Tech Gaming Hardware discussion (& Hardware Sales) thread

[Madmick]

Weird because they were fine earlier, also. What do you think about the RTX cards?

I'm still waiting until I see third party benchmarks, but so far, they look like overpriced bullshit trying to sell a gimmick pipeline.

 

[tramendous]

I'm still waiting until I see third party benchmarks, but so far, they look like overpriced bullshit trying to sell a gimmick pipeline.

Im looking for a card and 1080 ti is what im looking at but the 2080 is stronger and costs roughly the same. The prelim benchmarks shows its better.

 

[Madmick]

Im looking for a card and 1080 ti is what im looking at but the 2080 is stronger and costs roughly the same. The prelim benchmarks shows its better.

Is that so? Where are you able to pre-order the RTX 2080 right now?

1. You haven't seen trustworthy independent benchmarks for RTX 2080 performance in games
2. The RTX 2080 is debuting at $799 MSRP while the GTX 1080 Ti debuted at $699
3. The cheapest GTX 1080 Ti on PCPP right now, which isn't even a sale, is $629.
   
4. IGN has a pre-order guide page up for the new cards-- all of them at MSRP are out of stock (only the Founder's Edition at NVIDIA's home website appears to be available for $799)

In other words, if you're going to cite inflated post-crypto real world prices for the GTX 1080 Ti, then you're going to have to cite a real world price for this elusive RTX 2080.

Furthermore, this is a stupendously shortsighted metric for measuring the value of the RTX 2080. The GTX 1080 was significantly more powerful than the GTX 980 Ti, in terms of real-world gaming benchmarks, too, and yet it didn't inflate the MSRP of its respective predecessor by this margin. That's because the value (performance per dollar) is supposed to be increasing over time. That's why historically electronic components have depreciated immediately after release, always. I'll re-post from the last page:

MSRP

• RTX 2080 = $799 (September, 2018: +28 months)
  
• GTX 1080 = $599 (May, 2016: +20 months)
  
• GTX 980 = $549 (September, 2014: +16 months)
  
• GTX 780 = $499 (May, 2013: +14 months)
  
• GTX 680 = $499 (March, 2012: +16 months)
  
• GTX 580 = $499 (November, 2010)

It has a little to do with the Crypto market, and far more to do with a technological push-market. They're caught in the classic quandary, and they're the market driver (not AMD). NVIDIA anticipates the advent of VR taking over gaming, but software developers aren't going to waste time developing games for a market that doesn't exist because nobody's hardware can handle it. It's similar to electric cars, and the problem Elon and the auto industry has faced. You need demand to create the revenue in order to develop the new technology, and create the incentive for the market to build infrastructure around it, but nobody wants to buy it until it exists, so you lack the demand.

If you want to understand what is going on here I recommend-- as always-- Anandtech. The RTX cards are not about improving rasterization performance, and that's what actually matters to us gamers:
The NVIDIA Turing GPU Architecture Deep Dive: Prelude to GeForce RTX
He mentions anti-aliasing and how it was an absolute gimmick in the first generation. It took a long time before that hardware had enough market penetration, and processing power overhead, that developers really began to embrace it. Frankly, even today, I find anti-aliasing to be the least noticeable graphic effect that has the worst cost-to-perception ratio within most games' graphic settings. In other words, anyone who pays these prices for RTX video cards is essentially being plundered for R&D capital while this technology moves forward, and gains market penetration. It's like Vulkan or DX12. You're being charged a $200 upcharge for hardware that you're not going to use because games that harness it almost certainly aren't going to be around, meaningfully, for a half decade or more.

There's a reason you're seeing all these 4K benchmarks. It's the only genuinely attractive feature. If you're someone who wants to game at 4K the GTX 10 series just doesn't cut it. Otherwise, if at all possible, this is the generation of video cards to "skip", or at least avoid until your system can't handle a game you want to play, to your satisfaction, in which case it's time to get out and get what you need at the best price.

 

[jefferz]

The new GeForce RTX 2080 (Ti) series can finally be tested by reviewers, as the GeForce 411.51 driver has been released under NDA.
The new GeForce RTX 2080 is about to compete with the GeForce GTX 1080 Ti in Time Spy and Fire Strike performance benchmarks. We are looking at performance similar to stock GTX 1080 Ti. The results vary because the reference models are now overclocked (Founders Edition).

GeForce RTX 2080 in Time Spy

Spoiler

GeForce RTX 2080 in Time Spy Extreme

Spoiler

GeForce RTX 2080 in Fire Strike

Spoiler

Source: VideoCardZ

Source: VideoCardZ

 

[Madmick]

Source: VideoCardZ

Supposedly they obtained that leak of the official internal benchmarks, but yeah, can't trust anything. Even Videocardz is not having it:

Nvidia RTX 2080 reviews may not drop until September 19

The original NDA lifting dates for the various hardware options were said to be September 14 for the Turing architecture itself, September 17 for the RTX 2080, and September 19 for the RTX 2080 Ti. However, VideoCardz’s sources now suggest that the date for the 2080 has been pushed back to the 19th, meaning we’ll only learn of its performance capabilities on the same day as the 2080 Ti.

 

[jefferz]

Supposedly they obtained that leak of the official internal benchmarks, but yeah, can't trust anything. Even Videocardz is not having it:

Nvidia RTX 2080 reviews may not drop until September 19

NVLink is what I'm excited about this generation. It may lead to dual cards being a viable option again.

 

[90 50]

The sli thing is really getting to me, I think it might be the “cool factor” that makes me inclined to do it, but the lack of benchmarks and support for sli in programs is starting to make me hold off.

Realistically, my 970 is doing everything I need it too RIGHT now, but possibly not in the future.

I just realized my new video editing software doesn’t fully support gpu enhancement yet(my old software did thus the reason for me building a damn budget machine with a gpu). It’s supposed to in the future.

The value for used 980 Ti’s in my area are getting to the “stupid not to get one “ level, for how much stronger a 980 ti is vs a 970.

Then there is the sli part, I found TWO 980 ti’s with led sli bridge really cheap in my area. Got me thinking, damn that would be STRONG, but only in shit that supports it, and then guess what? I noticed 1070 ti’s are selling for too dang much more used in my area either. Get TWO of those! But then that puts me RIGHT AT used 1080ti prices when everything is said and done (I’d have to get an led sli bridge since the deals on 1070’s are all single for the one I want. ).

What I really need is a cpu, I put this rig together with local used parts on a good deal basis to test the low and high points of the build, and build up as needed.

But the dang deals on gpu’s right now have me focusing on them, even though right now I really don’t need one!

And the game I’m waiting for, it’s predecessor by a lot of reviews actually ran and looked better on an AMD card!! I would hate to shoot myself in the foot, and the one game I’m waiting for release to play runs better on amd and I just spent a heap of money on Nvidia stuff again!!!

But back to my earlier sentiment, is there a future for SLi(or cross fire) will there be more support in the future? Or is it a waste at this point with less and less programs and games optimized for it?


TWO 980’s would be cool, but would pull some power down!!
Two 1070’s would draw less power, cost a little more and might or might not be faster depending on application.

ONE 1080 ti, draws less power, and leaves room for adding another down the line if it’s needed or supported, but then what if Vega 64 performs better on the crap I really want to do!!!



ARG!!!

/nonsensical rant

 

[90 50]

NVLink is what I'm excited about this generation. It may lead to dual cards being a viable option again.

lol perfect timing I just went on a long sli rant.

How does Nvlink differentiate from an SLI bridge?
Is there any word on how it will work yet? From that video it almost acts like it won’t use pci-e and would need a new motherboard with NVlink??

Very interesting indeed

Thanks!!

 

[JoeyJoeJoeJr]

 

[90 50]

links look broken over here...

 

[Woldog]

NVLink is what I'm excited about this generation. It may lead to dual cards being a viable option again.

I remember when they said the same thing about the 10 series and its fancy SLI bridge that would make the top end cards worth using in SLI... which proceeded to be just as useless as regular SLI.

 

[90 50]

I remember when they said the same thing about the 10 series and its fancy SLI bridge that would make the top end cards worth using in SLI... which proceeded to be just as useless as regular SLI.

Yeah but sli isn’t really the fault of the hardware manufacturers, it’s the software developers for not optimizing their software for it as it looks to me.

Programs that do utilize sli and optimized for it, seem to really make it worth it, budget wise if say you are sitting there with a 980 ti, or 1070 or whatever and instead of getting a 2080, you buy one more of the same one and a bridge, either used or deep dispcount somewhere.

 

[Blayt7hh]

Yeah I don’t even read leaked benchmarks anymore. They’re always pure propaganda and making outrageous claims. If I had to guess I would bet that the new 2080 will be roughly equivalent to a 1080 Ti that performs better in games that supports its new technology.

Also intel wtf. Fire whoever is naming your product line

 

[Slobodan]

GTX 2080 and 2080ti reviews are in:

 

[jefferz]

 

[Madmick]

I'm watching the Linus vid right now, but here is some text-based coverage from one of the best:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...-a-tale-of-two-very-expensive-graphics-cards/

Spoiler

Yep, that's more in line with what I expected. The RTX 2080 is barely superior to the GTX 1080 Ti. Optimistically, it looks like it's going to be ~5% stronger (for +$100 more). Meanwhile, the GTX 1080 was ~30% stronger than the GTX 980 Ti (for -$100 less).

Overpriced bullshit, indeed. Unless you're desperate for the added frames to make an all-out 4K gaming experience viable...no reason to waste money on these.


*Edit*
LOL, I'm seeing synthetic benchmarks cited on Linus I've never seen before with any gaming card release. He's trying so hard to pretend there is a silver lining, here, even though the title of the video suggests his authentic opinion. Gotta maintain that relationship-- just business. Shill, my brother, shill. Godspeed.

Yep, good job, Linus, got to the end, and he's sitting down facing the camera talking to NVIDIA like this was Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. "Guys, this is bullshit." Spectacular.

 

[Madmick]

LOL, what the fuck is he talking about? How on earth could anyone try to spin those benchmarks positively? Timestamped



His roundup benchmark summary has the RTX 2080 1% better than the GTX 1080 Ti @1440p and @4K. Again, UserBenchmark shows the GTX 1080 as 28% superior to the GTX 980 Ti, and game benchmark roundup summaries like Techpowerup's put it closer to ~35% better than the GTX 980 Ti in real-world performance.

MSRPs

• GTX 980 Ti = $649
• GTX 1080 = $549
  +35%, 360 days later, -$100

• GTX 1080 Ti = $699
• RTX 2080 = $799
  +1%, 559 days later, +$100

This is a goddamn horrorshow-- a disaster of a release from a gamer point of view.

 

[Slobodan]

 

[jefferz]

LOL, what the fuck is he talking about? How on earth could anyone try to spin those benchmarks positively? Timestamped



His roundup benchmark summary has the RTX 2080 1% better than the GTX 1080 Ti @1440p and @4K. Again, UserBenchmark shows the GTX 1080 as 28% superior to the GTX 980 Ti, and game benchmark roundup summaries like Techpowerup's put it closer to ~35% better than the GTX 980 Ti in real-world performance.

MSRPs

• GTX 980 Ti = $649
• GTX 1080 = $549
  +35%, 360 days later, -$100

• GTX 1080 Ti = $699
• RTX 2080 = $799
  +1%, 559 days later, +$100

This is a goddamn horrorshow-- a disaster of a release from a gamer point of view.

I haven't had the time to sit down and dig into reviews yet. i've been able to scrub though a couple for benchmarks.
have you seen anything on what percent tariffs are being placed on these?

 

[90 50]

I'm watching the Linus vid right now, but here is some text-based coverage from one of the best:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...-a-tale-of-two-very-expensive-graphics-cards/

Spoiler

Yep, that's more in line with what I expected. The RTX 2080 is barely superior to the GTX 1080 Ti. Optimistically, it looks like it's going to be ~5% stronger (for +$100 more). Meanwhile, the GTX 1080 was ~30% stronger than the GTX 980 Ti (for -$100 less).

Overpriced bullshit, indeed. Unless you're desperate for the added frames to make an all-out 4K gaming experience viable...no reason to waste money on these.


*Edit*
LOL, I'm seeing synthetic benchmarks cited on Linus I've never seen before with any gaming card release. He's trying so hard to pretend there is a silver lining, here, even though the title of the video suggests his authentic opinion. Gotta maintain that relationship-- just business. Shill, my brother, shill. Godspeed.

Yep, good job, Linus, got to the end, and he's sitting down facing the camera talking to NVIDIA like this was Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. "Guys, this is bullshit." Spectacular.

I need to watch it again, but I noticed almost too late when they were chunking benchmarks up some had “ryzen test bench” and “intel” test bench.

The ones I caught before they stopped seemed to have the ryzen benchmarks on the 2080 ahead of the intel. I don’t know what intel processor they were running, possibly the best i7 6 core.

It’s a possibility, that the newer card NEEDS more cores to handle all it’s shit, and might be more impressive with a new I-9?

I have no idea, it was just something I caught a glance at and pondered.