International France apology after history textbook links CIA to 9/11

Like I said, you are arrogant cunt.

Wonder what side 3rd party readers would side with after reading this exchange.

I'm going to say that 99% of the planet is going to side with the person who isn't a 9/11 truther, regardless of how much I treat you like the pile of shit you are.

And if you don't see me in the WR until 9/11 threads, then maybe you should go to more threads. I'm in the WR and Mayberry pretty much every day.
 
I'm going to say that 99% of the planet is going to side with the person who isn't a 9/11 truther, regardless of how much I treat you like the pile of shit you are.

And if you don't see me in the WR until 9/11 threads, then maybe you should go to more threads. I'm in the WR and Mayberry pretty much every day.

Wrong again buddy.



Not even half agree with you.

Man that must be embarrassing to make such a bold claim, that was so easily debunked.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polls_about_9/11_conspiracy_theories
 
The argument was never that they don't have the ability to do it eventually. The point was that they were not prepared with armed jets at the time they needed them. The aircraft that were put in the air were given permission to take down the plane, but they weren't given the time necessary to have weapons techs draw ammunition, take it to the flight line, load it, and then get the jets into the air. The planes that went up to respond were scrambled without time to do that. We know this because those are the words of the ACTUAL pilots who responded. The responding pilots were flying unarmed jets and had planned to literally crash into the passenger plane. At some point during the day, they could have gotten armed planes in the sky, but it was well after the attacks were over.

I see... based on your understanding, was this inability usual or unusual? More specifically, what is your assessment as to why our air defense lacked the capability to protect airspace on 9/11?
 
Wrong again buddy.



Not even half agree with you.

Man that must be embarrassing to make such a bold claim, that was so easily debunked.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polls_about_9/11_conspiracy_theories

Wikipedia. Nice research. Can't even be bothered to go to the actual source and pretend like you did real research. Do you even know how many people were asked in that wonderful graph? No.

<BC1>

None of that even has to do with the idea that planes weren't actually used in the attacks by the way. I know using your brain is hard when you're so dumb.

I see... based on your understanding, was this inability usual or unusual? More specifically, what is your assessment as to why our air defense lacked the capability to protect airspace on 9/11?

Well until the 9/11 attacks the possibility of needing armed jets for internal issues was too low of a threat to spend the funds and energy on this. For the time pre 9/11 times, it seems pretty reasonable. In today's world, obviously you'll have armed jets up in a quick fashion. The general consensus is that although we have a good air defense system, it wasn't built to defend against hijacked passenger planes originating from inside the country. It was built to protect the United States from Russian/Chinese planes flying from their airspace and trying to violate ours. We're talking about being out in the ocean on ships. So radar defense and jets that would be equipped and prepared to get in the air with munitions quickly to prevent an attack. Internally, our airspace was managed by the FAA and information was passed to their military counterparts. From there, they had to be passed to the actual air wing and then to the pilots themselves. By the time the military was even notified, there wasn't enough time to get armed jets prepped and into the sky. Until then, having armed jets flying over American soil was a huge risk with little reward. It was a much bigger threat to have a jet accidentally drop a bomb or missile on a school/neighborhood than actually need it to shoot down hostile aircraft. There's a lot of reasons why planes weren't just sitting by with weapons loaded and pilots waiting a room to jump into them to save the day, but that's a general idea of it. It wasn't unusual considering the history and circumstances they were dealing with prior to the attacks.
 
You guys are arguing over a point that I don't think has huge bearing on the potential CT. I am sure all Boeing planes can be remotely operated so there is no need to shoot down any plane as you could just crash it.

Certainly remote operation makes way more sense than inexperienced pilots flying passenger jets into the trade centers and especially the flight pattern of the pentagon jet. Boeing makes remote guidance system for drones so I am sure their planes must have similar software. This is what people think happened to MH370.
 
Wikipedia. Nice research. Can't even be bothered to go to the actual source and pretend like you did real research. Do you even know how many people were asked in that wonderful graph? No.

<BC1>

None of that even has to do with the idea that planes weren't actually used in the attacks by the way. I know using your brain is hard when you're so dumb.



Well until the 9/11 attacks the possibility of needing armed jets for internal issues was too low of a threat to spend the funds and energy on this. For the time pre 9/11 times, it seems pretty reasonable. In today's world, obviously you'll have armed jets up in a quick fashion. The general consensus is that although we have a good air defense system, it wasn't built to defend against hijacked passenger planes originating from inside the country. It was built to protect the United States from Russian/Chinese planes flying from their airspace and trying to violate ours. We're talking about being out in the ocean on ships. So radar defense and jets that would be equipped and prepared to get in the air with munitions quickly to prevent an attack. Internally, our airspace was managed by the FAA and information was passed to their military counterparts. From there, they had to be passed to the actual air wing and then to the pilots themselves. By the time the military was even notified, there wasn't enough time to get armed jets prepped and into the sky. Until then, having armed jets flying over American soil was a huge risk with little reward. It was a much bigger threat to have a jet accidentally drop a bomb or missile on a school/neighborhood than actually need it to shoot down hostile aircraft. There's a lot of reasons why planes weren't just sitting by with weapons loaded and pilots waiting a room to jump into them to save the day, but that's a general idea of it. It wasn't unusual considering the history and circumstances they were dealing with prior to the attacks.


Maybe these polls will work for you then.

Of course probably not with a official 9-11 conspiracy theory truther.

  1. Allen, JoAnne (September 10, 2008). "No consensus on who was behind Sept 11: global poll". Reuters. Retrieved September 26, 2010.
  2. ^ a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q "International Poll: No Consensus On Who Was Behind 9/11". WorldPublicOpinion.org. University of Maryland, College Park: Program on International Policy Attitudes. September 10, 2008. Retrieved July 7, 2011.
  3. ^ Klein, Kent (September 10, 2008). "Global Poll Shows Doubt About al-Qaida Role in 9/11 Attacks". VOA News. Washington, D.C.: Voice of America. Archived from the original on September 11, 2008. Retrieved April 21,2013.
  4. ^ "Half of New Yorkers Believe US Leaders Had Foreknowledge of Impending 9-11 Attacks and 'Consciously Failed' To Act; 66% Call For New Probe of Unanswered Questions by Congress or New York's Attorney General, New Zogby International Poll Reveals". Zogby International. August 30, 2004. Archived from the original on December 17, 2008.
  5. ^ "A word about our poll of American thinking toward the 9/11 terrorist attacks". Zogby International. May 24, 2006. Archived from the original on November 19, 2010.
  6. ^ "Zogby Poll: 51% of Americans Want Congress to Probe Bush/Cheney Regarding 9/11 Attacks; Over 30% Seek Immediate Impeachment". Zogby International. September 6, 2007. Archived from the original on September 18, 2008. Retrieved April 22,2013.
  7. ^ "NEWSWEEK Poll: What America Knows". Newsweek. June 23, 2007. Archived from the original on August 30, 2007. Retrieved April 22, 2013. Poll conducted by Princeton Survey Research Associates International.
  8. ^ "The New York Times/CBS News Poll: April 23–27, 2004" (PDF). The New York Times. April 29, 2004. Retrieved July 7,2011.
  9. ^ "Americans Question Bush on 9/11 Intelligence". Angus Reid Global Monitor. October 14, 2006. Archived from the original on September 18, 2007. Retrieved July 7, 2011.
  10. ^ "CBS/NY Times Poll: The War in Iraq"(PDF). CBS News. September 9, 2007. Retrieved April 22, 2013. Poll conducted between September 4–8, 2007.
  11. ^ Hargrove, Thomas; Stempel, III, Guido H. (August 1, 2006). "Third of Americans suspect 9-11 government conspiracy". ScrippsNews. Cincinnati: E. W. Scripps Company. Scripps Howard News Service. Archived from the original on August 5, 2006. Retrieved April 22, 2013.
  12. ^ Torchia, Christopher (October 2, 2010). "9/11 conspiracy theories rife in Muslim world". The Washington Post. Washington, D.C. Associated Press. Retrieved April 21, 2013.
  13. ^ a b c d Stempel, Carl; Hargrove, Thomas; Stempel, III, Guido H. (June 2007). "Media Use, Social Structure, and Belief in 9/11 Conspiracy Theories". Journalism & Mass Communication Quarterly. Association for Education in Journalism and Mass Communication. 84 (2): 353–372. doi:10.1177/107769900708400210. OCLC 4815071474.
  14. ^ "newsPolls.org: Question/VAR 27". newsPolls.org. Ohio University: Scripps Survey Research Center. 2006. Archived from the original on August 6, 2006. Retrieved April 23, 2013. Part of survey "SHOH33," completed on July 6, 2006.
  15. ^ "newsPolls.org: Question/VAR 29". newsPolls.org. Ohio University: Scripps Survey Research Center. 2006. Archived from the original on October 3, 2006. Retrieved April 23, 2013. Part of survey "SHOH33," completed on July 6, 2006.
  16. ^ "newsPolls.org: Question/VAR 28". newsPolls.org. Ohio University: Scripps Survey Research Center. 2006. Archived from the original on August 6, 2006. Retrieved April 23, 2013. Part of survey "SHOH33," completed on July 6, 2006.
  17. ^ "Selected results from a Scripps poll about conspiracies". Scripps Howard News Service. Cincinnati: E. W. Scripps Company. November 23, 2007. Archived from the original on November 28, 2007. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  18. ^ "22% Believe Bush Knew About 9/11 Attacks in Advance". Asbury Park, New Jersey: Rasmussen Reports. May 4, 2007. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  19. ^ "Bush: No Saddam Links To 9/11". CBS News. CBS Interactive; Associated Press. September 10, 2009.
  20. ^ Montero, Douglas; Soltis, Andy (May 23, 2007). "Time Bombs in our Midst". New York Post. Archived from the originalon May 25, 2007. Retrieved November 27, 2015.
  21. ^ "Obama's approval steady" (PDF). Raleigh, North Carolina: Public Policy Polling. September 23, 2009. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  22. ^ "Most Americans Reject 9/11 Conspiracy Theories". Angus Reid Global Monitor. March 21, 2010. Archived from the original on June 12, 2012. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  23. ^ "One in 5 Canadians sees 9/11 as U.S. plot - poll". AlertNet. London: Thomson Reuters Foundation. Reuters. September 11, 2006. Archived from the original on September 28, 2006. Retrieved April 23,2013.
  24. ^ Humphreys, Adrian (October 20, 2008). "9/11 skeptics resurface". National Post. Toronto. p. 2. Retrieved April 23,2013.
  25. ^ Bittner, Jochen (July 24, 2003). "Umfrage: Blackbox Weißes Haus". Zeit Online (in German). Hamburg: Zeitverlag Gerd Bucerius. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  26. ^ Hermann, Anja (December 22, 2010). "Exklusiv-Umfrage des Wissensmagazins Welt der Wunder: Wem glauben die Deutschen noch?" (Press release) (in German). Hamburg: Bauer Media Group. Retrieved April 23, 2013.
  27. ^ "RussiaToday: Poll results". Russia Today. Moscow: RIA Novosti. September 11, 2008. Archived from the original on September 16, 2008. Retrieved April 23,2013.
  28. ^ Ahlin, David; Lidell, Lina (September 29, 2009). "Allmänheten om 9 11" (PDF). Novus Opinion (in Swedish). Stockholm: Novus Group International. Archived from the original (PDF) on November 27, 2009. "Novus Opinion för TV4 Kalla Fakta."
  29. ^ "9/11 conspiracy theories". BBC News. London: BBC. August 29, 2011.
  30. ^ a b c d e f g h i j k Kull, Steven; Ramsay, Clay; Weber, Stephen; et al. (February 25, 2009). "Public Opinion in the Islamic World on Terrorism, al Qaeda, and US Policies" (PDF). WorldPublicOpinion.org. University of Maryland, College Park: Program on International Policy Attitudes. p. 26. Retrieved May 30, 2009.
  31. ^ "Only 2 out of 5 Indians believe al Qaeda is responsible for the 9/11 attacks—and that's far higher than in Pakistan where only 1 out of 20 do, finds a new poll by CNN-IBN". WorldPublicOpinion.org. University of Maryland, College Park: Program on International Policy Attitudes. August 20, 2007. Retrieved July 7, 2011.
 
Maybe these polls will work for you then.


Did you just quote the Wikipedia references page like I literally just said you didn't even bother doing? I can tell someone has never done a real research project in their life.
 
can jet fuel melt french textbooks?

cos it sure as shit can't melt steel beams

<Gordonhat>
 
i saw that picture of pentagon how wide is pentagon and where is the wreckage. and looks like it was hit on the bottom again and no wreckage crazy how all the floors are intaced. i came from bosnia in my neighborhood jet plane hit the building head on and did nothing other then fire no floors collapsed no inside of building destroyed just a fire and all the wrechage was still there did not waporised
 
i saw that picture of pentagon how wide is pentagon and where is the wreckage. and looks like it was hit on the bottom again and no wreckage crazy how all the floors are intaced. i came from bosnia in my neighborhood jet plane hit the building head on and did nothing other then fire no floors collapsed no inside of building destroyed just a fire and all the wrechage was still there did not waporised

Was that plane a fully loaded 757? Was it traveling a max speed with no effort to slow it's acceleration because the pilot was on a suicide mission? Did that plane have the same fuel capacity as a 757 intentionally chosen because it was on an longer flight, would have the most fuel, and produce the largest damage upon impact?

Was there anything remotely similar regarding these incidents, other than they both involved aircraft? And do they teach physics in Bosnia?

These are the hard questions we need to ask ourselves.
 
Missiles don't just appear on a fighter. They are loaded by ordinance techs and removed from armories that have a chain of people with no obligation to hold this information back that a missile was on a responding jet and the jet came back without one.
Yep. Especially if we're talking pre-9/11.

Missiles in particular are rarely "on alert" so to speak. It's not very safe to store them in such a way as they are always on hard standby. "Scrambling" (oh boy is that term used loosely) missiles onto jets, just on the bomb dump side of operations for stateside squadrons who are not already on alert, requires the order to come down, coordination with base law enforcement, the crew chosen and assembled and possibly recalled depending on what is happening that day, lots of vehicles and equipment to be readied, and time for the operation to occur. And more factors, of course.

This is going to take, at absolute bust-your-ass-pace, even from a pretty high level of coincidental pre-existing alertness, a half hour. Minimum. Under the best case where everything is working perfectly with missiles ready to go in the bomb dump and spotless communication. Which never, ever happens unless you're already spun up to full tempo.

If you happen to already have missiles on racks in a hangar next to a jet (and it's likely a few places maintain this sort of readiness, though again that's today in a post-9/11 world), then 15 minutes would be a reasonable estimate for the fastest you could get in the air, and that's again a rosy scenario.

For their part, the actual arming process (putting the fucker on the jet) is pretty goddamn quick when it needs to be.
 
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