"Hard-Working American" Myth

[Doodies]

There should be. However, workers can't lobby in Washington. What people do not understand is this didn't happen by accident. The drop in the middle class, Free Trade Agreements, deregulation of industries etc was coordinated by CEOs of major corporations in the 70s. They got together and decided to triple their lobbing in Washington. The decline of the middle class happened shortly after...early 1980s.

http://billmoyers.com/content/the-powell-memo-a-call-to-arms-for-corporations/

So how do you combat something like that, when both parties seem culpable, although democrat slightly less then republicans. voting seems futile and with right to work laws becoming more and more popular, even organizing labor is unlikely. What options do people have.

 

[OldGoat]

Yes, unions, the social safety net, science and better access to health care are "liberal wizardry and trickery" used to "buy votes" according to many republicans.

Science includes economics? If so I think it's the left who ignores science.

 

[kpt018]

I tried looking back (maybe I didn't go back far enough) what was the site you provided?

This is the main site:

http://www.bls.gov/

The link I provided above pulled a spreadsheet that had productivity and hourly wage data.

 

[kpt018]

Science includes economics? If so I think it's the left who ignores science.

Ok, you got it, troll!

 

[CableandThanos]

This is the main site:

http://www.bls.gov/

The link I provided above pulled a spreadsheet that had productivity and hourly wage data.

and where in this link does it state that we are working more hours than in the past. If you can get the chart post it please.

 

[HIMBOB]

Spoken as someone who has never nor will ever run or manage anything.

Seriously, you refute that statement?

Explain the problem with it then.


"If you business can't support the workers it needs to operate it's a shit business and it should die as soon as possible."


If a business consumes more than it produces it generates a net loss and detracts from everything around it.

 

[LucasWithLidOff]

Seriously, you refute that statement?

Explain the problem with it then.


"If you business can't support the workers it needs to operate it's a shit business and it should die as soon as possible."


If a business consumes more than it produces it generates a net loss and detracts from everything around it.

How is GM doing these days? Tell that to Obama.

 

[HIMBOB]

How is GM doing these days? Tell that to Obama.

He hasn't been taking my calls.



First up, that statement I made is a little oversimplfied but the message is basically every business should improve the society it is within.


As to GM.
Car manufacturers have several benefits besides employing people directly, flow on industries (parts), military security to have active manufacturing on the main land to name a few.

Because of these issues the business's should receive government support if losing them would cost more than supporting them.

This same theory should be used for anything which provides a greater good for the society beyond its ability to generate profit.

 

[ben236]

Seriously, you refute that statement?

Explain the problem with it then.


"If you business can't support the workers it needs to operate it's a shit business and it should die as soon as possible."


If a business consumes more than it produces it generates a net loss and detracts from everything around it.

Define "support."

 

[HIMBOB]

Define "support."

Ranging from things like Tax breaks and favourable finance conditions (like guarantees) to straight out giving them money.

 

[LucasWithLidOff]

He hasn't been taking my calls.

Figures. That asshole has a God complex.

 

[ben236]

Ranging from things like Tax breaks and favourable finance conditions (like guarantees) to straight out giving them money.

I meant in the context of your quote. Businesses don't give out tax breaks to it's workers.

 

[HIMBOB]

I meant in the context of your quote. Businesses don't give out tax breaks to it's workers.

No the government should.

Not sure about the US but here if you work for a Not For Profit you can get favourable tax treatment.

 

[ben236]

No the government should.

Not sure about the US but here if you work for a Not For Profit you can get favourable tax treatment.

Let's try this again...

You said this:

"If you business can't support the workers it needs to operate it's a shit business and it should die as soon as possible."

Define support in the context of this quote. You are referring to business here and make no mention of government. So what do you mean by business supporting it's workers? Support in what way and to what extent?

 

[kahiljabroni]

Ive worked some brutal labor jobs including dishwashing...cleaning and degreasing enormous 100 year old machines not to mention the bathrooms of a machine shop...painting houses. .and my favoite insullation (all types in all weather) So I feel like Im kinda an expert on the subject.
Personally due to my pride/work ethic I've outworked just about all my coworkers and despite getting raises at each job up to the point whrre I was making 40k/yr at my last labor job I spent almost every hour of my day plotting how to get improve my position in this world. I have demanded serious raises and got them...branched out on my own as a contractor and finally went back to school and I'm one yearaway ftom BA in accounting.

Funny thing is...with very few exceptions...the guys I worked with were content....they hated school..didn't want to do trade school or start biz...they wanted to stay forever. Oh yeh..I also built fences. Point is..if u have aspirations u will advance if don't u will not.
Funny thing is the more content they were the lazier they were...the type tgat does just enuff to not get fired.

 

[HIMBOB]

Let's try this again...

You said this:

"If you business can't support the workers it needs to operate it's a shit business and it should die as soon as possible."

Define support in the context of this quote. You are referring to business here and make no mention of government. So what do you mean by business supporting it's workers? Support in what way and to what extent?

As I said it was an over simplification.

"the message is basically every business should improve the society it is within".

If it provides enough for its employees to live its good.
If it provides services to the community that are worth more than the cost it creates its good.

For many companies paying your workers enough to live is enough, that business helps its community.

However there are some entities that create value for which they are not directly compensated, in such instances the government should provide them with support.
This is not walmart and Maccas, but charities and not for profits.

 

[ben236]

As I said it was an over simplification.

"the message is basically every business should improve the society it is within".

If it provides enough for its employees to live its good.
If it provides services to the community that are worth more than the cost it creates its good.

For many companies paying your workers enough to live is enough, that business helps its community.

However there are some entities that create value for which they are not directly compensated, in such instances the government should provide them with support.
This is not walmart and Maccas, but charities and not for profits.

You're all over the place and still haven't provided me with an explanation of what you mean by a business supporting it's workers.

And every business DOES improve the society it is within. If they didn't they wouldn't be in business for long. And other than volunteers, most charities have employees who earn salaries.

 

[ABACA]

And every business DOES improve the society it is within. If they didn't they wouldn't be in business for long.

This type of nonsense is a sign that you've just received your first copy of Free to Choose. Please try to replace unqualified slogans with actual analysis from now on.

Thanks.

 

[ben236]

This type of nonsense is a sign that you've just received your first copy of Free to Choose. Please try to replace unqualified slogans with actual analysis from now on.

Thanks.

It's not a very complex analysis that's required. People buy goods/services from businesses because they believe it will benefit them whether it be in the long term or short term. Otherwise they wouldn't have bought the good/service.

I'm not sure what you don't understand.

 

[OldGoat]

Ok, you got it, troll!

Yeah when 1/2 the country disagrees with you it makes the idea a trollish one... I mean if all your pathetic argument consists of is "you meanie troll you meanie" I think you've sort of lost the debate.

Whatever you do please don't call me a meanburger... stinkburger or w/e your Dear Leader uses as an insult.