FBI raids office of Michael Cohen, personal attorney to Donald Trump

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waiguoren said:
As I have written to you repeatedly, I am aware that Mueller's mandate covers any matters that arise out of the investigation into the Trump campaign's alleged links to Russia. I was the first person in this thread to paste Mueller's mandate, many pages before @Shoeless Rye.

Repeating a non-response doesn't advance the discussion further.

The issue that you have yet to address is: why would Mueller have come across Cohen's payment to Trump's alleged mistress in the course of investigating the Trump campaign for president's alleged links to the Russian government? As far as I know: Cohen was not a lawyer for the Trump campaign for president nor was he a member of that campaign in any capacity. Also, he was not an agent of the Russian government.

You might argue that Cohen was Trump's long-time attorney and that Cohen's links to Trump are numerous and well-documented. I would counter that we must have a precise definition of "the campaign of President Donald Trump", otherwise the phrase "any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals
associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump" could be construed to cover almost anybody.
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Mueller is looking for quid pro quo proof. Cohen was part of that transition period Ukraine "peace deal". Also Mueller has gone back as far as 2014 that we know of as part of Trump's "campaign" and Cohen and Felix Sater (who is likely fully flipped) were working on Trump Tower Moscow business deals for Trump up to even after he won the nomination and even days before the election. They look at Cohen's finances to see if he was making any money, or laundering money and find that he paid out $130K to Daniels, but then shown that he was repaid $130K from somebody other than Trump personally ie Trump Foundation or Trump Campaign.
 
waiguoren said:
No, I don't see. Tell me how ridiculous. Super ridiculous? Mega ridiculous? Dare I say...SAVAGE ridiculous?



No, I did not write that. The current investigation should continue or---as Alan Dershowitz has proposed---a nonpartisan commission should be established in its stead. Even if we were to amend the current system while the Mueller investigation is ongoing, I would advocate that the changes only apply going forward.

All of this said, it must be noted that Trump does have the legal authority to fire Mueller. He would probably face political consequences. All of this is more evidence supporting Dershowitz's view.



That's exactly my argument. It's also Dershowitz's argument.



I completely agree. However, I will quibble with your final statement. We don't know the different directions Mueller has done in any detail because he's conducting a secretive investigation.
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How would a non-partisan investigation be possible? Where would you find anyone who doesn't have an opinion? Trump has taken divisiveness to the maximum level possible. He hasn't left any room for a middle ground.
 
ralphc1 said:
How would a non-partisan investigation be possible? Where would you find anyone who doesn't have an opinion? Trump has taken divisiveness to the maximum level possible. He hasn't left any room for a middle ground.
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He seems to want Congress to run it. The same Congress that has run interference for Trump constantly under Ryan, McConnell and Nunes and done absolutely nothing to hold Trump to account or protect the investigation so far.

Basically, he wants a sham.
 
waiguoren said:
As I have written to you repeatedly, I am aware that Mueller's mandate covers any matters that arise out of the investigation into the Trump campaign's alleged links to Russia. I was the first person in this thread to paste Mueller's mandate, many pages before @Shoeless Rye.

Repeating a non-response doesn't advance the discussion further.

The issue that you have yet to address is: why would Mueller have come across Cohen's payment to Trump's alleged mistress in the course of investigating the Trump campaign for president's alleged links to the Russian government? As far as I know: Cohen was not a lawyer for the Trump campaign for president nor was he a member of that campaign in any capacity. Also, he was not an agent of the Russian government.

You might argue that Cohen was Trump's long-time attorney and that Cohen's links to Trump are numerous and well-documented. I would counter that we must have a precise definition of "the campaign of President Donald Trump", otherwise the phrase "any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals
associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump" could be construed to cover almost anybody.
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As I mentioned prior, Trump had Cohen involved with nearly all of his dealings. Including a deal involving a payment between Trump and a Ukrainian businessman during his candidacy. That's just what we know about, but every other report we have on their relationship is that he was as close and involved in Trumps dealings as anyone that isn't related to Trump.

I think you're being a bit obtuse in not seeing how Cohen, who the president involves in everything, could come up in Mueller's side of the investigation.
 
waiguoren said:
There are legitimate questions about why Mueller had information on Cohen. Mueller's job is to investigate ties between the Trump campaign and the Russian government. As far as I can tell, Cohen is not working for the Russian government and was not a member of the Trump campaign. This could be an example of "mission creep" on Mueller's part.
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Have you been on a different planet?
But he’s much more than that. For nearly a decade, Cohen worked as a high-level executive in the Trump Organization. In that time, he pursued business deals in the former Soviet Union, and even tried to get a Trump Tower Moscow built during the presidential campaign.

Cohen’s also a wealthy investor in his own right, with taxi medallion holdings and an eyebrow-raising real estate portfolio. He has family and past financial ties to Ukrainian businesses. He’s the national deputy finance chair of the Republican National Committee. And since last year, he’s been legally representing Trump personally.
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https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/4/11/17218010/michael-cohen-trump-mueller-explained

Definite ties to Trump, Russia and the campaign.
 
Phisher said:
Kind of like realizing that you can entrap a sitting President into perjuring himself in front of a grand jury by ambushing him with questions about the intern that he was banging when you were originally tasked with investigating some two bit land deal that said President and his wife lost money on.

Actually, no. It's like that at all. All of this stuff is directly tied to the investigation of the campaign, which is what Mueller was tasked with doing in the first place.
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I actually saw that reported last night, but don't understand why Mueller would have to hand that off. He didn't hand off Manaford.

Regardless, I stand corrected.
 
SMillard said:
I actually don't rely on just one news source, in fact I tend to read at least two or three a day and normally at least one of those will be an international publication. I will flip between CNN, BBC and Fox on my satellite radio and normally do the same on television. MSNBC isn't one I'm too fond of since I really don't care for most of the hosts, although some of the panelists are decent and I've definitely got a thing for Heidi Przyblyla
heidi-przybyla.jpg
.

You're right, there is nothing illegal about DND (Dungeons and Dragons?) I think you meant NDA or non-disclosure agreements. There is nothing illegal about them, I've signed a few in my time and also gone into some that I knew were not enforceable and been successful in disputing them. They aren't a catch all, and they have limits to their powers. I've also dealt in contract disputes and one thing I can tell you is an attorney can't just "I think I'll take care of this action without conferring with or getting the consent of the client". If Trump had just said "yeah, I made a mistake and asked Mr. Cohen to take care of it" those that hated him would still hate him, those that support him would still support him. The problem is the two of them have left it in a suspect area where it could be considered a campaign contribution violation, there are other issues. You are focusing on the wrong things, lying to the press isn't "illegal" lying to a banking institution about a loan is, lying or concealing a campaign contribution is. The fact that there is issues such as how Cohen has been "compensated" raises concerns of money laundering.

Truth is Stormy hired a very good and press savvy attorney and he has manipulated Cohen into the corner he is in. Avenati has succeeded in putting himself into the rotation of legal consultants for a bunch of news networks. Hell I'm sure Trump is wishing he'd hired the guy, wouldn't be surprised if he didn't try to. Wouldn't be the first time he hired an attorney that kicked the snot out of his legal team.
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I was definitely wrong according to reports out last night.

Sorry for the MSNBC jab, but they've been going on about Trump's statement for a couple days.
 
Whippy McGee said:
It was a hand off from the Mueller team. Which makes this a Fishing Expedition just as I stated. It was approved by Rosenstein. You can't talk shit, but you apparently don't know fuckall.
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SOP for LEO to refer potential crimes to appropriate jurisdictions

Obviously you don't know shit . Go back to the heavies grown ups are talking
 
TheComebackKid said:
When wicked reigns the righteous weep
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Don't you constantly post about "Liberal Tears"?

In case you can't out it together. You say Liberal Cry because of Trump and now you quote out of the big book of goofy shit stating the righteous weep when the wicked reign. See a little conflict there???
 
PainIsLIfe said:
I was definitely wrong according to reports out last night.

Sorry for the MSNBC jab, but they've been going on about Trump's statement for a couple days.
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it's all good as long as you don't bad mouth Heidi, I almost feel bad watching her debate people in a very intelligent manner while I'm sitting there thinking "god I'd love to tongue punch your fart box"
 
News is reporting that Cohen and his wife own several New York city Taxi-cab Medallions. But they have failed to pay the city around $54,000 from the income generated by the Taxis.

Hope Mueller flips Cohen or reels him over the coal for anything and everything. Typical millionaire trying to ripoff the public.
 
MicroBrew said:
News is reporting that Cohen and his wife own several New York city Taxi-cab Medallions. But they have failed to pay the city around $54,000 from the income generated by the Taxis.

Hope Mueller flips Cohen or reels him over the coal for anything and everything. Typical millionaire trying to ripoff the public.
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Failure to pay NYC. That's significant because that's potentially AG Schneiderman territory . Meaning you can't get a tRUmp pardon
 
Bobby 3 Sticks said:
Failure to pay NYC. That's significant because that's potentially AG Schneiderman territory . Meaning you can't get a tRUmp pardon
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When Da Kush gets charged it will be New York. Like father like son.
 
MicroBrew said:
News is reporting that Cohen and his wife own several New York city Taxi-cab Medallions. But they have failed to pay the city around $54,000 from the income generated by the Taxis.

Hope Mueller flips Cohen or reels him over the coal for anything and everything. Typical millionaire trying to ripoff the public.
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Medallions were once valued as much as $1M per - but Uber tanked a lot of their value.

Supposedly he flipped a couple houses for 500% profit in two years - buying them for $2M and selling them for $10M as well. But if he's so cash poor in that he needed a line of credit off his house to pay Daniels - makes me believe he's laundering the money for somebody else and doesn't have access to any of it.
 
NYT is saying the Cohen raid is also looking at the Access Hollywood tape. Seems weird - what would Cohen have to do with that - unless he tried to buy it and bury it. Manafort passed it off so it can't be Russia related - even if the timing was interesting given the Podesta leaks happened the day after the "grab'em by the pussy" vid was released.

Maybe there was other footage that Cohen got suppressed - does Mark Burnett own the NDA's or maybe Cohen and Trump own them from The Apprentice live mics and the like.
 
MikeMcMann said:
Neither you nor any sherdogger (myself included) can speak to how Mueller came across that evidence.
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Which is the whole point. You don't know, and I don't know, but if you have regard for civil liberties and limited government, it's something to keep our eyes out for.

MikeMcMann said:
That you want us to guess so we can then debate it is silly.
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That never happened.
 
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