Law Gun and Gun Control News/Discussion

[spamking]

By your own data over 50% of guns used in crimes were purchased legally. So obviously to say it's not the biggest contributing factor when it's over half the source is not honest.

Dude. Every gun is legally purchased at some point. I'm not debating that. The point I'm discussing is how many times it's the actual initial, legal purchaser who is also found to have committed the criminal act.

Simply purchasing the gun isn't the issue.

 

[Rational Poster]

Dude. Every gun is legally purchased at some point. I'm not debating that. The point I'm discussing is how many times it's the actual initial, legal purchaser who is also found to have committed the criminal act.

Simply purchasing the gun isn't the issue.

Yeah, it's how "law abiding" gun owners handle their guns in the after market, correct. It's the majority of the issue.

 

[spamking]

Yeah, it's how "law abiding" gun owners handle their guns in the after market, correct. It's the majority of the issue.

It's not against the law to sell a firearm privately in the majority of states. It is against the law to sell to a known felon. This data doesn't state that privately sold firearms are the root cause of our crime issues.

 

[Rational Poster]

It's not against the law to sell a firearm privately in the majority of states. It is against the law to sell to a known felon. This data doesn't state that privately sold firearms are the root cause of our crime issues.

Well no shit it's not the root cause of crime, it is however the root cause for the supply of firearms used in crimes.

 

[spamking]

Well no shit it's not the root cause of crime, it is however the root cause for the supply of firearms used in crimes.

Legal private sales or private sales where folks knowingly sell to prohibited possessors? To me, those aren't the same thing.

 

[Rational Poster]

Legal private sales or private sales where folks knowingly sell to prohibited possessors? To me, those aren't the same thing.

Sure there is a distinction to be made, but the practical reality is that there is no difference when it comes to the gun actually being used in a crime.

 

[spamking]

Sure there is a distinction to be made, but the practical reality is that there is no difference when it comes to the gun actually being used in a crime.

Okay, but in order to deal with the issue you need to make those differences very distinct and not essentially fall prey to blaming the existence of a gun for the crime. As many people do.

 

[Rational Poster]

Okay, but in order to deal with the issue you need to make those differences very distinct and not essentially fall prey to blaming the existence of a gun for the crime. As many people do.

I'm blaming the people involved not the gun, so not sure what you're on about.

 

[spamking]

I'm blaming the people involved not the gun, so not sure what you're on about.

I never said you were. I was pretty clear that many do though.

That's what I'm "on about".

 

[Rational Poster]

I never said you were. I was pretty clear that many do though.

That's what I'm "on about".

If you want to talk about something else with someone else, feel free.

 

[spamking]

If you want to talk about something else with someone else, feel free.

 

[jlagman]

Yeah, it's how "law abiding" gun owners handle their guns in the after market, correct. It's the majority of the issue.

Ah yes, the gun controll's dream of a perpetual daisy chain of guilt and blame where every gun owner should be liable for any misdeeds that any future owner commits with it.

 

[Rational Poster]

Ah yes, the gun controll's dream of a perpetual daisy chain of guilt and blame where every gun owner should be liable for any misdeeds that any future owner commits with it.

I don't think I would go that far, depends on the level on negligence I suppose, but perhaps some regulations on aftermarket sales can be put in place to curtail the supply of guns used in crimes. There's no uniformity between the states on the issue. Some states ban aftermarket sales, some require a 3rd party, and in others a foreigner can literally buy an assault rifle from a meth addict in a Walmart parking lot.

 

[spamking]

I don't think I would go that far, depends on the level on negligence I suppose, but perhaps some regulations on aftermarket sales can be put in place to curtail the supply of guns used in crimes. There's no uniformity between the states on the issue. Some states ban aftermarket sales, some require a 3rd party, and in others a foreigner can literally buy an assault rifle from a meth addict in a Walmart parking lot.

I wasn't aware that there were states that banned private sales. I thought those that were trying to regulate them more required the sale to go through an FFL to complete a BGC. I assume that's what you mean by going through 3rd party? Foreigners can buy whatever they want from the right person in any state. Even those that have implemented strict regulations on private sales.

This isn't really enforceable without a Federal registry.

 

[Rational Poster]

I wasn't aware that there were states that banned private sales. I thought those that were trying to regulate them more required the sale to go through an FFL to complete a BGC. I assume that's what you mean by going through 3rd party? Foreigners can buy whatever they want from the right person in any state. Even those that have implemented strict regulations on private sales.

This isn't really enforceable without a Federal registry.

Yeah I was going to add might there, I don't know if any actually went through with banning aftermarket sales.

Also, not true, other countries make due with just local registries.

 

[Belaya Smert]

Well no shit it's not the root cause of crime, it is however the root cause for the supply of firearms used in crimes.

The goal of its release is to help police and lawmakers reduce gun violence.

One of the big problems highlighted is what Deputy Attorney General Lisa O. Monaco described as the “epidemic of stolen guns.”

The report shows that from 2017 to 2021, there were more than a million guns reported stolen, with nearly all, 96% stolen from private citizens.


Meh meh private sales

 

[Rational Poster]

The goal of its release is to help police and lawmakers reduce gun violence.

One of the big problems highlighted is what Deputy Attorney General Lisa O. Monaco described as the “epidemic of stolen guns.”

The report shows that from 2017 to 2021, there were more than a million guns reported stolen, with nearly all, 96% stolen from private citizens.


Meh meh private sales

Yeah gun theft was up, but the data confirmed that they still make up a minority of guns found used in crime.

Would it not be better to make sure that stolen guns make up a majority of guns used in crime if you actually have an honest intention of reducing gun crime?

 

[spamking]

Yeah I was going to add might there, I don't know if any actually went through with banning aftermarket sales.

Also, not true, other countries make due with just local registries.

How is that not true? What good is a local registry? It won't prevent folks from doing something people complain about now and buying in another state.

 

[Rational Poster]

How is that not true? What good is a local registry? It won't prevent folks from doing something people complain about now and buying in another state.

Because you just go to the local precinct where it originated and ask about it when it's found used in a crime in another state.

 

[spamking]

Because you just go to the local precinct where it originated and ask about it when it's found used in a crime in another state.

Earlier you mentioned how BGCs were just an exercise . . . what makes you believe the data behind a local registry would be any better/more valid? Not every person participating in a private sale will submit data to update the registry. While a registry might have owner info, it would likely be 2-3 owners behind.

Many local law enforcement agencies won't be able to enforce it due to a lack of staff and other priorities.