Fedor Is Still Better Than Jones

[AresDesideratus]

You're the idiot who thinks having 10 inches of reach over your opponent is not an advantage. And his advantage over Gustaffson was his reach, that's still an advantage even though it wasn't as significant as his other fights. Height doesn't really mean as much, reach is more important. 2 inches is still an advantage, its simple Kindergarten Math that you have yet to grasp. It was the one fight he had where his tools weren't there to completely bail him out and he had the hell beaten out of him to the point where he could barely walk. Jon Jones cannot dominate unless its against smaller opponents. Then has has to fight like a cheap ass and eye poke every fight.

And to prove himself as the greatest fighter of all time, yes, he does need to fight heavyweights at his natural weight. BJ Penn is more respected, because he didn't duck certain fighters or weight classes. He would fight the best of the best win or lose. People like you are just nut hugging on Jones and want to see him protected as a light heavyweight and continue beating guys who dwarf him. Then claim he's the GOAT. I actually want to see good fights, you still haven't provided me any evidence that there are any good fights at 205 remaining for him which was 3 posts ago. If he wants to be the greatest (which he has stated) then he needs to go up and fight the best. He will probably make a ton of money too, and that's the way to prove he's the best of all time.

Please, most fighters at heavyweight weigh in the 230 to 240 range. Yeah like Mark Hunts 30 pounds of extra body fat, what a huge advantage that must be! Oh so those guys have physical advantages of weight over him? But when its convenient for your argument those same physical advantages we speak of are not relevant. Claiming that the fight against them is not fair because they weight more than Jones! Boo hoo Jones would actually have to fight someone who has an advantage over him. What a shame. I feel sorry for him! Big fucking deal, you didn't hear about Fedor ducking heavyweights who were massively larger than him. Or Penn fighting guys like GSP and Machida. Hahaha what a fool. He could fairly easily weigh 230 to 240. I think he walks around at 220. 10-20 pounds is nothing. It would not be difficult at all. I think he would be successful at HW. But this is all speculation because its pretty obvious he doesn't want to fight at that weight class.

The Gustafsson rematch isn't a good fight ? The only reason there are hardly any good fights for Jones at the moment is because he's destroyed every contender, including huge guys like Gustafsson, Teixeira, and former top 5 heavy weight DC.

OK, "destroyed" is the wrong word for those fights because the were all pretty competitive, and the Gustafsson fight was very very competitive. But he still beat them all.

And you assume that height means less than reach, but this is just a false idea that you've made up in order to hate Jones more. Jones isn't even a good boxer, his main advantage is his leg reach and that has mostly to do with height, he had like 4 inches of reach over Gustafsson, quit acting like a couple inches of reach is some huge advantage. It IS and advantage, but no more of an advantage that Gustafsson's extra inch of height, lmao. Fuck.

Of course Jones' reach is an advantage, no one with a working brain is going to deny that, it's an advantage the same way that DC's huge muscles and punching power are an advantage, the same way Gustafsson's size and reach are an advantage, the same way Glovers strength and power are an advantage.

Jones fights weighing 220 at the MOST, why the FUCK would he move to a 265 pound to division ? That's ludicrous, just because SOME heavyweights weigh 230 pounds doesn't mean they should, look at Pat Barry, the dude got destroyed more often than not. Cain and JDS both weigh 240 more or less not 230

Jones shouldn't just pack on a bunch of extra fat or muscle just to fight heavy weights that's fucking retarded like holy shit man.

Just because some guys weigh 240 and fight at 265 doesn't mean Jones should and it doesn't mean he has to in order to prove himself the greatest. If other fighters want to cut to 205 and try him then they can no one is stopping them, fighters weigh what they weigh, Jones doesn't have a weight advantage over everyone he fights, just a reach advantage, and he would still have that reach advantage at heavy weight.

That's all IF he could pack on muscle. It's easy for you to say "oh 10 or 20 pounds isn't much he could gain the weight" but what the fuck do you know ? How's he gonna gain the weight ? By pigging out and lifting dumb bells ? Lose his cardio, get in worse shape, all to fight at 265 to please some idiotic fans like you ? Yeah sounds like a real good plan haha. Jesus Christ man

Think about it man.

It's a weight class, not a reach class. Anyone who can weigh 205 can go and fight Jones if they are good enough.

Like no shit he's a huge guy, what do you expect do you expect the best fighter in each weight class to be undersized like Fedor was ?

Different fighters have different advantages you need to learn to deal with it without blaming it on a reach advantage and saying Jones should fight at heavy weight because he has long arms like are you really this dense ?

And guys like Fedor had their own advantages as well despite being undersized, things like speed and cardio against so called big lumbering heavyweights was a huge advantage, if Jones were to move up he would no doubt have those advantages as well but what you fail to realize is there is NO REASON for jones to move up.

He's not scared, but look at the success he is having at 205, why on earth would he jeopardize that ? It's a huge risk to try and gain weight and move up to heavyweight, there is absolutely no reason for it other than to appease bloodthirsty haters like you.

 

[2COATS]

MMA "fans" are garbage.

The only sport where guys from more than 5 years ago get disrespected so regularly.

You will never see boxing fans talk this way about the legendary fighters of the past.

Spit on all these UFC geeks.

 

[91 seconds]

Sherdog just had a poll about this. Most people already know Fedor is still king.

 

[Tug]

Key word is legacy. Fedors is sealed in the hearts of his fans, whereas all the sherchads will ditch jones for the next hype train soon as he gets a loss

 

[thx113x]

The Gustafsson rematch isn't a good fight ? The only reason there are hardly any good fights for Jones at the moment is because he's destroyed every contender, including huge guys like Gustafsson, Teixeira, and former top 5 heavy weight DC.

OK, "destroyed" is the wrong word for those fights because the were all pretty competitive, and the Gustafsson fight was very very competitive. But he still beat them all.

And you assume that height means less than reach, but this is just a false idea that you've made up in order to hate Jones more. Jones isn't even a good boxer, his main advantage is his leg reach and that has mostly to do with height, he had like 4 inches of reach over Gustafsson, quit acting like a couple inches of reach is some huge advantage. It IS and advantage, but no more of an advantage that Gustafsson's extra inch of height, lmao. Fuck.

Of course Jones' reach is an advantage, no one with a working brain is going to deny that, it's an advantage the same way that DC's huge muscles and punching power are an advantage, the same way Gustafsson's size and reach are an advantage, the same way Glovers strength and power are an advantage.

Jones fights weighing 220 at the MOST, why the FUCK would he move to a 265 pound to division ? That's ludicrous, just because SOME heavyweights weigh 230 pounds doesn't mean they should, look at Pat Barry, the dude got destroyed more often than not. Cain and JDS both weigh 240 more or less not 230

Jones shouldn't just pack on a bunch of extra fat or muscle just to fight heavy weights that's fucking retarded like holy shit man.

Just because some guys weigh 240 and fight at 265 doesn't mean Jones should and it doesn't mean he has to in order to prove himself the greatest. If other fighters want to cut to 205 and try him then they can no one is stopping them, fighters weigh what they weigh, Jones doesn't have a weight advantage over everyone he fights, just a reach advantage, and he would still have that reach advantage at heavy weight.

That's all IF he could pack on muscle. It's easy for you to say "oh 10 or 20 pounds isn't much he could gain the weight" but what the fuck do you know ? How's he gonna gain the weight ? By pigging out and lifting dumb bells ? Lose his cardio, get in worse shape, all to fight at 265 to please some idiotic fans like you ? Yeah sounds like a real good plan haha. Jesus Christ man

Think about it man.

It's a weight class, not a reach class. Anyone who can weigh 205 can go and fight Jones if they are good enough.

Like no shit he's a huge guy, what do you expect do you expect the best fighter in each weight class to be undersized like Fedor was ?

Different fighters have different advantages you need to learn to deal with it without blaming it on a reach advantage and saying Jones should fight at heavy weight because he has long arms like are you really this dense ?

And guys like Fedor had their own advantages as well despite being undersized, things like speed and cardio against so called big lumbering heavyweights was a huge advantage, if Jones were to move up he would no doubt have those advantages as well but what you fail to realize is there is NO REASON for jones to move up.

He's not scared, but look at the success he is having at 205, why on earth would he jeopardize that ? It's a huge risk to try and gain weight and move up to heavyweight, there is absolutely no reason for it other than to appease bloodthirsty haters like you.

Did you not read my first post when I responded to you? I said "What fight besides Gustafsson is a compelling match-up at 205 for Jones?". Do you just purposely make shit up in your mind to boost the points you're trying to make or are you just brain damaged? If Jones beats Gustaffson there is no good matches for him to be at that division anymore. And don't give me Davis or Johnson. He will have his way with both of them, no one really cares about those fights.

No its not a false idea to hate anyore more. Its a fact. Not too hard to figure out. I never said it was a huge advantage. But it is an advantage. There you go again, adding little pieces into my points which I never even said. How does that extra inch of height help exactly? What benefit does it serve? Nothing really. When he was finally matched up against someone had had a similar size he was beaten down. Imagine what real heavyweights would do to him? He was nearly arm barred by Belfort who is a middlweight. Fought Sonnen and Machida who are essentially middlweights. Beating guys who are significantly smaller than him, many of whom are past their athletic primes. Not really all that impressive enough to be considered the GOAT.

Pat Barry was a one dimensional kickboxer who was the shortest guy in the entire weight class. What a piss poor comparison.

Velasquez - 241 lbs
JDS - 242 lbs
Brown - 243 lbs
Miocic - 243 lbs
Werdum - 232 lbs
Noguiera - 238 lbs
Arlovski - 240 lbs
Cormier- 238 lbs

Many fighters fighting around 230-240. And I guarantee you that Jones training and diet are tailored to fight at 205 and to lose weight. He can easily make changes to his diet and training and have a similar weight as those guys (many of whom are just carrying extra body fat). Overeem weighed 205 at one point in his career and went up to 265, and his body type was pretty much exactly the same as Jones is now. If he was able to do that, and still weighs 250 pounds to this day then there's no reason Jones can't go to 230-240. His brothers are 2 NFL behemoths that weight 250+ each. He probably wouldn't even need to cheat and take illegal drugs to do it.

Hey Idiot. I never said he should put on body fat. Try reading you fool. Bringing up more bullshit out of thin air. You said heavyweights would weight 265, and I proved you wrong. I responded by saying the guys who weighed that much had extra body fat which didn't even pose any real benefit. You proceeded to act as if Jon Jones would be some poor innocent victim at HW because of all that extra weight then proceed to defend his other physical advantages. He weighs 220 (probably more but we'll go with it for the sake of argument) and is already cutting down 15 pounds to 205. Adding an extra 10-20 pounds wouldn't be that difficult. He already has a significant reach and height advantage over most heavyweights. Then you have guys who are 265 like Hunt and Nelson which is essentially just body fat. Weight that really has no benefit at all to being a fighter.

No I don't expect the greatest fighter in the world to be undersized. But when he beats almost everyone who has a significantly smaller reach than him, in a lower weight class, and people start calling him the GOAT I take offense to that. His physical advantages are so significantly more than almost anyone else. If he wants to be the greatest he has to fight at heavyweight. Otherwise he's just a guy who made a career on beating people who are smaller than him. Great? Yes. Greatest? No chance in hell. In fact, at this point I'd rank Fedor, GSP, Aldo, and Silva all above him.

No reason to move up? I beg to differ. Money for one. Secondly, the fact that the 205 pound division has no real great match-ups for him anymore besides Gustaffson. Thirdly, to cement his legacy as the greatest of all time. So there you go, plenty of reasons to move up to heavyweight. Looks like you're wrong again. But keep defending him as if he's some poor victim.

And how do you know he will sacrifice his speed and cardio? Those guys I mentioned above have decent speed and cardio for heavyweights. Those sacrifices (if they do in fact exist) would also give him extra strength and power. You're acting as if this extra 10-20 pounds is going to just completely ruin him and turn him into some slow fighter with no cardio. His body is perfectly suited for heavyweight, but hey keep making excuses for him. You know he's scared to fight heavyweights. He's not going to do it, that's why he's not the best. Because he's more worried about protecting his legacy then fighting the best fighters in the world. Its not like cutting weight is exactly a healthy practice for the human body. His body would most likely be healthier if he didn't have to condition his body and cut weight to 205.

Try responding to the actual points I've made next time, and reading instead of fabricating more bull shit.

 

[PRIDExxFC]

Jones was never greater than Fedor. Fedor has had the better career so far, but at this point Jones is still very young and has a lot more to accomplish.

 

[Naramie]

Coked up Jon Jones could probably beat Batman with tons of prep time.

 

[opie]

how is this even a question?

of course fedor is better than jones

 

[ib313]

Why read the words when Fedor just destroys the things the words are about

 

[Tarbender]

Lol maybe Jon Jones KOd youre create-a-fighter Fedor on EA UFC but get real kiddo.

There is not a single fighter regardless of weight class whom Fedor could not beat in his prime.

PRIME FEDOR:

- Legit one shot KO power? CHECK

- Second to none recovery time? CHECK

- Cat-like reflexes? CHECK

- Best Fight IQ in the fight game to date? CHECK

- Dangerous Grappling from every position? CHECK


Face it, Bones would get outclassed in every aspect of the fight. Its would just be a matter of picking his poison.

Agree with most, but Fight IQ was probably his weakness......especially in his loses. Gotta give him a big CHECK for Killer Instinct which Jones hasn't had in years!

 

[riitzni]

These arguments......... like children arguing over which super hero would win in a fight. Quire frankly, most of you are not intelligent enough to know what would make one fighter better than another.

Let's talk about the competition available. Let's talk about the competition of that competition available. Let's discuss the concepts of non-primary era vs new era. Let's discuss weightcutting. Let's discuss cage vs ring. Let's discuss 10mins vs 5mins.

In the end it's Islam vs Christianity. Call it Jones. Call it Fedor. Keep your opinion. The reason you're still arguing about it is that you're not smart enough to understand the real point.

lol, Miles comes in, drops an A bomb and leaves. People pick up the pieces of their shattered lives and move on with the argument.

 

[Average]

Are we talking Coke Bones or Rehab Bones. On of those two is a legit challenge to the GOAT status

 

[Toxxus]

I feel like prime vs. prime that Jones would give Fedor a lot of trouble due to the reach differential. Especially if the fight takes place in a cage where Jones has more room to avoid getting cornered by Fedor.

It's not unreasonable to believe that Jones could win this fight more often than not.

I say that as someone who likes Fedor way more than Jon Jones.

 

[Rockford Tyson]

Jones > Fedor.
Jones would also beat Fedor in a fight.

I doubt very much Jones could stop Fedor from taking him down. He ragdolled Semmy Shilt who was 260 lbs and even lankier than Jones as he were nothing. And, on the ground, Jones would face the most vicious ground-and-pound ever that makes Jones' elbows seem like nothing in comparison.

Make no mistake about it: Fedor in his prime was no joke: hardest puncher ever in MMA, most versatile takedown artist ever seen in any weight class, and an absolute finisher on the ground with vicious GNP and basic but good submissions. AND he was a heavyweight.

Jones wouldn't be able to stop Fedor from taking him down, and even if he could, he wouldn't be able to beat Fedor in a standup war due to Fedor's explosiveness and the constant threat of the takedown. Jones's low kicks are extremely risky against a Judo/sambo master like Fedor, and using them would result in Jones being taken down. Without them, Fedor would just move forward the whole time until he caught Jones or win by points.

Jon Jones would not stand a snow ball's chance in hell against a prime Fedor. Fedor was stronger, more powerful, had more versatile takedowns and a more proven submission game.

Fedor in his prime was an absolutely ungodly fighter. Jack Slack, who is extremely critical of even the most elite fighters, has stated that Fedor was the closest thing to a "flawless" fighter, blending striking with takedowns better than anyone, and the best overall ground game, mixing striking with submissions on the gorund like no other.

 

[AresDesideratus]

A bunch of nonsense

Basically your points are as follows:

1. There are no more interesting Jones fights at 205 outside of the Gustafsson rematch.

2. Jones has a reach advantage.

SO FUCKING WHAT ?

The first point about interesting fights is actually just your dumb, short-sighted opinion. By the time the rematch with Gustafsson happens there will be another clear cut contender for Jones to face - or Jones will have lost his belt and have to fight his way back up the ranks.

The point about Jones having no more interesting fights "outside of the Gustafsson rematch" (DULY NOTED THIS TIME) is basically you just crying because Jones is too good and you desperately want to watch him lose or at least struggle.

Every Jones fight is interesting because we have no idea just how far he is going to go or if he will mess up.

And you second point is Jones has a reach advantage so he should move to heavy weight. Literally. That's your point. According to you, arm reach is more of an advantage than actual height, so therefore Jones should fight at heavy weight.

Forget about Cyrille Diabate, forget about Weidman (who is very big for his weight class), forget about Renan Barao who freaking passed out trying to make weight.

Jones needs to move up to heavy weight, because he has long arms and you don't like him and want to watch him lose.

Whatever man. I'm done arguing this bullshit with you. Open your eyes.

 

[StedGoof]

I'm more interested in HOW OLD YOU ARE and WHO YOU THINK IS GOAT...

I'm convinced if Fedor is archival footage and a herb deaned champion of course someone active today is GOAT... If you saw the fights in and around when they happened and you don't think Fedor is GOAT I'd like to know more about what you saw and and what you see.

 

[weed]

 

[StedGoof]

Basically your points are as follows:

1. There are no more interesting Jones fights at 205 outside of the Gustafsson rematch.

2. Jones has a reach advantage.

SO FUCKING WHAT ?

The first point about interesting fights is actually just your dumb, short-sighted opinion. By the time the rematch with Gustafsson happens there will be another clear cut contender for Jones to face - or Jones will have lost his belt and have to fight his way back up the ranks.

The point about Jones having no more interesting fights "outside of the Gustafsson rematch" (DULY NOTED THIS TIME) is basically you just crying because Jones is too good and you desperately want to watch him lose or at least struggle.

Every Jones fight is interesting because we have no idea just how far he is going to go or if he will mess up.

And you second point is Jones has a reach advantage so he should move to heavy weight. Literally. That's your point. According to you, arm reach is more of an advantage than actual height, so therefore Jones should fight at heavy weight.

Forget about Cyrille Diabate, forget about Weidman (who is very big for his weight class), forget about Renan Barao who freaking passed out trying to make weight.

Jones needs to move up to heavy weight, because he has long arms and you don't like him and want to watch him lose.

Whatever man. I'm done arguing this bullshit with you. Open your eyes.

Trust me man it's really exciting watching your guy fight guys "There is no way" he can beat... and he beats them... He stops them.

I feel sorry for you Jones Pownz because how thrilling can it be to beat guys you are supposed to beat? After all you are supposed to beat them. You have a foot reach on someone and ya beat him, you couldn't stop them, who is gonna say "that was a great victory" ?

 

[StedGoof]

I feel like prime vs. prime that Jones would give Fedor a lot of trouble due to the reach differential. Especially if the fight takes place in a cage where Jones has more room to avoid getting cornered by Fedor.

It's not unreasonable to believe that Jones could win this fight more often than not.

I say that as someone who likes Fedor way more than Jon Jones.

You didn't watch Fedor fights when they happened tho did you?

 

[MitMcl]

You didn't watch Fedor fights when they happened tho did you?

Are you saying it's unreasonable to think Jones would stand a decent chance against prime Fedor? I watched Fedor's fights when they happened and I think this match would be a toss up.