Tech Gaming Hardware discussion (& Hardware Sales) thread

Sales persisting after Year 1 is very normal. You're reading into a trend that doesn't exist. GTX 1660 sales fell because it was almost entirely replaced by 1660 Super, whereas 1650 Super sold in tandem with 1650 for prebuilds.

I forgot to include 1660, it did 160K through last year in prebuilds, it wasn't a big mover since Nvidia didn't want to cannibalize too many 2060 sales for OEMs. The comparison for assessing 75W TAM isn't 1650 vs 1660 it's 1650 vs 1660 and 2060. And that wasn't close, regardless of how great a value the 1650 was.

So in this case, the Steam figures sort of line up, but almost all of the Steam GPU rankings are well within MOE and useless.
Thought so. Just admit you summed sales of multiple 1660 cards in comparison to the 1650 for its launch year. It can't have shitty sales both before and after COVID, yet come out eye to eye with the bestselling GTX 16 or RTX 20 selling cards. And the irony is the 1650 was an afterthought of aging tech unlike the market-leading 1050 Ti and other >75W cards before it. This was when NVIDIA stopped caring. Yet it still sold well. So, yes, there's an appetite.
It's not only what Nvidia wants, it's what US partners want to sell. No one wants to go sub 75W GPUs in their prebuilds in 2025, there's no margin worth chasing there. And as I mentioned, the lower VRAM variants for 3050 and 3060 were supply limited.

The basic market analysis mistake you're making here is that this mythical horde of gamers who want 75W GPUs didn't hold off on buying new GPUs. They just bought the next tier up, they haven't' been waiting for 5 years to upgrade to a product that doesn't exist anymore. And those in the 60 tier moved to 70, it's been fairly clear in sell-out the past two years.
Nobody dreamed up a "mythical horde". I observed there has been a strong appetite for this historically, one with signs and complementary fundamentals that persist today, such that the most common card among steam users has been a >75W card at multiple points in the past. You were ignorant of this. It's a market worth pursing.
It would have to be an entirely new die, that's a ridiculous R&D expenditure. The main appeal of Battlemage is they exist whereas Alchemist never hit high volume production -- this isn't to say that makes a difference, the Nvidia brand recognition is very real at this point.

And again, there's a basic math problem here. Intel is hitting 4060 performance levels at 150W or 180W with a die the size of Nvidia's 70 or 80 tier products. The roadmap was set out years ago, if that's the performance we're getting for Battlemage, the performance at 75W is likely to be pretty bad and worse than the mark they need to beat there (RX 7600ish) for SI's.
Of course they don't have the performance efficiency NVIDIA has. But what does it matter? NVIDIA isn't interested in competing down there. There's how they can win.

Because none of this matters. The simple question is this: do you think Intel's Battlemage strategy will work? If you do, you're wrong. It's going to fail. Some other angle must be tried.
 
Thought so. Just admit you summed sales of multiple 1660 cards in comparison to the 1650 for its launch year. It can't have shitty sales both before and after COVID, yet come out eye to eye with the bestselling GTX 16 or RTX 20 selling cards. And the irony is the 1650 was an afterthought of aging tech unlike the market-leading 1050 Ti and other >75W cards before it. This was when NVIDIA stopped caring. Yet it still sold well. So, yes, there's an appetite.
I didn't? Those sales numbers are exclusive to the GPU.

1650 sales were fine, but lagged behind the most important market segment, which Nvidia successfully targeted with multiple options.
Nobody dreamed up a "mythical horde". I observed there has been a strong appetite for this historically, one with signs and complementary fundamentals that persist today, such that the most common card among steam users has been a >75W card at multiple points in the past. You were ignorant of this. It's a market worth pursing.
There was also a strong appetite for hard drives or AIOs at one point. Markets change. Again, toss out a TAM estimate for 75W GPUs. It's telling you can't or won't.
Of course they don't have the performance efficiency NVIDIA has. But what does it matter? NVIDIA isn't interested in competing down there. There's how they can win.

Because none of this matters. The simple question is this: do you think Intel's Battlemage strategy will work? If you do, you're wrong. It's going to fail. Some other angle must be tried.
You don't understand, Intel likely cannot make a 75W GPU with -50 level performance on a technical level, let alone economically. Look at how big their dies are as is.

And Battlemage's goal is to ultimately be a productive step on the way to a big APU product 5 or 10 years from now and to beef up datacenter chops. Any sales on the way are mostly just to convince leadership and shareholders that some revenue will come in on the way.

Arc's roadmap was set most of a decade ago, there was never a chance of pivoting to 75W GPUs after Alchemist's launch.

You forget this: the main customer for GPUs are system integrators, not gamers. And no major SI wants 75W GPUs.
 
I didn't? Those sales numbers are exclusive to the GPU.

1650 sales were fine, but lagged behind the most important market segment, which Nvidia successfully targeted with multiple options.
This is simple. If the GTX 1660 outsold the GTX 1650 by 4-to-1 in its launch year, but only 130K units compared to 230K units overall, then the GTX 1650 throttled it in COVID & post-COVID sales, and was therefore a respectable seller during that period. And the 1650 overall sales were obviously strong despite not being nearly as appealing as the 1050, 750, or other >75W cards before. If it "lagged behind", then so did ever other GPU that wasn't the 1660 Super.

The fact that $200-$300 has been the bestselling space for over a decade isn't news to anyone.
There was also a strong appetite for hard drives or AIOs at one point. Markets change. Again, toss out a TAM estimate for 75W GPUs. It's telling you can't or won't.
LOL, you don't understand the difference, do you? HDDs aren't as demanded because they were supplanted by SSDs which dropped to roughly the same price. Why buy the less for the same? Meanwhile, those office comps are still moving massive units on Amazon, and there is no cheaper a way to transform them into viable gaming comps than with a simple >75W GPU upgrade that can fit into the comp, and run with its PSU.
You don't understand, Intel likely cannot make a 75W GPU with -50 level performance on a technical level, let alone economically. Look at how big their dies are as is.
Your reading comprehension is clearly the poor one. It's easy to win a market segment that NVIDIA isn't interested in supplying.
And Battlemage's goal is to ultimately be a productive step on the way to a big APU product 5 or 10 years from now and to beef up datacenter chops. Any sales on the way are mostly just to convince leadership and shareholders that some revenue will come in on the way.

Arc's roadmap was set most of a decade ago, there was never a chance of pivoting to 75W GPUs after Alchemist's launch.

You forget this: the main customer for GPUs are system integrators, not gamers. And no major SI wants 75W GPUs.
Blah blah blah. You're evading the central conundrum. Do you think Battlemage's strategy will work? Do you think these cards are going to sell well?

Either you say yes, or you offer a better alternative strategy.
 
This is simple. If the GTX 1660 outsold the GTX 1650 by 4-to-1 in its launch year, but only 130K units compared to 230K units overall, then the GTX 1650 throttled it in COVID & post-COVID sales, and was therefore a respectable seller during that period. And the 1650 overall sales were obviously strong despite not being nearly as appealing as the 1050, 750, or other >75W cards before. If it "lagged behind", then so did ever other GPU that wasn't the 1660 Super.

The fact that $200-$300 has been the bestselling space for over a decade isn't news to anyone.
They wound down 1660 supply fast in favor of 1660 super and 1660 Ti. You'll see that in sell in modeling from that time period, as well as very clearly in sell out. Again, SI's and stores don't want to be selling 75W GPUs, whether on their own or in prebuilds. The margins and demand weren't there during pandemic, and they are definitely not there now.
LOL, you don't understand the difference, do you? HDDs aren't as demanded because they were supplanted by SSDs which dropped to roughly the same price. Why buy the less for the same? Meanwhile, those office comps are still moving massive units on Amazon, and there is no cheaper a way to transform them into viable gaming comps than with a simple >75W GPU upgrade that can fit into the comp, and run with its PSU.
Office comps don't move massive units. The used channel doesn't even move as much volume as office supply stores, which are already low volume in the grand scheme. The point was just as HDD's were surpassed by the market, so have 75w GPUs. There's just no appetite from them from CyberPower and iBuyPower. And if they won't buy something, a GPU manufacturer has no hope of selling volume.

The average gamer absolutely has no interest in building their own system, let alone repurposing a office supply chassis. You're making ridiculous claims with no actual hard data to back it up. That you think amazon best seller lists and the steam survey are accurate says enough.
Your reading comprehension is clearly the poor one. It's easy to win a market segment that NVIDIA isn't interested in supplying.
No it is not. GTX 1050 gamers haven't been holding out for 75W GPUs. They just bought up, to -60 tier cards or 500/600 tier cards. There aren't millions of gamers that have been waiting to buy, that's not how the mass market works.

You keep ducking because you realize you're in over your head. What do you think the TAM for 75W GPUs in the US is right now?
Blah blah blah. You're evading the central conundrum. Do you think Battlemage's strategy will work? Do you think these cards are going to sell well?

Either you say yes, or you offer a better alternative strategy.
I think it will provide valuable experience for iGPUs and some datacenter IP. Sales will be insignificant, however, as Intel doesn't have the technological prowess yet to hit 75W performance worth a damn at $150 or $200. GPUs are very hard to design and build, and it's much easier to scale up your architecture than it is to scale down.

Once again, classic MadMick handwaving. You keep insisting that Intel can do 75W GPUs that sell like hotcake even though at almost 200Ws they are only hitting 4060 level performance. There isn't the maturity to hit 75W and 4050 performance without absolutely getting murdered because Intel dies are gigantic still. I'm sure you just have this brilliant plan that for some reason all the brightest minds in the GPU industry couldn't fathom.
 
Once again, classic MadMick handwaving. You keep insisting that Intel can do 75W GPUs that sell like hotcake even though at almost 200Ws they are only hitting 4060 level performance. There isn't the maturity to hit 75W and 4050 performance without absolutely getting murdered because Intel dies are gigantic still. I'm sure you just have this brilliant plan that for some reason all the brightest minds in the GPU industry couldn't fathom.
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The 4050 isn't a 75W card. You don't possess the most basic grasp of the hardware you're discussing.
 
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The 4050 isn't a 75W card. You don't possess the most basic grasp of the hardware you're discussing.
I didn't said it did. I'm pointing out that RTX 4050 mobile level or Rx 7600 performance is the bare minimum performance you can offer these days for gaming PCs that sell well. So if you want to offer a 75W card in 2025, it has to have that level of performance. A level of performance Intel has yet to demonstrate the technical maturity for with GPUs.

Ergo you blathering on about how Intel is missing out on 75W cards is silly because they most likely can't produce a viable product that is 75W but perfomant enough for the market.
 
I wonder why the 7900 GRE is sold out everywhere. Maybe something to do with China?
 
I wonder why the 7900 GRE is sold out everywhere. Maybe something to do with China?
Its late in life cycle and AMD (like nvidia) has done a lot better job of demand planning this time.

Product briefings are this month so you'll probably get leaks on new GPUs soon.
 
Its late in life cycle and AMD (like nvidia) has done a lot better job of demand planning this time.

Product briefings are this month so you'll probably get leaks on new GPUs soon.
All the other AMD GPUs are still in stock at or below MSRP.
 
All the other AMD GPUs are still in stock at or below MSRP.
It had a smaller run than other SKUs and was never meant to be a global release. Like I said inventory management has been much better this time around and AMD doesn't want to camnabilize its upcoming launch sales.

Rx 7000 stock has been shrinking the past few months with really only huge reserves of entry level at this point since those are the only AMD GPUs that SI's buy in volume.
 
New Intel GPUs have gotten good reviews:



This channel was having issues though:

 


"Starfield not working is Intel doing you a favor." <lmao>



 
Well Nvidia and Jensen Huang will be presenting at CES 2025 and pretty much already through Zotec gaming reliable source who is Chinese based but have moved manufacturing to the Philippines where they have been granted traff free status through their relationship with the US to manufacture 5000 series boards. Zotec is already manufacturing in the Philippines through a partner in the Philippines. But what they have been saying is some pretty big news one is the card gets tons of new stuff related to power, cooling and various other items. But what was leaked out was GDDR7 generation with 32 gigs of VRAM. The board is also slightly larger then the 4090 and will come at first in two flavors just 5090 and 5090D. The amazing thing is you need 1200 watt power for just one 5090 that will alone draw 600Watts and the board will retail for rumor 2400 dollars or 1900 dollars depending on the source. Ether way likely going to be around 2800 when it gets to retailers lol.

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RTX-5090-5080-SPECS.png
 
"The 2090 was $2500 so the 5090 being only $2000 is a steal." - probably Nvidia
That's is why I said when it gets to retail starts to sell them it will be 2800 or more.

EDIT: I hear that the 5070 comes with 12 gigs VRAM that is BS Bad by Nvidia. Reason almost all new video editors will be using AI and will require you have at least 16 gigs VRAM. Meaning the 5080 will be minimum requirement that then meaning 1500 or so min to run new AI video editors.
 
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The amazing thing is you need 1200 watt power for just one 5090 that will alone draw 600Watts and the board will retail for rumor 2400 dollars or 1900 dollars depending on the source. Ether way likely going to be around 2800 when it gets to retailers lol.

prices will be even worse in canada.

anyone wanna buy a kidney?
 
That's is why I said when it gets to retail starts to sell them it will be 2800 or more.

EDIT: I hear that the 5070 comes with 12 gigs VRAM that is BS Bad by Nvidia. Reason almost all new video editors will be using AI and will require you have at least 16 gigs VRAM. Meaning the 5080 will be minimum requirement that then meaning 1500 or so min to run new AI video editors.

the 5070ti is expected to have 16 gigs.
 
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