Social Gender ideology is dying, common sense prevailing

[UberHere]

what policies specifically to you support/oppose regarding tans people. I cannot figure out what most of anyone in this thread actually thinks.

To me it’s a non issue until trans women were allowed to compete in women’s sports. Also anyone with a dick shouldn’t be surprised when they’re not wanted in women’s spas, changing rooms, etc.

 

[terrapin]

I don't hate you. But I do strongly disagree with you about bathrooms. It's an absurd, unenforceable policy.

that is not an argument though....

I have listened to both sides. I think social norms ought to be maintained and segregation based on sex ought to be maintained. I do not think it should be "enforced" except though social norms that stem from safeguarding. if a person passes then they pass and nobody will notice and nobody ought to be checking id's at the door.

beyond that I would support laws making new building required to have third spaces or single use bathrooms where gender does not matter. I don't think that's a ton of extra cost or burden on businesses and gov buildings and that convenience is good for everyone anyway. I know I loved single use bathrooms when my daughter was young and I had to enter the bathrooms with her.

 

[UberHere]

that is not an argument though....

I have listened to both sides. I think social norms ought to be maintained and segregation based on sex ought to be maintained. I do not think it should be "enforced" except though social norms that stem from safeguarding. if a person passes then they pass and nobody will notice and nobody ought to be checking id's at the door.

beyond that I would support laws making new building required to have third spaces or single use bathrooms where gender does not matter. I don't think that's a ton of extra cost or burden on businesses and gov buildings and that convenience is good for everyone anyway. I know I loved single use bathrooms when my daughter was young and I had to enter the bathrooms with her.

If I were going to open a public business, I’d just have a bunch of single stall unisex bathrooms. I’m surprised we don’t see more of these by now.

 

[Crazy Source]

Depends on the context. In athletic contests, they absolutely need to. In romantic relations also. Otherwise it’s no one’s business.

Tuck, then fuck. Got it, Sailor.

 

[terrapin]

To me it’s a non issue until trans women were allowed to compete in women’s sports. Also anyone with a dick shouldn’t be surprised when they’re not wanted in women’s spas, changing rooms, etc.

have you been accused of bigotry or of wanting to erase trans peoples existence for holding those views?

are those really all of your views on it as far as policy? what about misgendering people? what is your view on that topic?

 

[Crazy Source]

that is not an argument though....

I have listened to both sides. I think social norms ought to be maintained and segregation based on sex ought to be maintained. I do not think it should be "enforced" except though social norms that stem from safeguarding. if a person passes then they pass and nobody will notice and nobody ought to be checking id's at the door.

beyond that I would support laws making new building required to have third spaces or single use bathrooms where gender does not matter. I don't think that's a ton of extra cost or burden on businesses and gov buildings and that convenience is good for everyone anyway. I know I loved single use bathrooms when my daughter was young and I had to enter the bathrooms with her.

I think you are trying to skirt authoritarian laws, while being fine with it.

That's why I have issue with you.

 

[Ares Black]

that is not an argument though....

I have listened to both sides. I think social norms ought to be maintained and segregation based on sex ought to be maintained.

But how? Who determines if someone looks feminine enough to use the women's room? What about really masculine women or old ladies with hormonal imbalances?

It's literally fucking impossible to enforce without violating people's rights.

I do not think it should be "enforced" except though social norms that stem from safeguarding. if a person passes then they pass and nobody will notice and nobody ought to be checking id's at the door.

Then what is the point of legislation?

beyond that I would support laws making new building required to have third spaces or single use bathrooms where gender does not matter.

Absolutely, especially in public spaces.

I don't think that's a ton of extra cost or burden on businesses and gov buildings and that convenience is good for everyone anyway. I know I loved single use bathrooms when my daughter was young and I had to enter the bathrooms with her.

They are so much better.

 

[Ares Black]

I think you are trying to skirt authoritarian laws, while being fine with it.

That's why I have issue with you.

It does seem a little disingenuous TBH

 

[Ares Black]

If I were going to open a public business, I’d just have a bunch of single stall unisex bathrooms. I’m surprised we don’t see more of these by now.

I gotta say, it feels a little weird to completely agree with you.

 

[UberHere]

have you been accused of bigotry or of wanting to erase trans peoples existence for holding those views?

are those really all of your views on it as far as policy? what about misgendering people? what is your view on that topic?

I think the decent thing to do is address people as they wish to be addressed (as I do), but there shouldn’t be any government mandates requiring people to do so.

And you know the answer to that first question. Many people who publicly spoke out on trans women in women’s sports have been attacked as bigots and “terrible people”. That kind of approach does trans people a huge disservice.

 

[Crazy Source]

@UberHere Stepped up on this one. Solid dawg.

 

[Koro_11]

But in the real world I am in the right side of history.

Whenever people tell me "no one really believes in that nonsense" I need to introduce them to you. You're like a living caricature of the most radical leftie simp most of us imagine aren't even real.

 

[Crazy Source]

Sad fellow, @Koro_11 Loves focusing on penises.

 

[Ares Black]

Whenever people tell me "no one really believes in that nonsense" I need to introduce them to you. You're like a living caricature of the most radical leftie simp most of us imagine aren't even real.

You should. They might actually learn something.

 

[Crazy Source]

Whenever people tell me "no one really believes in that nonsense" I need to introduce them to you. You're like a living caricature of the most radical leftie simp most of us imagine aren't even real.

You have a puncher's chance buddy. Keep going.

 

[Seano]

But but but some woke guy at Yale told me that gender is fluid an two spirit is a thing.

Two spirit my ass. The same people would shit all over you for mentioning spirituality in any other context.

 

[Hog-train]

No dude, that's what I'm trying to tell you- that's called a meta study, which throws out the bad studies and keeps the more credible and combines them to get the general picture. That is NOT one study. You are wrong about long term satisfaction, and you don't know anyone from these communities, so you have no reference for how it generally is. I know people that have and have come across many on clinical environments that I've worked.

Several studies have investigated long-term satisfaction among individuals who have undergone gender-affirming surgeries, with follow-up periods extending beyond one year:

1. Systematic Review of Regret Rates: A comprehensive review analyzed 27 studies encompassing 7,928 transgender patients who underwent various gender-affirming surgeries. The findings indicated a pooled regret rate of 1% (95% CI <1%–2%). The review highlighted that advancements in surgical techniques and improved patient selection criteria have contributed to these low regret rates. americanjournalofsurgery.com+2pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov+2jamanetwork.com+2

Nowhere in your linked metastudy did they say they took out "bad studies."

In fact YOUR LINK, specifically says they included ALL the studies. AND they specifically said the majority of the studies were poor to fair.

"This tool ranks each article as “good,” “fair,” or “poor,” and with this, we categorized each article into “low risk,” “moderate risk,” or “high risk” of bias, respectively."

"Quality Assessment​

Based on the NIH quality assessment tool, the majority of article ranged between “poor” and “fair” categories.<a href="https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8099405/#R24">24</a> (See Supplemental Digital Content 2, which displays the score of each reviewed study. http://links.lww.com/PRSGO/B599.)"

1. Long-Term Satisfaction Post-Mastectomy: A cross-sectional study surveyed 139 individuals who had undergone gender-affirming mastectomy between 1990 and 2020, with a median follow-up of 3.6 years. Participants reported high satisfaction levels, with a median satisfaction score of 5 on a 5-point scale, and minimal regret, with a median decisional regret score of 0 on a 100-point scale. jamanetwork.com

This is only talking specifically about mastectomies. That is not relevant because we have to include hormones and genital surgery.

1. 40-Year Follow-Up Study: A study published in 2022 examined long-term outcomes of individuals who underwent gender-affirming surgery over a 40-year period. The research demonstrated sustained high patient satisfaction, improved gender dysphoria, and reduced mental health comorbidities persisting decades after surgery, with no reported patient regret. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

This is for adults. Irrelevant.

These studies collectively suggest that individuals who undergo gender-affirming surgeries generally maintain high levels of satisfaction and low regret rates in the long term, extending well beyond one-year post-surgery.

AGAIN, the problem with most of these studies is that the FOLLOW UP is TOO SHORT and they're talking about adults.

We have to isolate any "regret studies" to when they TRANS KIDS and take out any adult studies.

In short, we need LONG TERM STUDIES on when they trans kids. No one has a problem with adults transitioning. They're adults, they can do whatever they want.

If you want to discuss kids having trans surgeries, I would love to discuss that with you. That has ZERO to do with consenting adults having surgeries though.

No one has a problem with adults transitioning.

Low Regret rates for adults is completely irrelevant to the debate we're having in society - which is about KIDS doing this shit.

Gender-affirming surgeries among minors in the United States are exceedingly rare. A study analyzing data from 2016 to 2019 found that only 405 individuals aged 12 to 18 underwent such procedures, representing a small fraction of all gender-affirming surgeries performed during that period. jamanetwork.com

1. It doesn't matter if it's rare or not. It's still wrong. And if it is so rare, why do you care if it's banned?

2. We're not only talking about surgery. We're also talking about giving cross sex hormones which obviously leads to a whole bunch of physical changes such as infertility, loss of sexual function and all the other permanent changes.

Further research indicates that the majority of these surgeries among minors are chest-related procedures. A study reviewing a national pediatric surgical database identified 108 transgender minors who underwent gender-affirming surgeries between 2018 and 2021, accounting for approximately 0.04% of all transgender youth nationwide. Notably, about 95% of these surgeries were chest surgeries, and only 10 patients were under the age of 16. jamanetwork.comhrc.org

These findings underscore the infrequency of gender-affirming surgeries among minors in the U.S., with such procedures being performed sparingly and primarily involving older adolescents undergoing chest surgeries.

Irrelevant. Because again we're not only talking about surgery. We're talking about hormones and surgeries. The vast majority of the time, they go hand in hand.

Barely any JUST do surgery and not take hormones.

That isn't actually a real thing that happens in real life. Maybe some bizarre and tragic isolated incidents.

Denying trans youth access to life-saving treatment is absolutely reprehensible.

You just said they're not transing kids in real life and in the next sentence defend transing kids as life saving.

 

[EndlessCritic]

If you think gender ideology is dying, here's a Canadian decision from this week that you should read:

https://www.bccnm.ca/Documents/complaints/2025_03_13_BCCNM_Hamm_Decision.pdf

"The Position Statement asserts that “women’s and girls’ sex-based Charter rights must be strongly asserted and preserved in public policy” and “must take precedence over any concept of gender”. It is clear from the context of this statement that it intentionally excludes transgender women and girls which is discriminatory. The position that the Charter rights of biological women and girls should supersede the rights of transgender women and transgender girls is also discriminatory as it suggests that constitutional rights based on gender identity and expression have a subordinate status which is not the case."

 

[terrapin]

But how? Who determines if someone looks feminine enough to use the women's room? What about really masculine women or old ladies with hormonal imbalances?

It's literally fucking impossible to enforce without violating people's rights.

Then what is the point of legislation?

Absolutely, especially in public spaces.

They are so much better.

you ask how like its not being done already and has not for years and years. its not enforced but it is maintained by social norms and always has been. I don't believe there is any issue with how at all man. when you add trans you use the same seamless system we've already been using. and the same legislation with allowances for trans people who pass. I think its not difficult or complicated especially as we implement third spaces.

I have even thought that special allowances for trans people to use employee restrooms wherever possible ought to be implemented. basically whatever measures need to be taken to ensure that trans people are safe should be taken.

its men who are violent against trans people. I just fundamentally disagree that this is a problem women should be forced to compromise with or deal with. its dumping the problem of male pattern violence the onto women. I will never agree to that solution but will gladly support all other measures to ensure safety for trans people. especially when those measures are good for everyone else anyway.

on the one hand we are told that this issue is really important by the left but on the other no one wants to fund it or take serious measures to protect them beyond dumping the problem onto women and girls.

I disagree with that fundamentally.

 

[MMA IAN]

About the lower rate of regret, i've no idea, i've to trust your data, im skeptical that it's like you're saying, but i hope it's nonthless.

If you cut off your dick and balls then realised you shouldnt have and were asked if you regret it.... would you admit it?