Fighters bench press

[Cygnus-X]

There's a reason its called the bodybuilding style bench kid, it puts more time under tension under the targeted muscle groups chest and tris.
The powerlifting style is great for strength however even with all the calories and everything equal, a bodybuilding program will put on more mass, because its style of high volume low rest intervals is better for mass than low volume high rest intervals.
Learn something kid.

Well, it's a bit different between natural and roided guys of both ilks. Natural bodybuilders would probably be wiser to have a bit of an arch, although not excessive and do high volume with appropriate rest.

 

[shortlefthook]

The arch allows you to use more weight. One of the reasons why one arches. Or did you forget that?

And it is safer. Or did you forget that?

The arch allows you to use more weight, so you are going to get stronger faster. And the weight eventually has to increase to force muscular adaptation. But I suppose in your twisted little world, you are going to keep using the same weight forever. Of course, you said you were done, which was just another lie.

Would you like to be full of shit about anything else?

Nobody's denying the benefits of the arch, however there is apparent benefits to the flat back bench aswell.
Which you just can't seem to admit, its better for mass point blank, you wont be able to get strength as fast because the arch allows for more effeincy of movment and involves the legs, obviously going to bring the bench uo faster, nobodys denying that.
Point is if one guy benches 315 flat back and the other 315 arch.back the flat back guy is stronger, teach him the same technique and he will bench 330.
Why? Because the flat back bencher is used to more rom and less assist from his legs.

 

[Red Ninja]

 

[shortlefthook]

Well, it's a bit different between natural and roided guys of both ilks. Natural bodybuilders would probably be wiser to have a bit of an arch, although not excessive and do high volume with appropriate rest.

I agree 100% slight arch is okay

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

Flat back bench is always going to build more functional muscle than an arch if you are comparing using the same weight. The person who does flat back will always be actually stronger than the one arching. It absolutely is apparent in building muscle; people always see more results in biceps and back as well when they force themselves to avoid arching. Have to agree with almost everything left hook says, however, I do have really long arms and for me it's just not an option to bring the bar chest high or use a wide grip without stressing elbows and shoulders. Results are always better when I force a greater range of motion. The muscle you build at the low point are essential for stabilizing.

It's all relative. You'll be able to handle more weight with a proper, arched strength and conditioning form. But it simply comes down to biomechanics. The flat back bench press is simply not a healthy movement (This is if you actually do full ROM and touch your chest)... What we see with people who bench press with a flat back is, they compensate by only going half way down.. To avoid the bottom ROM of the bench press which puts a lot of pressure on the pecs and shoulders... So essentially, most flat back bench pressers do exactly the same ROM as those with the proper S&C arch.

Also more benefits to the arch besides just injury prevention and health... Relating to the movement biomechanics... Better loading on the triceps and chest.. The arch forces the chest to stick out and the shoulders to retract back.

Honestly, I've never met a flat back bench pressers who could bench 300+, UNLESS they were clearly on heinous amounts of anabolics and half repping in a constant tension bodybuilder manner.

ALSO: Don't confuse close grip bench pressing with regular bench pressing. Due to the nature of close grip, elbowed tucked in, it's much easier to tolerate a lack of an arch. If you can bench heavy with a flat back fine, you are most likely benching with a relatively close grip, and or not touching your chest.

Also will say this in relation to why flat back benching sucks. Due to the shoulders not being pulled back, you won't be able to hit the chest/get tension on it, so you have to compensate by widening your grip and flaring out the elbows. This provides a whole new dilemma.. Essentially shoulder impingement occurs... Think of that side delt raise top posiion, now put heavy bench press loads on that... Not smart.

When you break it down, it's a no brainer why I recommend to always been on the safe side with an arch when benching heavy... And as I said... It's hands down better to have a more excessive arch, than to have a flat back/no arch.

 

[legkicktko]

Pettis' flyweight bro benched 275 which is pretty darn impressive.

Especially in the fat fuck gym generation. Everyone at the gym looks like butterbean but thinks they are hot shit because they can squat and deadlift their bodyweight

 

[Bjjpitbull8]

Oh god, another person that does not even know the meaning of the term functional.

Studies have been posted about muscle activation.

Futhermore, the benefit of an arch is that it allows you to use more weight so your analogy as to which is better for building muscle is a false analogy.

The thing about you is you assume that because a person doesn't agree with you on a topic they know nothing. Having debates with people like you are useless and exhausting. Besides left hook has absolutely owned you in every point you have tried to make or disparage his knowledge. Some people don't know when to quit.

 

[Eater of Souls]

Nobody's denying the benefits of the arch, however there is apparent benefits to the flat back bench aswell.

Of course, you get greater ROM.

Which you just can't seem to admit, its better for mass point blank, you wont be able to get strength as fast because the arch allows for more effeincy of movment and involves the legs, obviously going to bring the bench uo faster, nobodys denying that.

The article you posted denied that. Remember the article?

Point is if one guy benches 315 flat back and the other 315 arch.back the flat back guy is stronger, teach him the same technique and he will bench 330.

Incorrect. You are ignoring individual leverages. Many powerlifters use little to no arch. I even posted one. Some people get one hell of an arch. I do not. Honestly, trying to arch makes my bench worse. But you automatically and incorrectly assume that everyone is going to bench more this way, which is just not true.

[Why? Because the flat back bencher is used to more rom and less assist from his legs.

Not necessarily, which is another one of your many problems.

And you ignore that more weight over time will also yield more results. It is not just a factor of ROM or time under tension. It is called progressive resistance training for a reason, and that is because to make progress, the resistance must progress as well. Also, to master a proper arch takes a long time. Guess which is easier, going from flat to mastering the arch or going from an arched position and lowering your arch? Even you should be able to figure this one out. Particularly given that powerlifters pause the bar on the chest, sometimes for as long as three seconds. First couple of workouts may produce additional DOMS secondary to a slightly greater stretch of the pectoralis major, but that is about it.

Go watch some actual powerlifting videos, since it is clear you know nothing about it. Better yet, go to a gym. If you need to find one, I can do that for you. If you are simply scared of strong guys, well, no one can help you.

 

[Eater of Souls]

Wrong, the bench includes the biceps for stabilization, the lats during the negative of a bench press.
So we have delts, biceps, chest, back.. That's every upperbody muscle group smashed into one compound excercise.
Powerlifting bench press bullshit aside,.when you keep your ass flat on the bench its a great measure of upperbody strength.

I agree 100% slight arch is okay

Oh look. Emphasis mine, to point out that you are still full of shit.

 

[Eater of Souls]

The thing about you is you assume that because a person doesn't agree with you on a topic they know nothing. Having debates with people like you are useless and exhausting. Besides left hook has absolutely owned you in every point you have tried to make or disparage his knowledge. Some people don't know when to quit.

No, but when you use terms in a blatantly incorrect manner, well . . .

And no, he did not. He does not know the proper use of the word functional, the definition of the word strength, could not differentiate between strength and ROM, was wrong about safety and muscular activation, and I have quoted him on more than one occasion contradicting himself.

So if that is "owned" well, I guess that word does not mean what I think it does.

The guy has blatantly lied, for fucks sake, and I quoted it. And he has changed his position, then denied that he made any other points, even after I quoted that too.

Seriously? WTF?

If you find my refusal to put up with bullshit exhausting, then people can quit spewing shit, and the problem solves itself.

 

[ICEibuPROfen]

Lifting weights is a great supplement to plyometrics, cardio, and skill training to maximize performance. Lifting weights alone is not going to make you a good fighter but it would help a skillful fighter be tougher to deal with.

This

 

[Bjjpitbull8]

It's all relative. You'll be able to handle more weight with a proper, arched strength and conditioning form. But it simply comes down to biomechanics. The flat back bench press is simply not a healthy movement (This is if you actually do full ROM and touch your chest)... What we see with people who bench press with a flat back is, they compensate by only going half way down.. To avoid the bottom ROM of the bench press which puts a lot of pressure on the pecs and shoulders... So essentially, most flat back bench pressers do exactly the same ROM as those with the proper S&C arch.

Also more benefits to the arch besides just injury prevention and health... Relating to the movement biomechanics... Better loading on the triceps and chest.. The arch forces the chest to stick out and the shoulders to retract back.

Honestly, I've never met a flat back bench pressers who could bench 300+, UNLESS they were clearly on heinous amounts of anabolics and half repping in a constant tension bodybuilder manner.

ALSO: Don't confuse close grip bench pressing with regular bench pressing. Due to the nature of close grip, elbowed tucked in, it's much easier to tolerate a lack of an arch. If you can bench heavy with a flat back fine, you are most likely benching with a relatively close grip, and or not touching your chest.

Also will say this in relation to why flat back benching sucks. Due to the shoulders not being pulled back, you won't be able to hit the chest/get tension on it, so you have to compensate by widening your grip and flaring out the elbows. This provides a whole new dilemma.. Essentially shoulder impingement occurs... Think of that side delt raise top posiion, now put heavy bench press loads on that... Not smart.

When you break it down, it's a no brainer why I recommend to always been on the safe side with an arch when benching heavy... And as I said... It's hands down better to have a more excessive arch, than to have a flat back/no arch.

I respectively disagree. I do the full range of motion to sternum and in a very controlled but not overly slow motion make sure to not cheat or use momentum at all in order to work the most muscle possible. I hear where you are coming from but I see lots of injuries on guys arching too much. And if you do the proper form yes you won't succeed in doing as much weight but you will get more out of the motion for all around strength. You are totally entitled to you opinion.

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

Powerlifting bench will make you stronger, bodybuilding bench will gain more mass as it actually focuses on the chest and tris specifically without using leg drive or a arch to decrease to rom.
So you're wrong again kid.
And i meant targeted muscles, you use more chest in a bb press than a powerlifting press this is fact.

This isn't entirely true.

The bodybuilding flat back bench press technique does achieve great chest activation, but it does so at the expense of poor mechanics that will no doubt lead to injury. The shoulders can't retract to allow the chest to stick out, so you have to compensate by widening your grip and flaring the elbows... This presents serious biomechanical problems that will no doubt lead to injury (Pec tears/shoulder impingement)... So the flat back bencher deals with this by not benching down to their chest and stop half way... The ROM really isn't that much different in the end. (NOTE: this is from my observations of really any flat back bencher that was lifting anything remotely heavy)

Your leg drive/rom decrease is a null point, because the loads are relative to the technique (this was your point earlier)...

Even with all those clear risks, it really isn't worth it because there are EASY ways to get similar and SUPERIOR chest activation with the arched technique.

Enter the Paused bench press..

Go look at any top raw bench presser.. They have to pause in competition.. They have huge chests... If you have tried pause reps, you'll know how epic they are for chest activation.

So really, there's no logical reason to bench with a flat back

 

[TheAgent025]

Eater of souls you are such and expert and this life long lifter lets see a pic , because your coming off as an asshole no it all . Simple can the girl arching her back lay flat and still bench 225 ? No she can't

 

[Eater of Souls]

So you're saying to no keep your ass flat on the bench? Are you stupid kid? Thats even a rule in powerlifting dumbass moron.

And more name calling. No, your ass must be in contact, not flat. Look it up. Wrong again.

Um yea generally you take a guy with zero powerlifting bench technique and you show him.some tricks his bench.will go up, meaning hess stronger than someone whos already using those tricks to bench the same weight.

Generally, not always. Which is part of the problem that you overlook.

Hey kid lets do a challenge i bet i bench more than you with no arch, i will go to the gym tomorrow bench 255 for dubs and i will hold a index card that says short left hook while holding a plastic spoon after im done, lets do it pussy boy

I told you I rarely bench. I practice weightlifting. I guess you missed that.

And more name calling, grow up.

 

[Sherm]

You fucks are still going at it?

Bench is a great exercise for building mass and strength. It's not overrated, it's just that the squat, the deadlift, the OHP, and some other movements are underrated. Most powerlifters will tell you that the deadlift is best measure of overall strength because it incorporates more muscle groups and is harder to bullshit your way through by shortening the range of motion.

But fighters don't really need powerlifting-style 1 rep max strength. Woodley is one of the most jacked guys in the sport, with a huge back, ass, and legs, yet he posted a video of himself deadlifting something like 500 pounds, which is not even impressive for a guy his size. If he wanted to, he could probably get that above 600, but it's simply not necessary.

 

[Eater of Souls]

Eater of souls you are such and expert and this life long lifter lets see a pic , because your coming off as an asshole no it all . Simple can the girl arching her back lay flat and still bench 225 ? No she can't

I have no idea what she can bench.

And once again, I practice weightlifting, not powerlifting. Really, all someone has to do is support their points. I would not have been an asshole had I not got insulted time and time again. But I guess that is okay.

I supported my statements with studies and real-world examples, including videos, and one guy keeps changing his stance and never supports anything but continues to insult me, yet I am the asshole?

Really?

 

[Eater of Souls]

This isn't entirely true.

The bodybuilding flat back bench press technique does achieve great chest activation, but it does so at the expense of poor mechanics that will no doubt lead to injury. The shoulders can't retract to allow the chest to stick out, so you have to compensate by widening your grip and flaring the elbows... This presents serious biomechanical problems that will no doubt lead to injury (Pec tears/shoulder impingement)... So the flat back bencher deals with this by not benching down to their chest and stop half way... The ROM really isn't that much different in the end. (NOTE: this is from my observations of really any flat back bencher that was lifting anything remotely heavy)

Right.

Your leg drive/rom decrease is a null point, because the loads are relative to the technique (this was your point earlier)...

Yep, why the leg drive comments were meaningless.

Even with all those clear risks, it really isn't worth it because there are EASY ways to get similar and SUPERIOR chest activation with the arched technique.

The little I know about bodybuidling, most of them do not go heavy on the bench press, but do a lot of other exercises for development. Here I could easily be wrong.

Enter the Paused bench press..

Go look at any top raw bench presser.. They have to pause in competition.. They have huge chests... If you have tried pause reps, you'll know how epic they are for chest activation.

So really, there's no logical reason to bench with a flat back

Thank you.

 

[STEVEN SEAGOLD]

I respectively disagree. I do the full range of motion to sternum and in a very controlled but not overly slow motion make sure to not cheat or use momentum at all in order to work the most muscle possible. I hear where you are coming from but I see lots of injuries on guys arching too much. And if you do the proper form yes you won't succeed in doing as much weight but you will get more out of the motion for all around strength. You are totally entitled to you opinion.

So you bench with a flat back and apparently bring the bar down to your sternum? Either your doing a close grip bench press/have a close grip width which is really not what this thread has been about, or you are lying and you do have some sort of arch. Either that or your bench mechanics must be terrible and your shoulders must be hurting, that is if you are pressing some decent weight.

This isn't a discussion about using momentum to cheat. That has nothing to do with this discussion. Raw powerlifters infact have to pause their benchpresses at the bottom in competition, hence this is how they train.

I don't think you understand the discussion here.

Plus, there is a study that completely disproves your anecdotal claim of drastic arches causing more injuries (This is what you are implying no?)

Infact the opposite is true. Flat bench pressing has much higher rates of injury

 

[shortlefthook]

And more name calling. No, your ass must be in contact, not flat. Look it up. Wrong again.



Generally, not always. Which is part of the problem that you overlook.



I told you I rarely bench. I practice weightlifting. I guess you missed that.

And more name calling, grow up.

You rarely bench you act like you are such a expert you backing down from a challenge? I know.you have a camera.on your phone i will strict bench 255 for 2 i want to see all these things.you're talking about come into real world, this is why i hate arguing with people like you, you dont have the real world experience its all what you read online.
You went saying i dont go to the gym to backing out of a lifting contest.

This isn't entirely true.

The bodybuilding flat back bench press technique does achieve great chest activation, but it does so at the expense of poor mechanics that will no doubt lead to injury. The shoulders can't retract to allow the chest to stick out, so you have to compensate by widening your grip and flaring the elbows... This presents serious biomechanical problems that will no doubt lead to injury (Pec tears/shoulder impingement)... So the flat back bencher deals with this by not benching down to their chest and stop half way... The ROM really isn't that much different in the end. (NOTE: this is from my observations of really any flat back bencher that was lifting anything remotely heavy)

Your leg drive/rom decrease is a null point, because the loads are relative to the technique (this was your point earlier)...

Even with all those clear risks, it really isn't worth it because there are EASY ways to get similar and SUPERIOR chest activation with the arched technique.

Enter the Paused bench press..

Go look at any top raw bench presser.. They have to pause in competition.. They have huge chests... If you have tried pause reps, you'll know how epic they are for chest activation.

So really, there's no logical reason to bench with a flat back

I think body type plays a big factor in this, whats a wide bench for you might be narrow to someone else.
Personally my bench is shoulder width and my elbows are very tucked, i also drop the bar at about my sternum, i have tried the arch and i felt less solid on the bench.
I have no doubt that its a technique issue and if i could bench like a powerlifter that my bech would go up, but thats my point.