How do ITF TKD and WTF TKD sparring rules stack up VS....?

[HMCfan]

Disclaimer: Technically not a style vs style topic. No flaming. Healthy discussion only about the realism of these systems' rulesets. No, "OMGFGM LOL TKD SUCKERS THE BIG 0NE TEEHEE" is most definitely not appreciated.

I want to compare ITF TKD sparring rules and WTF TKD sparring rules with each other and each of these with Kyokushin Karate. I'm speaking in terms of realism.

ITF TKD vs WTF TKD:

ITF TKD Advantages: The arms do not dangle at the sides; head punching

ITF TKD Disadvantages: Semi-contact

WTF TKD Advantages: Full-contact

WTF TKD Disadvantages: Complete and utter ignorance of punching techniques; hands kept at sides; emphasis on speed leads to less powerful kicks

X-Factor: Just how "semi-contact" is ITF TKD? All the vids I've seen are pretty crazy; punching allowed in iTF TKD but their punching technique is god awful

ITF TKD's ruleset vs WTF's. Which is better for developing better standup fighting skills? Don't give me the "it's all about the practitioner". Let's have a healthy discussion. WTF's full contact but negligence of punching or ITF's punching and good guard but semi-contact? Just how "semi-contact" is ITF anyway? Looks like those guys are hurting each other.


ITF TKD rules vs Kyokushin Karate rules:

ITF TKD advantages: head punching albeit with horrible technique

ITF TKD disadvantages: semi contact; a side stance instead of a more frontal stance; no leg kicks; improper punching technique

KK advantages: the full contact with no pads allows for toughness; leg kicks; good punching technique

KK disadv: body punches only

X-factors: how "semi-contact" is ITF TKD?; how often do ITF guys even punch to the head?; KK's body conditioning and rock hard toughness needs to be considered

How does ITF TKD's sparring ruleset stack up against Kyokushin's? Which, generally speaking, consistenly produces more effective fighters? Let's have a healthy discussion on this also


WTF TKD vs KK:

WTF adv: more time spent on kicks therefore more kicking dexterity

WTF disadv: piss poor guard; side stance; too much jumping and hopping around; NO punching to speak of

KK adv: full contact with no gear which means good conditioning and a high lvl of realism; good punching

KK disadv: almost none, except for the fact that they probably spend a little bit of less time on kicking

X-factors: I've seen several KK vs WTF TKD clips. Even though the the KK won in each of them, it was by a slim margin and the WTF TKD guys were holding their own. With a bit of crosstraining it might be worth considering that TKD may be on par with KK.

Thoughts?

 

[Noskill]

Muerto?

 

[woogie12]

Just because KK doesn't allow punches to the head in sparring doesn't mean they don't know how to punch to the head.

KK>TKD, especially the way you have it spelled out in your thread. KK seems like much more of a real fighting experience in your explanation, which holds true.

 

[Tim Chan]

itf rules really vary a lot. some comps do fc, some sc, some nc(easy to figure out the abreviations). they may not allow much hand combos or something.

 

[pollo loco]

Muerto?

haha, I thought the same thing...that damn annoying bastad!

 

[Lightfoot]

Like Tim said, several ITF tournaments are full contact. Since ITF is less widespread (ie NOT an olympic event) there's more leeway with it's sparring regulations. The same can be said for some Kyo offshoots too, like Daidojuku (which has face punching if I recall and throws/takedowns).

That said I'm not really sure what you're asking. Are you trying to choose one style to train over the others or what?

 

[aaron_mag]

ITF TKD is basically karate. I've worked out with several shotokan guys and they are basically the same. KK is basically FC karate. So they are all the same thing trained to a higher (IE more contact without equipment) degree.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

WTF tournament rules suck balls, at least the ones Ive been to, not necessarily saying they all are like that.

 

[SlamPage911]

WTF rules are the only rules that are the official rules of Olympic TKD. So if you want to fight in the Olymics you'd better get used to WTF rules.

They're the only sanctioning body. ITF are the reject WTF members.

 

[aaron_mag]

WTF rules are the only rules that are the official rules of Olympic TKD. So if you want to fight in the Olymics you'd better get used to WTF rules.

They're the only sanctioning body. ITF are the reject WTF members.

Ha ha..you're probably too young to even remember the 1984 Olympics. Granted, I was a teeny bopper at the time.

But I remember the debate. Many ITF types could have and did switch over to WTF at that time. There were others, however, who could not stand the new ruleset. Especially since most of it was basically designed to placate the IOC. As I recall one of the requirements was that TKD differentiate itself from boxing. At least that was the rumor mill at the time. Thus the loss of punches in TKD.

At any rate, even back in 1984, there were people who could not stand the new olympic rules. They were hardly 'reject WTF members'.

But I will say that the olympics hurt the ITF style bad. One style became the norm and the other bound for extinction.

 

[Kyryllo]

WTF rules are the only rules that are the official rules of Olympic TKD. So if you want to fight in the Olymics you'd better get used to WTF rules.

They're the only sanctioning body. ITF are the reject WTF members.

Uhh.. no, but... no. Please research.

 

[Kyryllo]

Ha ha..you're probably too young to even remember the 1984 Olympics. Granted, I was a teeny bopper at the time.

But I remember the debate. Many ITF types could have and did switch over to WTF at that time. There were others, however, who could not stand the new ruleset. Especially since most of it was basically designed to placate the IOC. As I recall one of the requirements was that TKD differentiate itself from boxing. At least that was the rumor mill at the time. Thus the loss of punches in TKD.

At any rate, even back in 1984, there were people who could not stand the new olympic rules. They were hardly 'reject WTF members'.

But I will say that the olympics hurt the ITF style bad. One style became the norm and the other bound for extinction.

You mean the 1988 olympics. And the competition rules of WTF have this form from the early 70s, what the WTF brought in in favor of the IOC were the head gear and the shin/arm guards.

 

[SlamPage911]

Uhh.. no, but... no. Please research.

Uhh, yes, but yes.

Check the Olympic regs first.

 

[aaron_mag]

You mean the 1988 olympics. And the competition rules of WTF have this form from the early 70s, what the WTF brought in in favor of the IOC were the head gear and the shin/arm guards.

Oh dammit. You're right. 1988. What I'm remembering is tournaments that used to have big banners back in 1981 through 1988 where they would have these huge celebratory words: "We support Seoul as the host of the Summer Olympic games..." Korean community was going nuts (including ITF) and to those of us under korean masters it felt like Seoul hosted the damn thing for 9 years straight.

I did not know the Olympic sparring rules were in place since the 70s. As I mentioned in my post above we'd just hear rumors and gossip (as in: "They are changing this or that to differentiate it from boxing..."). There was no internet then. You got your information by reading Black Belt magazine in the aisle of Safeway while you waited for your mom to finish shopping.

 

[Kyryllo]

Uhh, yes, but yes.

Check the Olympic regs first.

Why should I do that? How should it help you support your wrong assumption what the ITF is?


PS. I don't have to check the regs, I know more TKD olympians personaly than you could imagine.

 

[Kyryllo]

Oh dammit. You're right. 1988. What I'm remembering is tournaments that used to have big banners back in 1981 through 1988 where they would have these huge celebratory words: "We support Seoul as the host of the Summer Olympic games..." Korean community was going nuts (including ITF) and to those of us under korean masters it felt like Seoul hosted the damn thing for 9 years straight.

I did not know the Olympic sparring rules were in place since the 70s. As I mentioned in my post above we'd just hear rumors and gossip (as in: "They are changing this or that to differentiate it from boxing..."). There was no internet then. You got your information by reading Black Belt magazine in the aisle of Safeway while you waited for your mom to finish shopping.

The first WTF World Championships were held in 1973 and had formaly the same rules as today but the only protective gear was the chest protector filled with bamboo sticks. How ever the techniques that were used differed from todays', round houses to the body were a rare sight, axe kicks, side kicks and hook kicks were the norm. People got KOd left and right.

 

[Kyryllo]

Here are some pickshurz fr0m zee guhd 0l' tym3z.

 

[Toujourpret]

There was no internet then. You got your information by reading Black Belt magazine in the aisle of Safeway while you waited for your mom to finish shopping.

*sniff* ahh the memories.

 

[Lightfoot]

There was no internet then. You got your information by reading Black Belt magazine in the aisle of Safeway while you waited for your mom to finish shopping.

Haha! After just spending some time in the HW forums I'm kinda missing those days.

 

[blanko]

Just because KK doesn't allow punches to the head in sparring doesn't mean they don't know how to punch to the head.

KK>TKD, especially the way you have it spelled out in your thread. KK seems like much more of a real fighting experience in your explanation, which holds true.

yea but their ability to punch to the head has nothing to do with their Kk training. And btw... in real fighting people swing at your head. Professional fighters punch you in your face, drunk untrained punks punch at your head.