You are not going to beat an elite striker, in the stand up, if you don't have elite striking. Period. End of story. That is how Poatan is doing this to "elite" "top level" mixed martial artists over and over again.

I said in very plain language before UFC 300 - Jammuh Hall is a journeyman compared to Alex. Jammuh Hall has been such an embarassment since UFC 300 that his fanbase has completely vanished, but there were scores of fans saying he was going to destroy Alex. Not even fucking close.

Same thing with this fight. Scores of sherdoggers were pulling for Jiri.

Read my lips - you are never going to beat an elite world class striker, in the striking game, with journeyman level striking skills

It sounds like such a "duh, obviously" statement, but it seems that gigantic swathes of MMA fans do not understand this elementary concept. They are so used to such a dogshit caliber of striking from MMA fighters, that they see an elite world class striker, and a polish guy twitching and jerking and moving in odd ways with wild flashy elbows, and they go "these things are the same to me!!" Embarrassing man. Embarrassing for the MMA fandom and embarrassing that the caliber of striking skill in the UFC is just so awful.

Alex coach(Plinio, the fat guy) has been saying for quite some time now that in his opinion Alex has faced tougher competition in Glory. I don't disagree with him.

 

[linvillegorge]

I think TS is onto something. They're both white dudes that fight at LHW and are primarily stickers.

 

[don't ask]

6'0 with a 73 inch reach competing at 205 with visible fat around his waist. I understand the impulse to keep using this example, but its pretty bad when you spend 5 seconds thinking about it. Gokhan Saki would be a mid to small size middleweight. It is not shocking to me that he didn't do well at light heavyweight with a 73 inch reach, at 6 foot, with visible belly fat.

CroCop was an elite kickboxer for his day. Prime for prime - Poatan would starch Mirko. Mirko didn't really have great boxing skills or defense.

Both of these fighters show you mechanisms by which a journeyman can beat an elite striker. Are you unable to recognize that?

 

[dmwalking]

Oh right. Because finish rate is the end all be all when comparing the technique of fighters. Form and technique don't matter. Fighter comparison starts and stops with looking at finish rates! lmaoo

Did you know that Naoya Inoue is EXACTLY like Alex Pereira?! They both have a high finish rate!!! Hurrrrr durrr durrr

So at least you can acknowledge that Jiri isn't an elite striker.

I like the stories of individuals in this sport. I also enjoy the diversity of skillsets. Striking is not everything in MMA. I also enjoy when the truly elite fighters appear that are able to clean up the absolutely fucking laughable "talent" in this sport.

Yeah - the last two champions at light heavyweight are favorable easy match ups.

He just knocked out the two previous LHW champions back to back. He cleaned out LHW. He KO'd the dominant years long champ at MW, and he brutally KO'd the guy that went on to easily dethrone that same dominant years long champ. Who should he have fought at MW that would've given him a hard time? Vettori? Cannonier? LOL

You’re really bad at debating. I just pointed out that you ignored that guy’s point. But it seems that by your own admission, you watch mma like a wwe fan. You’re in it for the drama, mostly.

But no, Jardine didn’t have as good a record, striking accuracy, power, versatility. Their awkwardness is pretty much the only comparison.

As far as cleaning up a division, beating the champ doesn’t mean you cleaned the division. It means you beat the champ. And yeah, he’s mostly fought guys who want to stand with him. Only one dominant champ. Jiri was not dominant. Hill was a paper champ.

Be more objective. Get your emotions out of it.

 

[Hdfi]

1. That has nothing to do with the similarities in their striking game
2. Jardine competed during the golden age of LHW when it was stacked with incredible talent. Jiri won the belt after Jones vacated and during a time when the talent pool at 205 was at its lowest point in 20 years.

Jardine wouldn't even be a LHW by today's standards. Too small.

 

[wildchild88]

6'0 with a 73 inch reach competing at 205 with visible fat around his waist. I understand the impulse to keep using this example, but its pretty bad when you spend 5 seconds thinking about it. Gokhan Saki would be a mid to small size middleweight. It is not shocking to me that he didn't do well at light heavyweight with a 73 inch reach, at 6 foot, with visible belly fat.

CroCop was an elite kickboxer for his day. Prime for prime - Poatan would starch Mirko. Mirko didn't really have great boxing skills or defense.

Prime for prime?

I'm not sure about that, Mirko was a murderer in K1..

You could favour Alex, but starch is going a bit too far. Both are extremely powerful, fast twitch, and both are KO'able.

 

[don't ask]

I don't completely agree with TS, but he's kinda got a point.

LHW is pretty shitty these days, Jamahal Hill's striking is a sloppy mess. He's just not a world class striker (and he won the title with his striking).

Jiri would get murdered in kickboxing.

Also Jiri won the title in an extremely sloppy fight with a washed 43 year old.

His grappling is mediocre as well. Skill level has really dropped off in the division, guys are just big and powerful that's it.

The only reason Jiri's fight with Glover was a barnburner was because Jiri kept throwing himself on the ground like a potato. I have no idea what to think about Jiri, but in the few fights I've seen him in... I have no idea how he's won so often.

 

[dmwalking]

Both of these fighters show you mechanisms by which a journeyman can beat an elite striker. Are you unable to recognize that?

Nah, he’s an emotional thinker. Getting him to address his opinion objectively requires a level of humility, logic, and intellectual honesty that he’s demonstrated his not yet capable of. Maybe one day. But for now, he needs to “feel” right, even when proven wrong.

 

[blackheart]

The only reason Jiri's fight with Glover was a barnburner was because Jiri kept throwing himself on the ground like a potato. I have no idea what to think about Jiri, but in the few fights I've seen him in... I have no idea how he's won so often.

Athleticism, size, reach and unpredictability.

 

[blackheart]

Prime for prime?

I'm not sure about that, Mirko was a murderer in K1..

You could favour Alex, but starch is going a bit too far. Both are extremely powerful, fast twitch, and both are KO'able.

Absolutely. Cro Cop was 1 of the 3 fighters that got me into MMA. But he never had good boxing.

 

[Ramon Antonio]

Gokhan Saki was 6'0 with a 73 inch reach fighting at light heavyweight with visible fat around his waist. Why don't you tell me????

That’s more reach and same height as Roy Nelson, and he was knocking dudes out at HW.

 

[blackheart]

Jardine wouldn't even be a LHW by today's standards. Too small.

Yeah, the size of the average fighter has increased across most, if not all, divisions in the last 20 years. But that says nothing about the depth of the talent in that division.

Do you really think the talent pool is as deep or deeper today, than when you had Rampage, Chuck, Shogun, Forrest, Tito, Machida, Rashad...?

 

[wildchild88]

The only reason Jiri's fight with Glover was a barnburner was because Jiri kept throwing himself on the ground like a potato. I have no idea what to think about Jiri, but in the few fights I've seen him in... I have no idea how he's won so often.

Yeah, I mean a big part of his success has been that he's strong and powerful, his style would never work otherwise.

He's been rocked and tagged a lot in the fights he's won, having faith in his chin to carry him through.

That said, don't want to be too disrespectful, just putting his career into perspective with other eras.

LHW is not currently a skilled division.

 

[wildchild88]

Absolutely. Cro Cop was 1 of the 3 fighters that got me into MMA. But he never had good boxing.

Maybe so, but his skillset put him in the mix during the most competitive era in HW kickboxing history. Shark tank, murderers row.

Starch is too far.

 

[blackheart]

That’s more reach and same height as Roy Nelson, and he was knocking dudes out at HW.

Different eras and weight classes. Also, heavyweight has always been the poorest division in MMA in regard to technique and skill level. That's why someone like Derrick Lewis can get a title shot but if you took that dude's attributes and skills and put them in a lightweight fighter, he would have never even made it in the UFC. But at heavyweight, ay baby that's a title contender right there!

 

[BowserJr]

Wow, what a compelling argument. I can tell you put a lot of time into that and you really addressed the specific things that I said!

This sport does suck. That's why an 11-2 pro is cleaning up entire divisions. The level of striking talent compared to elite boxers and kickboxers is absolutely fucking laughable.

James Toney did great in UFC

 

[don't ask]

Yeah, I mean a big part of his success has been that he's strong and powerful, his style would never work otherwise.

He's been rocked and tagged a lot in the fights he's won, having faith in his chin to carry him through.

That said, don't want to be too disrespectful, just putting his career into perspective with other eras.

LHW is not a skilled division.

UFC has a few trainwreck divisions that really make me miss the past.

 

[blackheart]

Maybe so, but his skillset put him in the mix during the most competitive era in HW kickboxing history. Shark tank, murderers row.

Starch is too far.

You're right. Starch is too far. I'm confident Poatan would have beaten him though. But Cro Cops legs were the ultimate wild cards.

 

[smart.feller]

I hadn't thought of it, but I can see the similarities. I still remember Houston Alexander uppercutting Jardine to the moon.

Can we now refer to Jiri as Keith Jirdine?

 

[blackheart]

James Toney did great in UFC

I too recall James Toney's multiple fights in the UFC, as well as his years long effort to make the transition and put in the time to learn grappling.

Wait...that is what in this reality, right?