Herb made a bad call in Michal/Holland

[djason1988]

While Michal probably should have tapped, he didn't, and Herb prematurely stopped the fight because he thought Michal was reaching to tap. The arm had already "popped" well before he actually stopped it, but herb let it continue, and then they claimed it he stopped it because of the armbar. "Technical submission". He just misread it, and he's gotten a pass for it.



At this level, the ref doesn't get to stop the fight because he thinks you might be hurt. Look at literally any of Rouseys armbars, or the jones/vitor one, or several other subs. If they don't tap, and are still concious, the fight goes on. We've seen multiple fighters continue with severe joint/limb damage, even aside from subs. Fighters getting their foot or hand broke, blowing their knee out, etc. Stopping a fight due to injury is a doctor's call.



Don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying Michal would have won, or that not tapping was the right thing to do, but rather just pointing out that it's kind of crazy that Herb blatantly made a bad call and nobody is saying anything about it.

EDIT: I can see I rustled some jimmies, so let me clarify. My point is that we need some consistency. Too many times we've seen guys get mangled and be allowed to continue, so either every tight sub or serious injury should be a ref stoppage or none of them should. Fighters are constantly getting broken bones and torn ligaments, yet they rarely call for a stoppage. Even just looking at armbars, we have hardy/gsp, ferguson/oliviera, half of rouseys fights, etc.

 

[Portland8242]

Yes, herb's a dumbass. There was no physical or verbal tap, you're not his life advisor, you're the fucking ref. People will understand if you don't stop it if there's no tap.

 

[kingghidrah]

The guy's arm had snapped, and he pathetically reached over to touch his own hand, in a motion that looked like a tap, he was done and it was time to stop it.

Other fights have been stopped because fighters touch their own injured face pathetically, it's a sign that you can't and shouldn't continue when you're trying to tend to your own injuries.

By your logic Silva vs. Weidman 2 shouldn't have been stopped since Silva didn't tap

 

[Doctor Grudge]

No..a broken arm from a submission is a technical submission. That's why there is a term called technical submission, that is the standard call not the exception.

Fighters may go with popped shoulders from throwing a punch, but you hardly ever see people with broken limbs in compromised positions continuing. There is a difference between popping your shoulder while in a neutral standing position, and having your limbs torn up while you are pinned down in a submission.

You almost certainly cannot win a fight if you have only one arm, that is why it is a technical stoppage. It is no different then people who are new to MMA asking why fights are stopped when someone takes a lot of punches but is still conscious.

 

[sonhow]

If the arm snaps the fight is done. At that point it has nothing to do with his desire to continue. He shouls have tapped before it snapped anyway.

 

[djason1988]

The guy's arm had snapped, and he pathetically reached over to touch his own hand, in a motion that looked like a tap, he was done and it was time to stop it.

Other fights have been stopped because fighters touch their own injured face pathetically, it's a sign that you can't and shouldn't continue when you're trying to tend to your own injuries.

By your logic Silva vs. Weidman 2 shouldn't have been stopped since Silva didn't tap

That's retarded, Silva literally couldn't stand. Thiago Santos fought jones 5 rounds with a blown out knee. Should that have been stopped? Brown broke his foot in like, the first kick he threw the other night. Should that have been stopped? How many fighters have broken their hands punching? Should all those have been stopped? Michal was moving his arm fine after the fight, and has already stated that it wasn't broken. He had some joint damage for sure, but many fighters have been allowed to fight through that.

 

[djason1988]

No..a broken arm from a submission is a technical submission. That's why there is a term called technical submission, that is the standard call not the exception.

Fighters may go with popped shoulders and things like that, but you hardly ever see people with broken limbs in compromised positions continuing.

You almost certainly cannot win a fight if you have only one arm, that is why it is a technical stoppage. It is no different then people who are new to MMA asking why fights are stopped when someone takes a lot of punches but is still conscious.

His arm never broke. He's already released statements saying such.

 

[blaseblase]

At this level, the ref doesn't get to stop the fight because he thinks you might be hurt. Look at literally any of Rouseys armbars, or the jones/vitor one, or several other subs. If they don't tap, and are still concious, the fight goes on.

That's for a choke you imbecile. Breaks and dislocations are referee stoppages.

 

[djason1988]

That's for a choke you imbecile. Breaks and dislocations are referee stoppages.

Somebody never watched rousey bend miesha Tates arm double.

 

[MEAN357]

No he didn't.


/thread

 

[blaseblase]

Somebody never watched rousey bend miesha Tates arm double.

Dumb post. Tate got out and continued to fight. Dude's arm snapped.

 

[djason1988]

Dumb post. Tate got out and continued to fight. Dude's arm snapped.

His arm never broke, he said as much, and arms almost never break from an armbar. They attack the joint.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

His arm never broke, he said as much, and arms almost never break from an armbar. They attack the joint.

That's just being semantic. His arm was clearly disabled and he was in a position he couldn't get out of. The fight is over.

 

[Neck&Neck]

Herb saved the man’s life
Fighter safety is a thing
*except when he knee drops guys and does the HD slide

#GoodGuyHerb

 

[humperdoo]

If Herd didn't step in, the injury is going to be career-ending and Miuchal may not be able to fight again. I don't think that's something he would want to happen. So it is best that Herb stopped it.

 

[Ramon Antonio]

That's for a choke you imbecile. Breaks and dislocations are referee stoppages.

Jack Madellena beat Gilbert Burns with a broken arm. So clearly a broken arm doesn't stop you from fighting.

 

[Morris88]

The guy's arm had snapped, and he pathetically reached over to touch his own hand, in a motion that looked like a tap, he was done and it was time to stop it.

Other fights have been stopped because fighters touch their own injured face pathetically, it's a sign that you can't and shouldn't continue when you're trying to tend to your own injuries.

By your logic Silva vs. Weidman 2 shouldn't have been stopped since Silva didn't tap

Pretty sure Silva screamed in pain, that's a verbal submission. Joe Warren also has one.

 

[scytheavatar]

If Herd didn't step in, the injury is going to be career-ending and Miuchal may not be able to fight again. I don't think that's something he would want to happen. So it is best that Herb stopped it.

The injury is probably already career-ending, torn ligaments are harder to recover from than broken bones.

Oleksiejczuk is fucked and that's a good thing, people like him who are too stupid to tap have no business learning MMA.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

Michel brazillian tapped.
@KazDibiase you have a gif of that moment?

 

[Banana Tree's Nemesis]

His arm never broke, he said as much, and arms almost never break from an armbar. They attack the joint.

I hope my version is still up to date, but the literal phrasing of the rules is "Technical Submission: When a legal submission act results in unconsciousness or broken/dislocated bone(s)/joint(s)."
A dislocated elbow warrants a stoppage. I would guess that's what happened here. He was visibly not able to use his arm properly when the fight was stopped.
I thought it was a rather good stoppage.