Tech Gaming Hardware discussion (& Hardware Sales) thread

I wanna see the world's biggest block of copper that can passively cool the latest i9 and a GTX 3090.
 
Wendell from Level1Techs just came out with a great video with Jay Maynard talking about vintage main frames with lots of history. You might recognize Jay Maynard, he's Tron Guy!
 
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This thread is like the tree of knowledge.

I have gained so much useful information from you guys, it's opened up a new hobby for me.
 
Apple M1 Max GPU beats $6000 AMD Radeon Pro W6900X in Affinity benchmark
I know this isn't gaming hardware, but I'm simply in awe, and envious of Mac users. I'm bitter. I don't think they should have this. They don't need it!

Given, this is just a benchmark, and one specifically optimized for the Apple GPUs, but I thought I'd keep the forum abreast of just how impressive Apple's progress has been in the GPU space. Just look at the memory bandwidth on the M1 Max: 409.6 GB/s!!! The gaming world has been swooning over the Steam Deck with its quad-channel LPDDR5 RAM which runs at a pitiful 88.0 GB/s in comparison. FYI, that M1 Max memory bandwidth is also faster than the RTX 3060 (desktop version) and the RX 6700 XT, too.

In a freaking laptop. In an SoC.

You might be thinking it's like the i9 "-HK" processors that runs far too hot for anything but the most robustly cooled large laptops.
nope-no.gif


https://www.anandtech.com/show/17024/apple-m1-max-performance-review/3
See above. It's never pulling half the wattage from the wall as the i9-11980HK, and it's often around 1/3rd the draw. The highest the GPU itself drew at any point was 43W. The highest actual pull they could get for the SoC was 92W (the whole system was pulling 120W). For comparison, the Ryzen 7 5700G peaked just 5W lower at 87W.
In single-threaded workloads, Apple’s showcases massive performance and power advantages against Intel’s best CPU. In CineBench, it’s one of the rare workloads where Apple’s cores lose out in performance for some reason, but this further widens the gap in terms of power usage, whereas the M1 Max only uses 8.7W, while a comparable figure on the 11980HK is 43.5W.

In other ST workloads, the M1 Max is more ahead in performance, or at least in a similar range. The performance/W difference here is around 2.5x to 3x in favour of Apple’s silicon.
Click to expand...

Skip to the part about GPU performance in the M1 Max:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/17024/apple-m1-max-performance-review/6
You're reading that correctly. It's coming in at 10.6 TFLOPS. That's 6.6x the GPU processing power of the Steam Deck, or perhaps more fairly, since the true peak draw of the Steam Deck's SoC is probably around 46W, it's 5.2x the processing power of the iGPU in the R7-5700G mentioned above. That's how badly it's throttling the best PC APUs.


*Edit*
Cliffs--> To put it more simply, anyone can see from the gaming benchmarks that nobody is optimizing for ARM, but in terms of raw processing power:

Apple M1 Max: Level of Performance
  • CPU = R9-5950X
  • GPU = RX 6600 XT*
  • RAM = 3.89x the speed of DDR4-3600 in dual channel; 3.5x the speed of DDR4-4000 :eek::eek::eek:
*This is a desktop GPU, obviously. If comparing laptop GPUs, not desktop GPUs, once again supposing that Apple were as well optimized for gaming, it would probably perform a few percent below the RTX 3070 Mobile.

This is a nearly a PS5/XSX level of graphic power in a package of these dimensions:
full
 
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Before people start I just thought it was interesting.

 
Looks like AMD held the crown for one year:



The only benchmark i care about : )~
hob9r2tp7lx71.jpg
 
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KaNesDeath said:
Looks like AMD held the crown for one year:



The only benchmark i care about : )~
hob9r2tp7lx71.jpg
Click to expand...

Some of the gaming charts are downright eye-popping:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1704...ybrid-performance-brings-hybrid-complexity/13
127297.png


127281.png


That being said, the power consumption charts are pretty eye-popping, too:
power-stress.png


This is the most concerning chart I've seen. Steve didn't even address temps that I saw. In fact, all the press is highly positive, and nobody seems to be talking about this. Why? Temps are out of control. This chart is for Blender (i.e. not Prime95, not Furmark, not AIDA, not SPEC).
cpu-temperature.png



Per gaming fps averages-- even the 12600K is beating up the 5950X and 5800X:
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-12900k-alder-lake-12th-gen/15.html
relative-performance-games-1280-720.png


https://www.techspot.com/review/2351-intel-core-i9-12900k/
Average.png
 
12600 looks great, especially when the non-k and F models release along with the mid range motherboards.

12400 and 12500 series will be insanely popular as well. Should beat the 5600X but do so at a sub $200 price range which was the huge issue with the Ryzen 5000 series (never released the budget non-x model of the 5600, it was basically "spend 300 dollars for a 6 core cpu or get lost"). Huge reason why the 10400 and 10500 sold in record numbers, no competition
 
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560ti said:
12600 looks great, especially when the non-k and F models release along with the mid range motherboards.

12400 and 12500 series will be insanely popular as well. Should beat the 5600X but do so at a sub $200 price range which was the huge issue with the Ryzen 5000 series (never released the budget non-x model of the 5600, it was basically "spend 300 dollars for a 6 core cpu or get lost"). Huge reason why the 10400 and 10500 sold in record numbers, no competition
Click to expand...
The i5-12400 is going to be the no-brainer option for the masses, there's zero doubt.
 
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560ti said:
12600 looks great, especially when the non-k and F models release along with the mid range motherboards.

12400 and 12500 series will be insanely popular as well. Should beat the 5600X but do so at a sub $200 price range which was the huge issue with the Ryzen 5000 series (never released the budget non-x model of the 5600, it was basically "spend 300 dollars for a 6 core cpu or get lost"). Huge reason why the 10400 and 10500 sold in record numbers, no competition
Click to expand...
The locked i5 has been the P4P gaming king since the 8400.
 
Madmick said:
Some of the gaming charts are downright eye-popping:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1704...ybrid-performance-brings-hybrid-complexity/13
127297.png


127281.png


That being said, the power consumption charts are pretty eye-popping, too:
power-stress.png


This is the most concerning chart I've seen. Steve didn't even address temps that I saw. In fact, all the press is highly positive, and nobody seems to be talking about this. Why? Temps are out of control. This chart is for Blender (i.e. not Prime95, not Furmark, not AIDA, not SPEC).
cpu-temperature.png



Per gaming fps averages-- even the 12600K is beating up the 5950X and 5800X:
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-12900k-alder-lake-12th-gen/15.html
relative-performance-games-1280-720.png


https://www.techspot.com/review/2351-intel-core-i9-12900k/
Average.png
Click to expand...
It looks like the max safe temp for the i9 is advertised as 100C. The i9 11900K had a similar max safe temp. I'd give it one or two generations before they're going to be packaging their chips with liquid nitrogen CPU coolers lol.
 
adam199 said:
It looks like the max safe temp for the i9 is advertised as 100C. The i9 11900K had a similar max safe temp. I'd give it one or two generations before they're going to be packaging their chips with liquid nitrogen CPU coolers lol.
Click to expand...
Yes, that's been the TJM forever: since the 4th gen (it was 105C before then). That doesn't mean you want to be anywhere near that during everday use. Over 90C is a red line. Every other processor there is within the recommended range for hardware longevity.

And that isn't some scrub stock cooler, either. That's the Noctua NH-U14S: a 6-pipe, 165mm tall, 935g monster.
noctua_nh_u14s_1_2.jpg


Notice it shits on the Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO:
86754.png
 
Some results from the community made benchmark tool for CSGO:

ae1yrdu6wsx71.png
 
The following video is a fantastic back-to-the-basics video that I wish tech channels would do more often. It's tedious drudgery for them, but far more useful to us consumers than their whacky, fun-for-them projects that don't really answer any basic questions of value to an everyday PC builder or gamer.


I do feel a twange of suspicion. Because I find it very odd that the cable seller they name as the best is "Infinite". I'm not a cable guru, but I didn't know this brand. And they don't sell on Amazon or Best Buy. It's a dedicated cable-selling outfit with their own website.
https://www.infinitecables.com/

Meanwhile, who was named the worst manufacturer? The vaunted Monoprice. Now, it isn't inconceivable that Monoprice has rested on its laurels, and these sorts of videos might be the kind to expose a complacent giant like them. But it tickles my funny bone. Because Monoprice still isn't AmazonBasics or Insignia (of Best Buy). It doesn't move the volume they move. It's an esteemed brand on techie forums around the web filled with posters & lurkers who are just the type to watch channels like LTT. Infinite couldn't hope to displace Amazon or Best Buy. But they could challenge Monoprice to become the darling of techlords online. It just seems very convenient.

But that's a cynical tinfoil attitude. LTT makes gabs of money on views and the sweatshirts it pimps in the video itself. Couldn't be cheap to bribe them assuming they would even take a bribe. So it looks like we have a new player on the cable block.

And, as they remind you in the video, buy shorter cables if you don't need longer. You aren't just saving money. You're less likely to encounter failure, and their resistance is lower.
 
Madmick said:
The i5-12400 is going to be the no-brainer option for the masses, there's zero doubt.
Click to expand...

According to Pat 13th gen Intel will based on early testing reduce power draw by 20 percent and increase overall performance by 15 percent. So overall the performance bump is not much but the power draw will be reduced. Were it could get interesting is early 2023 when an entirely new design comes out "Raptor lake" that will seek significant gains in all the major areas they will also introduce a new technology that will do on chip power management that is very different then what chips use today.

https://www.techadvisor.com/news/pc-components/intel-raptor-lake-13th-gen-cpu-3803184/
 
My Spot said:
It's been that way since Coffee Lake.

<GinJuice>
Click to expand...
Based on MSRP, arguably, though I personally felt the R5-3600 was worth the premium over the i5-9400F, especially when you factored in the "motherboard tax" that used to exist with Intel. When considering actual prices, there were stretches where the R5-2600 and R5-1600AF blew out the other sub-$150 options.
 
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