Indiana sheriff says he needs MRAPs cause of Afghan/Iraq vets who turn to crime.

[Scrody]

Two bombs go off and you're ok with them rolling a MRAP through neighborhoods ordering people out of their homes at gunpoint?

It was just an ongoing domestic terror attack, no biggie right? Didn't even kill that many people. Why are you so against the MRAP? Do you feel the US government is going to turn tyrannical overnight and start using these things everywhere?

 

[Scrody]

Well they have to be armed to the teeth. Who knows what could happen.

Righteo. Might as well start using Abrams tanks. Maybe lease some F22 to the local law enforcement.

 

[Rob Battisti]

It was just an ongoing domestic terror attack, no biggie right? Didn't even kill that many people. Why are you so against the MRAP? Do you feel the US government is going to turn tyrannical overnight and start using these things everywhere?

It bothers me that people are so quick to allow that kind of power to the federal government. It's unlawful and it should bother you too.

Dude, an Indiana Sheriff wants one. You tell me?

 

[MicroBrew]

It was just an ongoing domestic terror attack, no biggie right? Didn't even kill that many people. Why are you so against the MRAP? Do you feel the US government is going to turn tyrannical overnight and start using these things everywhere?

The Bostom bombings weren't that big in the scheme of things. What was it, 3 people died and several injured? Not like it was OKC city or armed Branch Davidians running rampage.

How on earth did the US survive the 80s and 90s without MRAPs . This is total overkill and just a status symbol , toy and intimidation tool for LEOs. More and more LEOs are starting to resemble the Army, and that isn't a good thing for civilian rule.

 

[Scrody]

It bothers me that people are so quick to allow that kind of power to the federal government. It's unlawful and it should bother you too.

Dude, an Indiana Sheriff wants one. You tell me?

The federal government has had this power for awhile. We have no one but ourselves to blame for the current state of things in the US. Hundreds of local law enforcement agencies are getting these. What is your exact problem with police having a bomb proof truck?

 

[Scrody]

The Bostom bombings weren't that big in the scheme of things. What was it, 3 people died and several injured? Not like it was OKC city or armed Branch Davidians running rampage.

How on earth did the US survive the 80s and 90s without MRAPs . This is total overkill and just a status symbol , toy and intimidation tool for LEOs. More and more LEOs are starting to resemble the Army, and that isn't a good thing for civilian rule.

Well no shit, but are cops expected to just charge into situations without proper protection? If the two bombers had killed more people, would you be okay with it then?

 

[Rob Battisti]

The federal government has had this power for awhile. We have no one but ourselves to blame for the current state of things in the US. Hundreds of local law enforcement agencies are getting these. What is your exact problem with police having a bomb proof truck?

If you're saying we have no one to blame but ourselves...

Why would you try and silence those who oppose it then? Shouldn't we be blaming you?

 

[Scrody]

If you're saying we have no one to blame but ourselves...

Why would you try and silence those who oppose it then? Shouldn't we be blaming you?

I'm...not trying to silence anyone. You're entitled to your opinion, its America. Just give me one solid reason why police shouldn't have an MRAP.

 

[Rob Battisti]

The threat that an MRAP is designed to overcome is so minuscule that the cost/benefit ratio is unsustainable. Furthermore, I'm uncomfortable with armored vehicles being allocated in small markets where that threat is entirely nonexistent.

I don't realistically fear that the government will turn heel overnight and roll these things down every street in America. I'm also not under any illusion that BB is watching and its possible that what was once a minor offense can turn into something much more major down the road.

Seeing the response in Boston bothered me. It should bother all Americans.

 

[Scrody]

The threat that an MRAP is designed to overcome is so minuscule that the cost/benefit ratio is unsustainable. Furthermore, I'm uncomfortable with armored vehicles being allocated in small markets where that threat is entirely nonexistent.

I don't realistically fear that the government will turn heel overnight and roll these things down every street in America. I'm also not under any illusion that BB is watching and its possible that what was once a minor offense can turn into something much more major down the road.

Seeing the response in Boston bothered me. It should bother all Americans.

You were bothered by law enforcement agencies collaborating with eachother, minimizing casualties and catching the bombers? It doesn't matter if the threat is nonexistent, its the reason cops pack ARs now instead of. 38 specials. It only took one shootout where the cops were undergunned for that to happen. Same with these MRAPs.

 

[MicroBrew]

Well no shit, but are cops expected to just charge into situations without proper protection? If the two bombers had killed more people, would you be okay with it then?

How did cops handle bombings in the past? Not like Boston was the 1st; there have been pipe bombings in the past.

In the past Cops have had armored vehicles for SWAT teams, they don't need something as large as those MRAPs they are fielding now. Why would they need an MRAP against 2 guys on the run . If there was a chance the guys were fielding RPGs or had grenades I could see a reason but that wasn't the case.

Also bombings like the Boston one are exceedingly rare.

 

[MicroBrew]

You were bothered by law enforcement agencies collaborating with eachother, minimizing casualties and catching the bombers? It doesn't matter if the threat is nonexistent, its the reason cops pack ARs now instead of. 38 specials. It only took one shootout where the cops were undergunned for that to happen. Same with these MRAPs.

So your logic is that all cops everywhere must field equipment for a situation that 99.9% of them will never expereince because as long as there is even an infitesimaly small chance of a situation exsisting then cops should equip themselves for it. I wonder how much money would be wasted if other government workers thought the same way.

 

[Scrody]

How did cops handle bombings in the past? Not like Boston was the 1st; there have been pipe bombings in the past.

In the past Cops have had armored vehicles for SWAT teams, they don't need something as large as those MRAPs they are fielding now. Why would they need an MRAP against 2 guys on the run . If there was a chance the guys were fielding RPGs or had grenades I could see a reason but that wasn't the case.

Also bombings like the Boston one are exceedingly rare.

Weren't the bombers throwing homemade explosives from their vehicle when police were in pursuit? The MRAP isn't good for a job like that, but when the suspects are confined to an area and it's known they have explosives? It wouldn't seem unnecessary. Matter of fact, if you were in the cops shoes I'd bet you'd be begging for one.

 

[Scrody]

So your logic is that all cops everywhere must field equipment for a situation that 99.9% of them will never expereince because as long as there is even an infitesimaly small chance of a situation exsisting then cops should equip themselves for it. I wonder how much money would be wasted if other government workers thought the same way.

Our government does feel the same way, that's why they're always advancing on weaponry. When was the last time we had a tank battle? Do the US army really need 8,000+ Abrams? The Bradley fighting vehicle delivered more casualties to the T 72s we faced in the Gulf War after all.

 

[IDL]

The fact that sheriffs want MRAPs says wonderful things about where our society is headed...

Big Brother has been watching, and has noticed that people are not safe enough.

 

[MicroBrew]

Weren't the bombers throwing homemade explosives from their vehicle when police were in pursuit? The MRAP isn't good for a job like that, but when the suspects are confined to an area and it's known they have explosives? It wouldn't seem unnecessary. Matter of fact, if you were in the cops shoes I'd bet you'd be begging for one.

Police didn't use MRAPs , it was just armored vehicles , of the sort police have had for decades. So why would they need MRAPs , what situation can you point to that requires them to have MRAPs. Why aren't the armored vehicles that Law enforcement departments have fielded all these years enough.

 

[MicroBrew]

Our government does feel the same way, that's why they're always advancing on weaponry. When was the last time we had a tank battle? Do the US army really need 8,000+ Abrams? The Bradley fighting vehicle delivered more casualties to the T 72s we faced in the Gulf War after all.

Well you are comparing land war overseas with domestic situation. In the Gulf War, the government expected there to be need for MBTs because Iraqis had a lot of them.

In the Iraq war, insurgents and Baathist allies had RPGs , IEDs and various other military explosives . Owing to the Humvvee not having enough protection they decided dedicated MRAPs would protect soldiers better than up-armored Humvees.

Can anyone honestly say LEOs here face anything remotely similar to the IED or RPG threat faced by American GIs in Iraq or Afghanistan.

 

[Scrody]

Police didn't use MRAPs , it was just armored vehicles , of the sort police have had for decades. So why would they need MRAPs , what situation can you point to that requires them to have MRAPs. Why aren't the armored vehicles that Law enforcement departments have fielded all these years enough.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't these MRAPs essentially gifts to the law enforcement agencies?

 

[Scrody]

Well you are comparing land war overseas with domestic situation. In the Gulf War, the government expected there to be need for MBTs because Iraqis had a lot of them.

In the Iraq war, insurgents and Baathist allies had RPGs , IEDs and various other military explosives . Owing to the Humvvee not having enough protection they decided dedicated MRAPs would protect soldiers better than up-armored Humvees.

Can anyone honestly say LEOs here face anything remotely similar to the IED or RPG threat faced by American GIs in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Absolutely not, there aren't armed factions running around in America. I was just pointing out that the government does have an excessive amount of hardware, and that mindset is in the civilian population as well as law enforcement. Using this argument you could say civilians shouldn't own semi automatic rifles because the odds of an average joe ever needing one are almost nonexistent. If that argument doesn't work on civilian ownership of firearms, it sure as shit ain't going to work on the police.

 

[MicroBrew]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't these MRAPs essentially gifts to the law enforcement agencies?

They are , but the Sheriff specifically stated he envisioned a threat posed by IEDs and military tactics from returning Vets who turn to crime.

Free or not they project an image of a militarized society. This sort of stuff desensitises people and that leads to an even more militarized society.